What is the difference between Yee's Hung Gar and Hay Say Fu hung gar?

[phantom]

I read in the new issue of Qiqong kung fu magazine that Hay Say Fu's snake style is more internal than Canton hung gar, and I think Yee's hung gar would be considered a Canton style. Also,Hay say fu's snake style uses two fingers to strike, as opposed to four. What are some other differences between these two styles? Also, are any of Wing Lam's Hung Gar tapes on Hay say fu style? Thank you for any insight that you could give me concerning this topic.

[illusionfist]

Yee's Hung Gar is Canton Hung Gar. Its from Wong Fei Hung passed down by Tang Fung. Ha Say Fu is old style Hung Gar, considered to be before the time of Wong Fei Hung.

Peace :D

[Kung Lek]

Hi-

Ha Say Fu Hong Pai, or Ha say Fu Hung Gar are essentially Sil lum Five Animals systems.

They are different from Hung Gar and Canton Hung Gar inasmuch as each animal has a seperate form.

Ha Say Fu itself means "Four Lower Tigers" and is considered and esoteric form of Hung Gar from one perspective although I am certain that a good deal of it is martially applicable and not so esoteric except for the internal sets snake and dragon.

Being that it is five Animals, it is deeply connected to the ancient sil lum kung fu.

Anyway, I have only started this system this past year after studying Sil Lum black tiger and North Shaolin for 6 years. So I don't quite have a depth of knowledge to speak to it yet.

What I do know is that Wing Lam does have videos of the style apparently that you can order up through his website.
I am not certain that wing lams ha say fu is the same as my sifu's ha say fu.
my sifu's ha say fu is from the toisan (Hoysun) district which is in canton. i'm not sure where Wing Lams is from other than what I have read at his site. They are likely to share some aspects as do Original five Animals styles which do not use the "four lower tigers red clan" name.

peace

Kung Lek

[hasayfu]

As stated, they are two different styles with different forms and moves. On the surface, they are about as similar as Wing Chun and Hung Gar. In fact, many people confuse HaSayFu for poorly done Wing Chun.

That said, one reason HaSayFu is called a Hung Gar style is because it shares principles closer to Hung Gar then other styles. (Like a similar emphasis on bridging) Also, it's history is legended to descend from Hung Hei Goon though that can't be proven or disproven.

Wing Lam, my sifu, has tapes on the five seperate animal forms as well as many of it's weapon sets. You can go the website or get a catalog for specifics.

As for being "more internal," I don't have the article in front of me but I would personally say "more blatently internal" if anything. Since I study both Lam Sai Wing lineage Hung Gar and HaSayFu, I can say that they are more similar then different. Canton HG has all the internal pieces found in HSF sets. HSF just emphasizes them more and breaks them out.

Without knowing Yee's sets at all, I would say that Yee displays some of this more then LSW lines because they use the Kim Yeung Ma in Gung Gee Fook Fu which builds more internal connection. LSW lines usually reserve this for Sup Ying. HSF also starts in Kim Yeung Ma which is why it is confused with Wing Chun.

finally, HSF the name comes from the region where it was popular. We are no longer shure exactly where it is since the name is no longer used. It's like the rarely used "Say Yup" area refering to four regions around Toi San and "Sam Yap" referring to the area between HK and Guangzhou.

[doug maverick]

i think ha say fu is just village style hung gar created by hung hay gwoon whith some changes.

[GeneChing]

I wrote that snake article in our Mar/Apr 2001 issue. It was sort of a sequel to a Dragon article I did in our Oct 1999 issue. Also I wrote another piece that addressed the difference between Ha Say Fu and Canton in our southern special Aug/Sep 1998 (one of our most popular issues - a must have!) Thanks for supporting my work.

Gene Ching
Asst. Publisher
Kungfu Qigong Magazine & www.KungfuMagazine.com (http://www.KungfuMagazine.com)

[phantom]

Thank you for such a great article and magazine. I feel that your magazine is one of the few M.A. mags that is consitently good quality every single month. Keep up the good work. Peace.