Sip Batt Mor Quil

[CLOUD ONE]

Hi All,
Can anyone help.
Sip Batt Mor Quil does it mean 18 devils bridge or 18 feeling bridge?
By the way 'leen fa sow' has anyone been taught this in Pak Mei? Please could you share any experiences.

[Shaolin Master]

Sup Bat Mor Kiu
18
Mor = like a contact/rubbing/feeling describer
Kiu = Bridge

so I'd say 18 Feeling Bridge is closer to intention but so is 18 Contact. In chinese we say to Mor is like the action when you wake someone up, like touch and rub sort of (hehe I guess it depends on how you wake a person up :) maybe a bad eg ) this same action is then implied to the bridge of the arm

Lin Fa Sao - Continous Flower Hands is a set of techniques not a form that I am aware.

Regards & Peace
Shi Chan Long

[Paul Skrypichayko]

Sup Bat Mor Kiu is a major form in Lung Ying Mor Kiu. I didn't know that it was trained in Bak Mei as well.

The word "mor/mo", which means devil or demon, is composed of two root words, "guai/gui", which means ghost, and "ma/ma", which means hemp, but is actually used for phonetic purposes. So, you could translate the name of the style as "evil dragon bridge kung fu".

[fiercest tiger]

this is also my translation, lung ying mor kuil is bak meis ying jow lin kuil.

does anyone know the 18 bridges?

:D

peace

bakmeimonk@hotmail.com

[CLOUD ONE]

Shoalin Master, Thanks for the reply.
The Lin Fa Sow, Do you in your kung fu practice this? If so could you explain what is it for?

Paul Thanks,
In your explanation 'mor' is not 'feeling' So what does it imply evil dragon bridge kung fu?

F.T thanks,
Is your sip bat mor,the same feelings,as your si fu.

[MoQ]

Gung Fu terms are mouth to ear, books and Chinese classes don't count. There are no denotative OR connotative meanings from the outside that have any value, i.e. "The book says it SHOULD mean this..". It COULD also be translated like this.."
etc... all BS. Do you have forms with these names? What did your teacher say? Okay then forget about it...

Lung Ying Mor Kiu is NOT the name of LYG's Dragon system.(Meltdawn?)

[Paul Skrypichayko]

So what are you saying MoQ; that kung fu terms can only be spoken and not written? Wow, that's pretty intelligent.

So what if a prominent master decides to write some material on his style? According to you it would all be wrong.

If the word "mo/mor" doesn't mean evil, then please tell us what it means, and back it up as well. I know you think it means something regarding Taoism. I thought I could be mistaken, so I checked with my sifu, a few Lung Ying practicioners, and even some articles written in the 70's by a Lung Ying association in Hong Kong. They all seem to use the word "evil".

MoQ wrote:

what's this troll central?

Gung Fu terms are mouth to ear, books and Chinese classes don't count. There are no denotative OR connotative meanings from the outside that have any value, i.e. "The book says it SHOULD mean this..". It COULD also be translated like this.."
etc... all BS. Do you have forms with these names? What did your teacher say? Okay then forget about it...
Lung Ying Mor Kiu is NOT the name of LYG's Dragon system.(Meltdawn?)

You seem pretty worked up. Why the comment about trolls? Do you feel threatened because somebody has a different answer than you? Do you find the word "evil" derrogatory about this style? I don't find anything negative about it.

[Kevin Barkman]

Dragon Style used to be called Dragon Style Touch Bridge (Lung Ying Mor-Kiew) - this was the "old session" name for the style. To simplify it, Lam Yiu Kwai shortened it to "Dragon Form" - since the school became incorporated it is simply refered to as "Dragon Style".

Lung Ying Mor-Kiew is a Dragon Style Form (1st Intermediate set). Sap Baat Mor-Kiew is Bak Mei (18 Magic Brige).

Cheers - kevin

[fiercest tiger]

hi kevin,
i have seen this written in mags and talked about here. you say rubbing then magical which one is it? because they aint the same i have seen it as rubbing and evil, devil, ghost, since i have started....do you know the 18 bridges?

old session what! old version new session new version.(modified?)

thanks

peace

bakmeimonk@hotmail.com

[DF]

Hi folks, the word mor in Cantonese is to rub, to touch. However Cantonese is not a written language, it is just one of many Chinese dialects. In Chinese the writing is standard, thus a lot of times when you write or try to write Cantonese in written Chinese, similar sounding words are used. What is the original intend of the creator of this form , that I have no clue. I just don't want this interesting thread to deviate course into a language debat.


peace

DF

[DF]

Oh by the way, by no means I am implying this particular mor means to rub or to feel etc,
mor can also means devil in Cantonese, but a slightly different tone sounding.


peace
DF

[MoQ]

DF you may be Chinese, but apparently you should take a college course...

paul-
Do you have forms with these names? What did your teacher say? Okay then forget about it...

[sui-fuw]

this is hak-ka guys.its not the translation that matters.its the way you all practise the form that matters.
in hak-ka mor-que is a technique.where-as sipp batt mor is aform.
what this means is,do the form how do you feel?
f,t can u answer clouds question about you and your si-fus sipp batt mor,do you do it the same{feeling}.

does anybody learn leng fa sui as cloud asked.

[meltdawn]

"mo" means fog, none and rub/caress
"m ho" means not good, refer to bad
Throwing in the "r" at the end is purely diction. Like "sarm" instead of "sam", because most Americans would pronounce it like Uncle Sam. Or Yaaaang style.

"kiu" means bridge; I'm not aware of another tonal version

side note:
"ma" means hemp, mother, and horse.
When referring to "ma" in martial arts, it refers to horse stance, or simplified to stance.

Everyone always mentions the form mor kiu. It's a movement and a sequnce. I wonder how many have actually seen either. Or any on top. It's like going into an Indy car chat room and asking any of the guys if they drive. 10 to 1 Zinardi ain't in there.

The only reference I've ever seen to an "sap bat mo kiu" is on the Venezuelan guy's website. Actually, he mentions "16 movements of Mok-Kiew" (sp) not 18. It would have more continuity, given the sup luk dong sequence. Then again, if you divide 36 by 2 (left and right) you get 18. I dunno.

Kevin, you've mentioned "sessions" before. Are you referring to pre-LYK versus post-LYK? This is quite an area of interesting conjecture. I would love to hear more by e-mail.

"Waiting is bad." - Musashi

[tnwingtsun]

The Bai Mei version I heard there were "Deamons crossing the bridge",could Mor mean to cross also?? makes sence,how many deamons?,I don't know,bridge=arm?,two arms(2 deamons?) angles of attack?,watch out,here come some more deamons

[fiercest tiger]

i dont really understand your question! do i do the form like the same fellings as my sifu. are you asking me, if i do the same form with his expression?

if you are the answer is NO, his kung fu was ultimate, i wouldnt have standed a chance. but i practise in the manner i was shown by him.

i hope that helped.. :confused:

peace

bakmeimonk@hotmail.com

[CLOUD ONE]

F.T what is important the movements in the forms or the essence of each form?
Which forms are correct when so many practitioners of the same kung fu do it differently. From what you were taught have you made Sip Bat Mor your own or is it the same as your teachers. If so, what does your demons look like?
From Gao Pu Tui to Sip Bat Mor, is it only the moves that are different or is there more?
In your Sip Bat Mor, is there Len Fa Sui ?

[WongFeHung]

I think we are forgetting that Kung-Fu terminology is full of puns, or play on words. Some words sound the same but have different meanings, and this is often used intentionally to describe not only technique, but application, and qualities of energy. Sup Bot Mor Kiu has also been called Sup Bot Gwai-Sao, and in some schools, Sup Bot Mor Jow-perhaps each Sifu had a different interpetation, or emphasis he was trying to convey. Your mission Jim, if you decide to accept it is to seek out different ways of looking at the same form, or movement, or application or theories. Otherwise, your Kung-Fu will just be a mimicry of the previous generation-much the way a parrot speaks, but is unaware of the content. This is your obligation as a student of Kung-Fu-to make sure that the next generation is not weaker than the previous, but stronger, wiser,more educated, so the system lives and grows rather than wither and die. Who knows to what level you can take your Kung-Fu?

[MoQ]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> I think we are forgetting that Kung-Fu terminology is full of puns, or play on words. Some words sound the same but have different meanings, and this is often used intentionally to describe not only technique, but application, and qualities of energy [/quote]
This is a really good point that alot of literal types miss by way of not actually having a Chinese sifu as the source of their terminology...

[fiercest tiger]

you learn a form off your sifu then you decide to ADD your own essence or flavour to it? hmmm i try and keep it as it was taught, my fighting applications i work out or what works for me. if i was to change the way the form was supposed to be like, i would be changing tradition. i cant look like my sifu because of different body shapes and sizes, the forms are performed with yau kung- soft/flexible power different from the beginner an intermediate levels.

what do my demons look like? linda blair!!

what are the 18 bridges? you havent answer my question?

peace

bakmeimonk@hotmail.com

[CLOUD ONE]

So F.T, the applications you work out yourself. Didn't your SiFu teach you anything about San Sou?

[illusionfist]

I think you misunderstood what FT said. He means that he adapts the applications to his own fighting style

Peace :D

[fiercest tiger]

what do you think i just do forms? i teach kung fu, i wouldnt be a sifu in ykm if i didnt know how to work out forms!!! :rolleyes:

i trained for 14 years with my sifu before he passed away, i did bi shee and i am considered family. make your own mind up, seems you have.

have you learnt this form? did your sifu teach you everything about it?


what are the 18 bridges????

illusion- hows thing mate? hope things are well...
:D

peace

bakmeimonk@hotmail.com

[tonfas]

Hi, sorry, which styles are you talking about? because in southern mantis has a form call ' sup ba mor'

most of the hagar has mor kiew form.

peace

:confused:

[tonfas]

Hi clound one,

Which 18 mor are you talking about.

Mantis, pak mei, dragon or any hagar styles.

most of the hagar had 18 mor??

tonfas@hotmail.com

[CLOUD ONE]

Does it matter which one?
Do you study all of them? If so what would your translation be?(Sup Ba Mor)

in Hakka Pak Mei mor kiew is in all the forms, from Ti Poo to ?

Why 18 ?