Iron Fans

[magicfist]

Does anybody know the legality of carrying an iron fan? Would it be considered a weapon by law?

[WongFeHung]

Hmmm, probably not-that is until it's used. You can carry a wooden fan instead. In Choy Li Fut and other Siu Lum styles, the fan is actually used predominantly in the closed position to hit vital points on the body,-actually, anywhere you hit with the butt end of a fan would be excruciating. You can open it for screening your attacker's vision, and the ribs can be raked across the eyes, but they need not be iron.

[PangQuan]

looking for a good fighting fan to purchse.

sry but i dont want one of the 4 that are offered on the internet. i have thought about just buying one of the basic metal fighting fans and taking the pattern of the fabric to a seamstriss and having a sleeve made up.

BUT, if someone has a link to a good palce to purchase fans that are not super cheesy then I would be most thank full for your assistance.

[GreenCloudCLF]

What is it you don't like the ones being offered? The design, material or quality? Then maybe I can point ya somewhere.

[GLW]

Decent metal fans are hard to come by.

The cheesy ones with the dragons or Kung Fu written on them are easy to find. However, they are too short for anyone taller than around 5'8"

Nelson Chin, Fist Sports in Houston, carries some decent bamboo fans. While they are NOT metal ones, they ARE of sufficient weight and strength to be a weapon...as much as any bamboo or rattan short rod.

He carries them in two sizes - small - about 12 inches long and large - 14 or 15 inches long.

A good rule of thumb would be a length that is from your elbow to not less than your wrist and not over your fingertip length.

His come in several colors - red, green, black I believe...no writing or pictures on them. Also, they have the cloth part extending past the fan spines - making them look a bit better. He carries right handed and left handed fans.

They are not too expensive...I think under $20.

Metal ones... You would probably have to get the fan, rip off the cloth, get some silk or some strong nylon (funny, but a heavy shiny silk tends to be stronger than man made fabrics...if you go to light in the silk or nylon, rayon...the weight of the metal fan would tend to make the fabric tear when doing a fast open.)

The hard part of this is the attaching process. The glue has to adhere to the metal and to the fabric...but NOT bleed through the fabric and definitely NOT be sticky between one spine and the next. I have had some from China that did just that. After 2 years they STILL would stick together and be impossible to open with a flick of the hand....good for a garbage can but not much else.

Also, if you do it yourself, you can also make a right and left handed fan (the order of the spines is opposite and you have to glue them a bit differently.

[GreenCloudCLF]

Nelson Chin Beijing Imports (http://www.buykungfu.com)

Not really a fan of those fans (no pun intended...but if I type that I know the pun is there so maybe it is an intended pun??? Oh whatever.)

The do come in the 3 colors and lefty or righty, but I dislike the extended material...makes em look....mmm...too soft and feminine for my taste. I think Wing Lam has some different metal fans

Wing Lam Ent. (http://www.wle.com)

And have you tried Martial Arts Mart? They have a couple also.

[PangQuan]

And have you tried Martial Arts Mart? They have a couple also.

lol


-------

thanks you guys. im at work, so ill look into it when i get home.

[GLW]

Actually, in many of the northern fan forms, the extended material is SUPPOSED to be there. It is kind of like the tassel or flag....not much use beyond the visual effect....but then again, this IS Martial ART....

The history of the fan was that they were MALE things (strangely enough). At least on the larger ones. At one time, men would give a fan as a gift to another man - typically with calligraphy on it and such. It was a gift of respect (yep...seems a bit strange to me too...but this is from Helen Wu - grandaughter of Wang Ziping).

But, if you REALLY don't like the extra material...a pair of scissors and 5 minutes will fix that...and you can then put the liquid hem stuff on it to keep it from fraying. After that, the fan is simply your old run of the mill bamboo fan. BUT...they DO come in lengths and no one else has the longer ones...at least not yet. ALso, the other ones I have seen all have the goofy drawings, Kung Fu, or other such nonsense. If I want anything on my fan, it is calligraphy from my teacher.....

[IronFist]

Gosh I'm nice. Here they are at that buykungfu.com place.

12" fan (http://buykungfu.com/store/item/cltb/WuShu/Fan_12.html)
15" fan (http://buykungfu.com/store/item/clte/WuShu/Fan_15.html)

[GeneChing]

iron dragon fans (http://www.martialartsmart.net/45-07b.html)
iron phoenix fans (http://www.martialartsmart.net/45-08b.html)
bamboo fan (http://www.martialartsmart.net/4509b.html)
ninja fan (http://www.martialartsmart.net/16-06.html)
NOTE: the iron fans are just called that - I think it's from the Chinese translation. They're actually steel. ;)

[GLW]

Gene,

the metal ones are OK...but two problems -

The images on the fan...can't they just have a plain old colored fan with nothing on it?

Second, they are too short. The longest is 13 inches.

At 6'1", I feel and look a bit strange working with such a short fan. I need the 15 inch length...and then the extra material that a previous post decried also adds to the impression of length making the fan seem bigger. Without the extra material, I would actually prefer an 18" fan. Not bloody likely that I will find one...but the 12" - 13" fans are just too small for me.

I have been looking for a decent metal fan of sufficient length for more than 5 years. Making one myself is not something I really want to do.

[PangQuan]

thanks for the links everyone.


its those dragon and phoenix fans that i dont want. those are the only metal ones i could find. (sry just kinda cheesy to me) they are ok, but im not really looking for a multi production fan. Its going to be a gift so I would like to be able to personalize it a bit.

im kinda liking the one at wing lam, but really I wish i could get a blank red one....see i want our schools moto put on it.

GWL do you have a link to the nelson chin fans you are talking about?

[Golden Tiger]

On a trip to China a few years back, some of our people were able to find some really nice fans that might be similar to what you are looking for. Instead of being made of the thin and flimsy metal, these were made out of a heavier steel, the ends pointed (not sharp though) and then covered with silk. If I can find a pic of mine, I will post it. I will also try to see who made them.

BM2, do you have one of the ones I am talking about?

[GreenCloudCLF]

PQ,

The fans were linked twice already in this thread

Beijing Imports=NelsonChin

And Iron Fist linked straight to em

[PangQuan]

GC:
oh, har!!

the ones with the extra fabric. gotcha, thanks.

im not very good at math, so sometimes i cant put 2 and 2 together.

so far those are looking pretty good.

GT: that would be awsome if you could find the distributor of those. especially if they have an online site to view.

[GLW]

Well, it took me a while to get Nelson convinced to carry the fans at all. Then getting him to carry two sizes was a discussion.

He is very open to trying to meet the needs of his customer base.

I suspect the appeal of a fan just like his bamboo ones - same lengths available - but no figures or writing on them - is limited.

It is my understanding that the factories he uses in China WILL do special requests but there is a minimum order type of thing - and I think he just doesn't have a projected volume on a metal one to make it affordable for him or us.

I know that a few years back, NO ONE carried the Yang style Taiji Saber. In fact, very few people had actually seen one. I had one but it was too short, poorly balanced, and of questionable "combat steel".

I showed it to Nelson and then told him about folks like Yang Zhenduo doing seminars now on Yang Taijidao and - well it took him about 18 months, but he now carries the weapon... I bought one from his first shipment.

All our martial arts vendors should aim at that level of responsiveness

[Golden Tiger]

Here is a pic of the fan. Still haven't been able to track down the maker of it.

[Zhong]

Would Fan be used only against a knife attack, (or mass attack), as it seems it would be ineffective against sword, staff, spear or one of the section-whips?
Why are they larger than 'normal' fans?

[SPJ]

fans are not really weapons.

but they can be armed with poisonous needles hidden.

so when they are opened, the needles would fly out.

it is then considered as hidden weapon or an qi.

some may also be armed with poisonous powder.

a closed fan may be used to guide some long weapon away from you.

that is about it.

--

unless of course, you have an iron fan.

--

:D

[Zhong]

I did mean the iron fan.

I think even a normal fan is a weapon: -
I have a small (normal sized) wooden fan that I've been playing with and it seems that when closed it is capable of warding off a knife attack if the knofe is an ordinary one. Even open it could do if you were skilled enough at ward offs and time it well enough.
As for defensive against larger weapons? I'm not so sure. If attacked by a sword, staff or spear you'd be better off running.

Now if you had a telescopic fan...

[golden arhat]

are you being f@cking serious?

stop posting things which are self explanatory

you honestly needed to ask someone that qustion ?


why are some fans bigger than others??? maybe because people like to stay cooler in the hot weather

there that didnt take much thought did it now


yes a fan is likely to be innefective against a sword thast why people were fighting wars with swords and not fans

it seems to me that a pen is innefective against an AK what do you think????:rolleyes:

[GLW]

As for the use...depends on the fan.

Personally, I prefer a fan that is about the length from the middle of my hand to my elbow....about 17" fan.

Typically, you can't get a metal fan in anything beyond a 12" length so I don't bother...Now, if I had the money, I would have a titanium one made....the spins titanium and the body silk. Silk is pretty strong and titanium is strong and very light....great combination.

But, I have played with an old traditional metal fan. it had a small pike that could be flipped out from the bottom of the fan. The pike or dagger portion folded back into the bottom of the fan with the regular spines when not flipped out. It gave you a 3 or 4 inch dagger at the base of the fan. The spines were also pointy and sharp. So, you could do jabbing/stabbing with either end of the weapon. The one I played with was poorly made and much the worse for age...bad balance and sticky to open.

Techniques, close the fan and it is a small staff or short rod. You can block and hit with it...and it would hurt. Open, it hides intention. There ARE some techniques with the fan open but I have always found them interesting to look at and artful...but not very practical for use.

With the fan open AND with spikey ends on the spines, you DO have a slashing poking area...so cuts and slashes ARE possible. You have to know how to hold the fan securely to do these, though.

With the pike flipped out, you have a stabbing area at the base of the blade as well.

But, given a choice, I would rather have a different weapon... However, if you were walking down the street with a metal fan, you might look a bit froo froo but no one would think you had a weapon. :)

[Becca]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vwZ5FQEUFg&feature=related

ok, had to steel this link fro DR's robot thread. Robots with fans. :D

[GeneChing]

A New Series from our Publisher! READ EDC: Iron Fans (https://www.kungfumagazine.com/ezine/article.php?article=1703) by Gene Ching

http://www.kungfumagazine.com//admin/site_images/KungfuMagazine/images/ezine/9026_Iron-Fans_Lead.jpg

Iron-Fans (https://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?1062-Iron-Fans)
Question-Better-to-carry-mace-or-a-knife (https://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?67650-Question-Better-to-carry-mace-or-a-knife)

[YinOrYan]

A New Series from our Publisher! READ EDC: Iron Fans (https://www.kungfumagazine.com/ezine/article.php?article=1703) by Gene Ching


The fan is my favorite. I can swap it into my dagger and sword forms. The real iron fans are like a dozen swords that can work like scissors so you could even lose some of your OWN fingers using it, and the clackin' sounds like gunshots! You should research the legend of a fan master that took-on multiple Samurai at once and snapped all their swords. I think its probably based on a real event because I've seen something written about an estimate of the cost of all the swords that were destroyed, which was enormous...

[mickey]

Greetings,

There are pre-1949 designs that have the fan with spiked ribs. I consider it the equivalent of a blackjack. It was no joke. Additionally, the weapon had some heft to it, requiring strong wrist, forearm and finger strength: offering very good training for those involved in the grappling disciplines.

The ones out on the market really suck. They are not even a pale shadow of their former glory.


mickey