Chen with a difference

[yutyeesam]

I'm sure many practitioners of Chen knows who Grandmaster Feng Zhiqiang and Master Yang Yang are. If not, go to http://www.chentaiji.com

Because of the Xing Yi influence of what they do, they call their art:
Chen Shi Xin Yi Hun Yuan Taijiquan

But what is the difference? Is it "more internal" than the traditional Chen because of Xing Yi? Sounds strange.

I'd appreciate any help with this.

[Kumkuat]

That's just Feng's variation of Chen. It doesn't make it any more internal than laojia, xin jia, xiao jia or whatever.

[Prairie]

I don't have the experience to give technical differences between laojia and xin yi hunyuan. However, they do have different flavours. The hunyuan style (from my limited experience) has a larger frame and is much more relaxed in how it moves. The laojia style (of which I have slightly more experience but am still a beginner) although still relaxed is very precise and smaller in it's movements.

Chen Shi Xin Yi Hunyuan Taijiquan is drawn from Feng's training with both Wu Haozen <sp> and Chen Fake. My opinion is that it is not "more internal" than other chen styles. Rather, it is another flavour. I expect that he named his system to honour both of his teachers.

[Fu-Pow]

The Hun Yuan system has a whole set of Nei Gung/Chi Gung excercises that are separate from the Chen Taiji branch. I believe these come from Feng's Xin Yi teacher. They train "opening and closing" more than the Chan Si Jin excercises that are taught in the Chen Family.

[looking_up]

The Xin Yi refers to the emphasis of the "heart" and "mind" over
physical force. Though Grandmaster Feng's forms do have
techniques from a multitude of martial arts (well, traditional
Chen style too) the Xin Yi in the name is not meant to denote a
connection to Xing Yi Quan beyond the broader meaning of
heart and mind leading the actions. I am parroting this from
an interview I read with GM Feng. There are numerous gong,
including silk reeling gong, hunyuan gong, fangsong gong,
jiji gong, and others.

I believe Hu Yaozhen was GM Feng's qigong master, though I'm
sure there are many similar spellings...

This is just my general understanding of things, I could be wrong.

[yutyeesam]

How is this alternative perspective created by GM Feng viewed by the Chen Family/community?

[looking_up]

Good question...

[Prairie]

"I believe Hu Yaozhen was GM Feng's qigong master, though I'm
sure there are many similar spellings..."

Thanks looking_ up. That's the name I was thinking of.

[Prairie]

There are differences in opinion on what to consider master Feng's style.

My opinion is that it's not quite the same as chen style, but not different enough to be considered totally apart from chen style. However, it's definitely taijiquan and it was definitely created/modified/whatever by an extremely talented. knowledgeable. and capable fellow so the name of his style is not important -- to me.

[dfedorko@mindspring.com]

I have been to three seminars with Master Yang Yang and once to the mountains and practice his 48 form. I have never heard him use that term. Could it be that they might be starting a new style of Chen??

Damian

[Kevin Wallbridge]

Feng has stated that he has added many larger spirals at the beginnings of movements to make the spirals easier for beginners to learn.

As well, in the introduction to Feng's Hunyuan Qigong book it says, "It (Hunyuantaiji) combines the best of the Neigong from Xinyi Liuhe Quan and silk reeling of Chen Style Taijiquan."

Feng says, "Xinyi Hunyuan Taijiquan is not an inheritance from my masters. It is a rich legacy to the people of the world."

Its not Chen anymore, certainly not the Chen of Chen Fake.

[yutyeesam]

Aha, you have touched on what I was thinking about. Would you say that GM Feng found that the traditional Chen he learned could be "enhanced" by other means for a more effecient way of developing and nurturing qi?

If that is the case, I wonder how he is viewed by the Chen community?

123

[looking_up]

One person's opinion about this:

http://www.stltaiji.com/

click: Articles about Taiji

click: The Hun Yuan Taiji of Grandmaster Feng Zhiqiang

[n0rmann]

I recently attended a seminar taught by Grandmaster Feng Zhiqiang's daughter. From what I understand, and how my Taiji teacher explained the difference is that Feng Zhiqiang's taiji is slightly more toward health benefits than typical chen Taiji, and there's more of a mixture of Qigong within the taiji form.

My teacher was taught by Master Liu Chengde (excuse my spelling), who was taught by Master Hong.
Master Hong and Feng both were students of Chen Fa-ke, but at different points of his life. Hong was a student when Fake was young, while Feng learned from Fake when Fake was older, which led to the difference.

At least that's how my teacher explained it to me.

[Kevin Wallbridge]

"... chinna crazy Xinjia marketed by Ma Hong."

Laughed right out of my chair dude. A reasonable assessment none the less.

Cheers

[looking_up]

You mean that you can strike AND grapple in taijiquan?

Oh my...soon you'll be telling me that it might even be possible
to win fights...who would have thought...:D

[RAF]

Come on Stumblefist, you are letting me down.

Ma Hong had a couple of things published in the old Journal of Chen Style Taijquan and George Xu had all of his tapes available at one time. All around 1992 or so.

Hell, we bought about 4 of his tapes, including the applications tape.