Ask yourself ....WHY?

[cha kuen]

I visited a kung fu teacher's class today for the 2nd time.

In my first visit he told me that couldnt' take me in as a student. The 2nd time I went there to buy something.... and I sat down to watch again.

He came and sat next to me and asked me

" Why do you have so much interest to learn?"



Of course , we all can say

" i want to learn how to fight.
I like kung fu, i love the art, i want to get good.
I see kung fu as a way of life. I want self defense skills.

Kung fu means a lot more to me then martial arts, it's alot about personal development and yada yada

BUT this simple question is one of the hardest questions you may face.

Can you sit down quietly and HONESTLY ask yourself... WHY , why do you really want to learn kung fu?

and dont give me some half as5 response like some white guy on a SHAOLIN TEMPLE documentary that said in mandarin, " I want to make my body strong"

CRAP, when i saw that, I said to myself, " oh no.. ah mAN~ , what an idiot"

[Alpha Dog]

now what?

[cha kuen]

why do you want to leran kung fu?

[Alpha Dog]

Lien shen ti qiang zhuang ba! ;)

In all seriousness, everyone has their own personal reasons, do they need to be offered up for judgement in this arena?

[apoweyn]

it's a good question, i think. very hard to answer.

i'll be the first to admit that when i started training, about 17 years ago, it was because i wanted to be a badarse. i was 13 years old, and i wanted desperately to believe in the mythology of it all.

now, at 30, i can safely say that my motivations have changed over and over again. for a while, i thought i was that badarse. for a while, i trained because i perceived some responsibility (some sort of sir galahad complex), and now, i enjoy it. partially, it's habit. and partially it's fun.

i wonder whether the sifu would find that answer acceptable.


stuart b.

[cha kuen]

My real reason is...that I have trained and mess around in other styles for 3-4 years

I thought I was getting somewhere because I learne fast. I knew applications and counters. I know how to spot weaknesses.

Then I met my current teacher. He said " You are empty"

I disagreed for the longest time...until my first class when I stood in that horrible wc stance!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I shook like the earthquake.....I looked like i was having a seizure...

he said, "You have to earn it...and no one can take it from you."

So when teh teacher asked me, "Why doyou wantto learn, "

I was gonna say " Because i wasted enough time and now that I have found the right way, I want to get good, and start now. with you. "

BUt of course, yeah long story.

[apoweyn]

sounds like a good answer to me. if it's what you feel, then it's the right answer, to my mind.

[Nat from UK]

Not Very Deep answer but ..

because I really enjoy it - the benefits that martial arts give me are just a bonus. I would train if there was no benefit to me at all - because I enjoy it1

Nat from UK

[Ish]

The reason i started was partly moral support for my brothers first class as a teacher and because he always went on about how great it was so i wanted to try. I enjoyed it very much and kept going back. The main reason i keep going is because im constantly improving and i don't want to loose what i have already learnt

[jon]

My sigung would not admit my sifu untill he stopped saying he wanted to learn better fighting skills and said this instead.

"I want to build my charactor and lead a long happy healthy life."

The good fighting skills should be a given, if you have done your homework you should already be aware your teacher has skill and the system is solid(talking about underground classes here).
My sigung then allowed him training after showing up at the door for six months strait and being refused EVERY time. Sounds rediculous and it kind of is but my sifu was desperate to learn from this teacher and he was VERY traditional in his ways. My sifu is the only non Chinese student he ever took to my knowledge.
Or there is always I saw 'Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon' and heard you guys can fly?

[jon]

Why i personaly study kung fu...
If i where shipwrecked on a desert island with nothing, i could still practice kung fu.
Its the one of the few things i can think of that you only need your body and i small amount of personal space for. Its also one of the only things i know that so directly effects your outside life. Im not bad at massage for no reason other than my kung fu study. Im also cool as ice under preasure and proved it many times in my last two jobs. Kung Fu has given me a different way of viewing EVERYTHING. I even watch the way a drink spills over from a whole different perspective than i used to. The way waves crash on the beach, or the sunlight makes different shapes on different surfaces at different times of the day. Its all kung fu to me, seeing the effect and the how and why. Kung Fu teaches me to look at things in a very particular way, its not esoteric infact its quite scientific. I look at the whole picture now not just the image but the thickness of the paint and the way the artist has expressed there passion. I know this sounds odd but its the only way i can think to discribe such things honestly.
Who would have thought there was so much to simply putting your hands in different positions.
I waste hours just working on different power generation mechanics and ways of moving. To me this represents my real love of the art. I love the things it teaches me to do with my body, i like the personal control it gives.

[Nichiren]

Is this a troll post?

I disagreed for the longest time...until my first class when I stood in that horrible wc stance!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[red5angel]

I think alot of us have the same things to say really. We all do it for similar reasons, health, fighting, philosophy or what have you. I know for myself, what you listed is why I study! that and wailing on guitars and flipping out all the time has always been a dream of mine :D

[cha kuen]

Jon,

Is the feeling you have similar too.....

Before when you walk you would look at who you're running into, who's next to you. Now when you walk you look ahead and forward. You look above at the buildings to see the people looking out the windows, the smaller things in life. You look at the people on the side doing the everyday things, reading newspapers.

You are calm. When you see a bunch of cars honking their horns at each other, you don't get mad you just think
"they have a lot to learn..."


Before when someone pushes their way through a line you get mad. Now because of kung fu and being spiritual, you let the guy pass and think "*sigh* No need to push..if you're late you're late. relax!"

Is this the type of feeling you're getting?

It's almost like an old guy who sits at the corner and looks at you as if he knows something that you don't.

[Merryprankster]

Cha-Kuen,

I REALLY like your answer--but I'm having trouble with the thought process that led to it... he said you were empty but you didn't realize it until you stood in a WC stance for awhile?

That's just getting used to it. If he'd handled you like a child... or if his students did... THAT I could understand. But it takes a bit to get used to any unfamiliar movement-including stances.

And as for the character development/long life stuff... I guess I just feel being an adult who takes responsibility for his actions is good enough for me, MA or not. In fact, if I had an instructor that tried to "develop my character," I'd leave so fast, the door would fall off its hinges. Somebody else thinking they can "improve your character," is the height of hubris. Hard work is hard work--you either have it in you to do it, whether it be love of the game, sheer grit, or being shamed into it (the weakest way) or you don't, and no amount of "character building," is going to change that.

Ugh... the very thought of having my "character developed," makes me cringe.

[Alpha Dog]

I too would run from anyone who suggested his role as Shi Fu was to help me be a better person.

But I have never met anyone who made me such an offer so there you go.

[Merryprankster]

Alpha--

Glad to know I'm not the only crazy guy in MA :D

Off to boxing (western)....

Cheers!

[Alpha Dog]

if you ask the plumber to fix your sink and he makes a bee-line for your tv (that's television, not transvestite), don't you have a right to say, "Whoa, Nelly!!"?

I think so.

[cha kuen]

Why I'm empty.

When he made me stand in that stance...i shook like a seizure and emotion came over me.

I was looking in the mirror at myself , shaking, sweating like I was in a desert. I was thinking to myself, "I want the truth. I want to be good. I want to get on the right path. Everything I have learned before doesn't matter. I'm starting now, here, on the right road."

Later I touched hands with my sifu and he slapped me around like a dirty rag doll.

He said, " All your force comes from your upperbody. I don't care what you have learned before, if you shake that much in your stance, then you don't have a foundation. You cannot get power from the ground. When I hit you, it is not my arms hitting you, it's the power from my legs...from the ground. "

Cantonese " Lik - chong- day - hei"
translation " power-comes- ground-rise"

power comes from the ground.

Also when I met a chen teacher I asked to touch his hands. And he said, " Right when I touch your hands...all your tension goes straight to your shoulder. If you learn from me, I will teach you how to relax so that you have no tension."

THis is basically the same thing my sifu told me. WHen you're loose and relaxed, then your energy will go to the ground.

Heaven - Man - Earth.

check out www.sojournpast.com GOOD READING, good stuff.

Your center, gravity, physics.

Ever seen that Jet Li movie " tai chi master?"

How Jet Li gets insane and hits that toy with all the sand on the bottom?

THat is the same principle in kung fu. Except that sand bottom is your tan tien. All your energy SINKS and you are hard to be moved.

I only konw of this by theory and I cannot do it physically... YET.

I am on the right track. I see the truth.

[cha kuen]

About the personal development.

No one can teach you to develop as a person. He /she can only give you pointers.

Much like when mom says, " go to sleep early. Brush your teeth clean."

It's only when you go to the dentist and come back with 8 cavities, that you learn for yourself to brush your teeth clean.

When I talk about becoming a different person...its the long hours of work that you put in. It's the standing mediation that you do. It's your hose stance or wc stance that you hold.

It's the critical thinking that your teacher brings out of you.

You know I talked to someone today. He said, "If you learn here, you cannot learn MY wing chun or si gung's wing chun. I cannot learn YOUR wing chun or HIS wing chun. We all have our OWN wing chun."

[yenhoi]

I study fighting to fight.

I have a list of people I must visit when my skillz are ready.
Some will be visted sooner then others.

:mad:

Quote:

You are calm. When you see a bunch of cars honking their horns at each other, you don't get mad you just think
"they have a lot to learn..."

I think: "there is a bunch of cars honking thier horns at each other."

[cha kuen]

Yenhoi,
"cars honking"
Cool. haha

You konw that banner at the top of this thing that says

"wu-tang, kungfumagazine.com,wudang mountain"

HAHA what a load of crap, this hiphop group, or used to be hiphop... and this kung fu thing.

BUT it's good for kung fu-helping it reach more people.

But Gene Ching loves wutang and thinks of it as good quality hiphop while I think that wutang has ran out of fuel and is simply rapping the same crap they have been rapping before with a different order of words.

[anerlich]

There is ample evidence amongst some senior martial artists, including WC practitioners, that long time study of a martial art does not necessarily develop emotional maturity, humility, or "develop character", or make one a "better human being".

[Merryprankster]

Hmmm funny, all this stuff about relaxing your shoulders, heck, relaxing everything, power comes from the ground, etc... sounds suspiciously like... what Dave, my boxing trainer says.

Except he says it more like "You're too tense! Relax or you'll punch yourself out."

"MOVE, don't stand there and stare at what you've done!"

"Pivot more on your cross!"

Sometimes, of course, he doesn't say anything. He just whacks me on the head with the focus mitt....

[anerlich]

Prankster, I agree. The mechanics may not be identical, but they are pretty similar on a number of levels.

One thing you miss out on in that environment is the associated aura of the Mystic East which enthralls some. And the feeling that what you do is somehow special and radically different to everyone else.

[Alpha Dog]

Palestinian author Edward Said wrote in his book Orientalism that the whole concept of the "mystic East" was a western, colonial invention -- by objectifying a region, making it beyond comprehension, it was easier for the people back home to accept the attrocities being committed overseas by the colonial Empire.

It was the only thing the guy ever said that had an ounce of credibility, proving that if you write enough, sooner or later you will say something quotable.

[lotus kick]

I learn kung fu because i want to learn kung fu. Everyhting else, is water under the bridge.:)

[Sabu]

'Cause people try to steal my elephant all the time. I must defend him....

[old jong]

Because I want to be able to defend myself against evil nurses when I'm in an old people home!...That's why! ;)

[raving_limerick]

Originally posted by old jong
Because I want to be able to defend myself against evil nurses when I'm in an old people home!...That's why! ;)

Old Jong-- You sound just like my dad, who's just started taking Tai Chi this year. Not that he couldn't tan my hide before, but I'm not going to be the one to try to shuttle him off to the home after he gets 20 more years of traing in. :D

Actually, if I was living in your fair country, I'd probably start learning kung fu to teach those annoying Leafs fans a lesson. ;)

[raving_limerick]

I gotta go with the anti-personal developement slant on voiced on this thread. I didn't decide to learn kung-fu out of some desire to become one with the universal godhead-- I did it because I want to be able to defend myself. That's it. Over the course of my brief stay on this planet, I've found myself in many a rough neighborhood and possibly dangerous situation. Sure, I've lucked out so far and not actually had to fight beyound the occasional scuffle at a party, but someday, I know my luck's going to run out. It's a matter of simple statistics. Hence the Wing Chun.

Sure there's additional benefits to learning any form of kung fu-- better shape, exposure to new ideas, confidence, etc.. but that's just icing on the cake. If you grow mentally/emotionally from the experience that's great, but it shouldn't be your only reason for learning a martial art.

Now, I'm not implying that self-improvement is worthless-- on the contray, I think that philosophy is good, as is the bettering of one's mind and body. However, the point remains that there's multiple ways to accomplish those goals. When I want philosophy I go and read some Durkheim or St. Thomas Aquinas, when I want art I go work on my poems or read something by one of my betters. When I want to get into shape, I play soccer. But when I want asskicking, make mine kung-fu.

[yenhoi]

Quote:

When I want philosophy I go and read some Durkheim or St. Thomas Aquinas, when I want art I go work on my poems or read something by one of my betters. When I want to get into shape, I play soccer. But when I want asskicking, make mine kung-fu.

-

Indeed.

Also whoever just insulted the wu-tang clan just made my early list.

:eek:

[cha kuen]

Try downloading better hip hop...

-mos def
-talib kweli
-the roots
-common
-mystic
-bahamadia
-rasco

wutang is old... every line they say has " shaolin,..wutang.." and it's all wack now.

[jon]

"Is this the type of feeling you're getting? "
* Ever listen to any John Lennon, personaly not a fan but an old girlfriend of mine used to love him... There is one line that always stuck in my head.

"You may say im a dreamer, but im not the only one"
;)

Not many of us around, keep well:)

[yuanfen]

Reading Durkheim or Aquinas? After reading them- if you stare at the abyss the abyss might still stare back at you.
Get a good wing chun teacher- if there is not one around- learn some other self defense art for which there is a good teacher.
Bad wing chun could get you clobbered.

[Roy D. Anthony]

Very True Yuanfan. Wing Chun is not the best art if all you want to do is learn the best art. Sound profound?....let me clarify.

Don't learn a Martial Art just because you heard it was good or it was the best. The best martial art is the one you enjoy, that is the one you will get most benefit from. Hope this helps!!!:)