Bak Mei Vs Wing Chun

[Rolling_Hand]

Have anyone ever heard of a Bak Mei guy in SF named Zhong Luo was defeated by a Fatshan Wing Chun fighter last year? I've recently learned that the Bak Mei Master Mai Yu Qiang's son, Zhong Luo who had said some stupid comments about Wing Chun in Fatshan China, that caused him and his father's Bak Mei school into some big troubles with the Fatshan Wing Chun people. Both Zhong Luo's wife and father were sent to the emergency room, himself was also injury very badly. Is that Wing Chun a better fighting art than Bak Mei? Any thoughts...

[Hakka Fist]

About two months ago I was visited by a Pak Mei student of Dr Wong (USA) from Spain. He told me the same story and asked if it was true. Still I haven't found the truth. I don't know the son, but my sifu told me that the father has a very good reputation in southern china. The claim was or still is put on the site: www.vingtsun.com.hk/ (http://www.vingtsun.com.hk/).
The quest of the best style hasn't been answered for many centuries. Try for your self, visit "the local" martial arts school and find out! Is it the art of the fighter that is important?

Hakka Fist
(www.packmeipai.nl (http://www.packmeipai.nl))

[Rolling_Hand]

Hakka Fist,
Zhong Luo was defected by the powerful Wing Chun chain punches and dropped his a88 to the ground in least than 2 seconds.

As a Bak Mei practioner, how would you deal with this Wing Chun centerline punches??

[fiercest tiger]

obviously your a wing chun guy otherwise you wouldnt be talking like this!

the truth was not what you think it is, some words was said, but both father and son fought each other, and both the father and the girl was sent to hospital. The girl is a wing chun futsan practitioner and is married to the fathers son i believe. The father served the wing chun and the son beat his own father up. :eek: thats what i have been told by reliable sorces.

both styles are good, and many wing chun teachers learn bak mei futsan style to better themselves so go and figure!! :o :eek: :p

come & visit us!
http://home.iprimus.com.au/ykm
yaukungmun@hotmail.com

[tnwingtsun]

>As a Bak Mei practioner, how would you deal with this Wing Chun centerline punches??<

Thats an easy one,the same way that WT/VT/WC
deals with them.

Having studied both systems I can say that they are very close in concept but take a different approach to power generation.

Bai Mei practioners tend to use their whole
body to generate a whipping/shock force as opposed to WT/VT/WC that trains certain muscle
groups.

Bai Mei people have a broad arsenal of weapons
and very good footwork that uses angles that borrows from the opponets attack.

Be careful not to underestimate the White Eyebrow
bridge,its very strong and just as flexible
as a WT/WC's bridge,you might get through on a beginner because they don't focus on sensitivity
at the start but latter on they train that sensitivity.
That combined with the shock force you're dealing
with a person that can cause you alot damage
with one punch.

They don't bang arms the way Hung-Ga people
do but they train their fists,arms,legs and knuckles to be very hard on impact and very soft before impact.
In military terms I like to think of the WT/WC attack with the chain punches as laying down a base of fire ie. over loading your opponet
with a continous hail of lead/punches.
Bai Mei terms the punch is like a snipers bullet,
one shot,one kill.
Of course they have their own base of fire weapons
also.

Just pray you never have to find out the hard way,
with just five years of VT training you'd be in for a big suprise.

;)

[This message was edited by tnwingtsun on 10-30-01 at 03:37 PM.]

[Rolling_Hand]

Fierest Tiger,

Nope, Luo's wife was a student under Chris Chan. She threw a chair at the Fatshan Wing Chun guy in order to save Zhong Luo. The Wing Chun guy wouldn't stop beating Luo, then the members from both schools went after each other, both Luo's wife and father were in coma for a week.

TnWingTsun,

As a Bak Mei guy, how do you react to the Wing Chun chain punches?

[sui-fuw]

so fu[king big deal,can you thats the big question.you couldn't roll dough,you just go get that rolling pin,ky jelly and shove it up your ring piece :D :D :D :D :D :D sorry for get the ky,your problably use to it :D :D :D :D

[CLOUD ONE]

'how do you react to you chain punching'
laugh my head off!!!(only joking)
Best bet is 'len fa suiw'

[NorthernMantis]

Wait a sec.Let's get this straight.

1)Zhong Luo got beat by a win chun guy

2)The guys wife (possibly a wing chun person herself) threw a chair and got beat up by who?

3)Zhong Luo's dad is pretty famous in the south also got beat by who??

My question is why would someone beat a woman to a coma?

"Always be ready"

"right, that's it!you've insulted me, and you've insulted the shaolin temple!"-Fish of Furry

[Yum Cha]

aside from the facts of the alleged incident, there is a good question. (anybody ask Zhong Luo?)

Every teacher worth their title will tell you the same: It's not the style, it's the practitioner.

But, I was just watching a couple of Wing Chun blokes training down at Bondi Beach the other day, asking myself the same question.

As far as style goes, tnwingtsun, you put it very well. Giving away the secrets again, mate. :D
Pak Mei, like WC is a short armed boxing style (Hakka?), they have alot in common.

How do you avoid the 'chain punching?'
Move sideways is the easiest (open a side door). Any more would be telling.... ;)

Rolling, by the way, if he knocked him out in 2 seconds, how did he keep beating on him? By throwing his unconcious body into the air and keeping it suspended on chain punches?

Now that I'd like to see! ;)

If only his wife had used a Dragon Bench....

[Rolling_Hand]

-- Move sideways
That would have given up one's own space.

--in 2 seconds
The Wing Chun guy was on top of Luo.

[fiercest tiger]

rolling hand,
so who beat who? i heard the fathers sons wife is from futsan wing chun!

i dont care its bak mei politics with wing chun :eek:

who ever put them in a coma was it one or the whole school beat the bak mei father and wife up? :rolleyes:

come & visit us!
http://home.iprimus.com.au/ykm
yaukungmun@hotmail.com

[Rolling_Hand]

Luo's wife is from USA, a student of Chris Chan.

--put them in a coma
by other Fatshan Wing Chun members

[Yum Cha]

Hi Rolling.

Quoted:
Comment: Move sideways
Reply: That would have given up one's own space

Can you clarify the significance of your statement about giving up one's own space?

thanks

[Rolling_Hand]

The enemy occupied the fort.

[Yum Cha]

Are you telling me that in your school they teach you if you attack where somebody was, you win?

Just looking for verification.

[Rolling_Hand]

let's put this way...

There's no space between US.

[tnwingtsun]

>TnWingTsun,

As a Bak Mei guy, how do you react to the Wing Chun chain punches?<

I study both so I understand both WT/WC attacks and Bai Mei/YKM attacks,if you can understand both systems you would not be asking silly questions.

As a VT guy how do you react to the Bai Mei/YKM
shock force combined with the seven stars(Bai Mei chain punching) in conjuntion with a high level
Bai Mei person??

You don't know because you have NO clue about the Bai Mei/YKM systems.

I've tasted both,and they are both good,
you need to test the water before you open your mouth


:rolleyes:

[Rolling_Hand]

--Water
Nope, its tea time... the train is 500 miles away from Ving Tsun station. Wait for your next train...

[tnwingtsun]

Have you crossed hands with a Bai Mei person?

Have you crossed hands withhh a WT/VT/WC person?

I've been there done that,have you???

BTW,the color of you tie means nothing if you only
wear red. :p

[Rolling_Hand]

Maybe Madonna still a virgin?!!!

[tnwingtsun]

Have you crossed hands with a Bai Mei person???????????????????????????????????????????? ??????????????????????????????????????????????????

[fiercest tiger]

so what are you trying to say? what is the punch line?

that wing chun is better? if you think so good for you, get on with your life or are you just trolling?!

eddie chong is a wing chun sifu and has learnt bak mei to better his art, if wing chun was the best why have bak mei to add or learn?

this is a useless thread!!! :eek:

come & visit us!
http://home.iprimus.com.au/ykm
yaukungmun@hotmail.com

[sui-fuw]

hang on f.t,rolling pin your sticky hands[and this goes for all wing chun]have this because they don't have the cursity of wiping the sperm off their hands when playing with their partners. :D :D :D :D :D so what if its true thers always been a story of wing chun beating pak mei,but its always an advanced student against a begginer :D :D :D :D i wonder why?

[CLOUD ONE]

I know plenty of so called W.C/bak Mei/hung gar/pak hok/karate/tae kwon do etc etc etc get beaten by no stylist. What do you all conclude about that?????
Is it the art that is sh!t are the artist?
Look, don't see.
Hear, don't listen.
Taste, don't judge.

[fiercest tiger]

correct, i really dont have a problem with the fact that maybe this is true, but its the way our new friend is saying it! hey we all have bad days so i guys sh!t happens. see it wasnt guangzhou or hongkong version that lost it was futsan..hahahehehe it wasnt hakka the ultimate version either am i right?

so how are my two love buttons going, can one of you guys email me i miss you?

:D

come & visit us!
http://home.iprimus.com.au/ykm
yaukungmun@hotmail.com

[sui-fuw]

right on f.t :D :D :D :D :D :Dthats true cloud nicely put.kick that one then rolling pin :D :D :D :D

[Yum Cha]

Wasn't there a similar thread about a Choi Lee Fut player(s) that trashed a Wing Chun school in China... Some chapter in a 50 year grudge match...

Anybody remember reading about that? Almost the same, but they didn't beat an old man and a woman....

Gee, why don't we get any of these grudge matches in Sydney lads, I mean, we've got so many schools, so many masters...

Then again, I do remember aYKM lion dance in Chinatown one year that almost started a brawl....never mind...

Were you there for that one FT?

[Ginger Fist]

good 'ol sui-fuw wading in with another account of his hakka (p)ussy boy sex practices. his dead mommy must be proud her spooge guzzling son can take a whole rolling pin up his (a)ss, dry no less. good demonstration of anus control which he gets from secret hakka k.f. practices :)

[Rolling_Hand]

--Eddie Chong has learnt Bak Mei
He has to eat...

--to better his art
Maybe, maybe not...

You argument has more holes than swiss cheese.

[Rolling_Hand]

--beat a women
She threw a chair at the WC man, so, she asked for it.
Zhong Luo badmouthing about WC, but he couldn't back up with his Bak Mei fists!!!!

Fearful when the sky was full of thunder...

[NorthernMantis]

Umm R_H can you please specify who beat the woman?Was it the wc guy or by a mob of people?I'm still confused and how idd the dad get beat up?

WHy would someone hit a woman?I don't agree with that.

"Always be ready"

"right, that's it!you've insulted me, and you've insulted the shaolin temple!"-Fish of Furry

[Rolling_Hand]

--the woman
She's been a WC and Bak Mei practioner for ten years. She attacked the WC man with a chair, the man turned around and striked to her temple...

[Yum Cha]

So, he beat the woman into coma for throwing a chair at him while he was on top of a prone, unconcious man, beating him into a coma...

Now, tell us about the gang he had with him when he attacked Luo, the old man and the woman...

You sound like you must be very proud...

This doesn't sound much like the Wing Chun players I know in Sydney. They are very cultured ladies and gentlemen, from my experience.

[This message was edited by Yum Cha on 10-31-01 at 09:29 PM.]

[This message was edited by Yum Cha on 10-31-01 at 09:30 PM.]

[Rolling_Hand]

So you would just stand there and let her crack your head open!

Are you an iron head kung fu practioner?

[sui-fuw]

rolling pin you say the woman practises w/c and p/m,so really she could of beaten the w/c guy,because w/c is better. :D :D :D :D :D and also w/c is better than w/c and p/m is cr@p?

[Rolling_Hand]

Do I amuse you ?! or wing chun ?!

[tnwingtsun]

The Rolls of VT/WC,until you've fought a Bai Mei

person(Hakka or Canton) you'll never know,keep

reading stories if that makes you feel like a

bad arse,I never claim that WT is better than

your VT(IMHO it is for me) but at least I can say

that I studied both.

sui-fuw-well said ;)

[sui-fuw]

i amuse myself,but thank you for trying? :D :D :D :D :D

[kull]

Hi everyone, haven't visited site in a while.

About WC chain punch-
a student of bak mei can use ,lep bo seung chui, which is perfect techq. for attack like WC chain punch. Or can use, fu bo seung bui, which is 9 step tech. and it is much more vicious than WC chain punch.

I don't understand, these methods should have been learned by 1st yr. bak mei student. They are designed to counter an "overwhelming" type of attack like WC chain punch and then turn the table and counterattack quickly. If bak mei practitioner got beaten by such a simple tech. as WC chain punch then it shows he did not learn any bak mei basic combat methods. Or maybe he just not that good, or WC practitoner is better.

I understand it is not style, that is good but person who uses the style that is good. But at least the method i mention above should have at least given bak mei practitioner a counter method.

[GeneChing]

I heard about versions of this fight from both Sifu Zhong Luo's camp and Hung Fa Yi Wing Chun Sifu Garrett Gee. Of course, just like the infamous Bruce Lee vs. Wong Jack Man fight, who knows what really happened. Even the people who were there disagree.
One worthy point that has been overlooked in this thread so far is Zhong Luo's brother. He is in law enforcement and handled the case personally. Whatever the story might have been, it'll will always be rumor, because win or lose, martial arts duels are still frowned on in the eyes of the law. Schools can be shut down for it. Certainly, Luo's brother would protect his family's business.

BTW, we ran a cover story on Zhong Luo back in Dec 2001 - check it out:
http://www.kungfumagazine.com/HomePage/magazine/2000/KF200012/200012Html/Covstory200012.htm

"Mr. Chatterbox how long will you live?
Always to receive but never to give
Always carry news all over the place
Mr. Chatterbox you are a big disgrace

You cheek and you tounge
A go let you down
And a when them let you down
We a go batter you around
Bif, baf, boof, those are the blows you're gonna get
Mr. Talkative, I know you will regret"
~ Marley on gossip

Gene Ching
Asst. Publisher
Kungfu Qigong Magazine & www.KUNGFUmagazine.com (http://www.KUNGFUmagazine.com)

[kull]

I just read Zhong Luo website. It is interesting that he describes bak mei as "EXTERNAL"??? and dragon as more "INTERNAL"???

I know these terms are very subjective, and you probably won't find any kungfu practitioner who would say they don't have "internal" training regardless of style.

But let me ask bak mei ppl. what does that say about his training and understanding of bak mei when he describes it as such?

[NorthernMantis]

Thanks R_H

"Always be ready"

"right, that's it!you've insulted me, and you've insulted the shaolin temple!"-Fish of Furry

[tnwingtsun]

"But let me ask bak mei ppl. what does that say about his training and understanding of bak mei when he describes it as such?"

VERY LITTLE

;)

[Ginger Fist]

of course u amuse urself susie-foo. with ur head up ur a)ss the echo of ur own words is all that u can hear :) hey hey susie-foo, word is u get laid alot, 1 nite it's ur right hand, the next nite ur left hand :) keep posting p)ussy hakka boy, ur dragon face dead mommy is proud of her little pile of after birth ;)

[Rolling_Hand]

--at least I can say I studied both.

Both ! Why ?
Did you lose a sense of direction?

[feldor]

No, the 2 styles compliment each other and help inherent weakness within both styles.

Peace.
C :cool:

[Rolling_Hand]

ioio

[Rolling_Hand]

--help inherent weakness

Wing Chun six gates is like a full cup of tea, no more can be added to it in term of space, in other words, its the most complete fighting art.

[feldor]

I understand that, but, all systems have weaknesses. They have nothing to do with the six gates.

Actually, Tnwingstun can probably explain with more detail than I. I know he has this level of understanding.

Again, this is just an opinion, not trying to start an arguement... :)

Charles

[Rolling_Hand]

--nothing to do with six gates.

Where do you live?
...black holes, rethink your tactic and try accenting the positive. --RH

--just an opinion

understand! --RH

[Buby]

I understand where your coming from, but having six gates isn't the be all, end all of fighting. I've seen an untrained (street) fighter clean the floor with a wing chun man. What happened to his six gates?

All I'm trying to say is that there is a lot more to fighting then six gates. Take speed for instance, not to mention everything else that comes into play.

Both systems if learned/trained properly are effective, but to say because one system has 6 gates it's the ultimate fighting system is a bit lame.

Buby

Yo Dogs ya bes chill
Cause I flip like sifu Gary and his Yau Kung Mun click, wit two kicks and three pheonix fists
Trust dukes
your gonna split from the ging running through the wrist.

[feldor]

Don't be so closed minded, if you have never studied Bai Mei, how can you be so sure? :(

Buby-

Thanks for the support, you understand where I am coming from. :)

Peace.
Charles :D

[Buby]

Anytime! ;)


buby

Yo Dogs ya bes chill
Cause I flip like sifu Gary and his Yau Kung Mun click, wit two kicks and three pheonix fists
Trust dukes
your gonna split from the ging running through the wrist.

[kull]

I agree with Rolling Hand-

For bak mei practitoner, nothing can be learned from training in wing chun.

[Rolling_Hand]

--Thanks for the support

Is this a love connection forum or a kungfu forum?? - RH

Feldor

--Closed minded

Not at all. - RH

--never studied Bai Mei

Let's put this way, Bai Mei is 1+2=3 and Wing Chun is A+B=C - RH

Buby

--having six gates isn't the be all...

It's a big mistake in any combat system by not having six gates. - RH

--a lot more to fighting then six gates

Understand... but one must be able to deal with Wing Chun six gates... then, we can talk more about actual fighting. In other words, one needs to pass through the front door first, then get to inside of the house. - RH

[fiercest tiger]

do you think only wing chun has 6 gate theories?

do you know that bak mei has gate theories as well?

explain your 6 gates, and ill tell you my 6 gates of ykm?

later mate :)

come & visit us!
http://home.iprimus.com.au/ykm
yaukungmun@hotmail.com

[kull]

On the contrary that is the weakness of wing chun-
Everything is about learning the correct techniques in wing chun. I know because i have learned wc b4. WC attempts to compact, methododize and simplify a combat situation. When fighting is everything but that.

Through bak mei, I know it is not the technique. For bak mei ppl. remember Grandmaster Chuenng lai Chun writing, "even a stone has value" when you learn bak mei.

[BIU JI]

I had a student of wing chun tell me the other day she was taught at her school that the classic stance that most systems use ie the front stance has no power.
Reason - the feet are not both facing the direction you are striking. Apparently the wing chin stance produces more power because both feet are facing forward, the front stance feet "apparently" are facing off to a 45 degree not forward.

If that makes sense to someone would you kindly explain exactly what they may mean by that as I find it very difficult to believe.

I thought it's just another wing chun "we are the best" concept again! :(

[Metallica]

Hi Biu Ji,

When you hear such a comment, you know how not true that statement was.

Suffice to say that it is a naive comment, and it is very common in the Wing Chun group these days.
These people forgot that Wing Chun still belongs to the traditional Chinese martial art, not something that broke away from it, for a Wing Chun guy to look down at the stances and techniques used by other kung fu systems is the easiest way to get killed when faced by a well trained kung fu exponent. So to these people, I said, good luck in their Wing Chun training! :D

Metallica a.k.a integraman (can't access my old username)

[Rolling_Hand]

--Wing Chun 6 gates

Stand in front of the mirror and tell me what you see. - RH

Kull,

--the weakness of Wing Chun

Despite attempts to be rational, work through volatile feelings and you'll reach clarity. - RH

Biu Ji,

--facing off to a 45 degree

She must be from Leung Ting's school. - RH

Metallica,

--look down...

This should feel like a rerun by now. Fast forward to something proactive. - RH

[sui-fuw]

yo rolling pin the gates have to be opened first,how are you so sure you can open them and deliver on certain pak-mei.youve ever heard of leng fa suiw?thought you hadn't,put it this way your gates will be turned inside out and therefore not knowing which way they open or shut? :p :) :p :) :p

[Rolling_Hand]

--so sure you can open them...

You're already opened if not having Wing Chun 6 gates. - RH

[tnwingtsun]

I have already,lol

[fiercest tiger]

when i look it a the mirror i see a beautiful person, long strong and ready to get the friction! :D

you brought up the 8 gates so please enlighten me on your methods of gate theory?

you see im the ENEMEY at the gate..hahaha ;)

later

come & visit us!
http://home.iprimus.com.au/ykm
yaukungmun@hotmail.com

[Rolling_Hand]

Fiercest tiger,

--8 gates ?

Look again! 6 gates only...
It seems like you're the only person standing between order and chaos. - RH

[kull]

No one has volatile feelings.

Unfortunately wing chun inherit weakness is it's attempt to turn a "art" into a "science"?. An this can be seen when wing chun ppl. go up against fighters who uses very little technique in combat.

I think it was Graciella Casellia Boggs? was her name, or something like that. US champion kickboxer went to HK, don't remember date, but was invited to compete with top wing chun female. Competitors wore bag gloves and not full size boxing gloves. Idea was wing chun can trap hands with bag gloves.

Weakness was apparent, wing chun lost i believe after 1 round. I think is, what was written in the article.

C'mon, any experience martial arts person, regardless of style, know just focusing on technique, is a novice idea of fighting.

Bak mei has given me something better than knowledge of 6 gate theory.

[This message was edited by kull on 11-06-01 at 09:52 PM.]

[Rolling_Hand]

--just focusing on technique

You have to step up to the plate. - RH

--weakness was apparent

Waffling right now will only detract. - RH

[kull]

Stop talking like your Obi wan kenobi.

[OdderMensch]

but WC vs Mantis, thats fun. They use the more "traditional" stances, so its a trick to keep good WC structure against them. It can be done, its just not easy.

I think a lot of misunderstanding comes up when people are first learning the stance. In our kwoon we use the 0/100 and it takes a bit to not "wieght" the front foot.

The feet at 45deg attacking the direction of the feet sounds like the end of a stance turn, good place to get maximum power, but not the only place. So yeah anyone that "disregaurds" the other Kung Fu stances is a nutter.

[tnwingtsun]

>Unfortunately wing chun inherit weakness is it's attempt to turn a "art" into a "science"<

Kull,he seems to have tunnel vision on the technique aspect but missing the concept of
WT/VT/WC all together.

He may be Yoda :D :p ;)

[BIU JI]

Do you know what the 8 gates are ? :rolleyes:

[sui-fuw]

why would i need to open your gates?would i be attacking you?rolling pin :D

[Ginger Fist]

susie-foo writes --- youve ever heard of leng fa suiw?thought you hadn't, ...

cool u p)ussy hakka boys can read minds. u ask a ? & then answer it. like hearing ur own voice, huh?

--- put it this way your gates will be turned inside out and therefore not knowing which way they open or shut?

kind of like ur a*s*shole susie-foo. u don't know whether to open it & let ur head out or close it to keep ur head in ;)

[feldor]

How can you possiblly be learning even Wing Chun correctly having such a closed mind to what others say??? :confused:

This is NOT church, stop preaching and LISTEN to others. i.e. "listening hands" If you have learned this, "hear" what others have to say.

If not, why bother? We have people on this forum whom I promise have learned BOTH systems. Why would you not be open to other knowledge?

FT and TN,

I believe we have had "siu-kew" of communication with Rolling Hand...... :rolleyes:

Peace
Charles :)
BFP

[vingtsunstudent]

i know nothing or little of bak mei so i keep my mouth shut.
so should the people who say they have knowledge of wing chun. but odviously from their ranting they know nothing yet still feel a need put down this style.
ft, we got past this a long time ago, stop worrying about wing chun people who don't know , i please ask you & your students to not bag wc, only the people you have a proplem with not their art.
again i am only up in newcastle & would be most happy to have you or any of your students drop by & say hello, unfortnetly i hate sydney(to many people rushing around for my liking) but if i ever get down i will still let you know so i can visit.
please say hello to andy from anthony if you could(that is if you still see him)
thank you
and again remember that it is not the art that makes the man work but the man himself.
vts

[Buby]

I'm a student of FT's and no where on this thread did sifu or any of us say anything to put down wing chun. We just want to know what R_H is talking about...cause like you said, it's not the style but rather the man using the style.

After all, R_H is the one who started this thread and also began trolling by implying that Bak Mei hands can't deal with wing chun's 6 gates. Yet I don't see you telling R_H to chill.

Your right! I really don't know much about wing chun, other than knowing a few people who have studied it. Personally I have nothing against wing chun...sh*t, if anything, I think its a pretty cool system.

Anyway I feel ya, cause I hold the YKM family very close to me too. The only difference is that I know what YKM is all about and could really care less what anyone has to say about it(not trying to say that you don't know about your WC). I know when **** hits the fan, YKM is no joke...so I just let people sleep till they throw their hand up.

Besides we also have a 6 gate theory, so it's really nothing new to us.


Buby

Yo Dogs ya bes chill
Cause I flip like sifu Gary and his Yau Kung Mun click, wit two kicks and three pheonix fists
Trust dukes
your gonna split from the ging running through the wrist.

[Rolling_Hand]

You'll find the answer in the third form of Wing Chun - Bui Jee
... Look up! feel free to proceed to enter your 8 gates if you're smart enough to recognize it. - RH

[Rolling_Hand]

--a closed mind

A rerun by now, fast-forward to something proactive, go to your local YMCA... - RH

--listen to others

Where is your center?
If you don't have it in your system ?
... go to learn Wing Chun!!! - RH

--open to other knowlege

You're really on upswing. - RH

[feldor]

Please appologize to your parents for, I did not realize I was speaking to a child. :rolleyes:

This is pointless.

R,
Charles :(

[Rolling_Hand]

Though unpleasant differences of opinon enhance and deepen your dialogue. Self-control is important, this is part of the Wing Chun Chi Sau. You don't agree with everyone's position, that's a part of life. - RH

[fiercest tiger]

hows things buddy?

mate, ior my students havent put down any wing chun, we all have respect for it and tnwingstun is my buddy online here that studies wingchun and bak mei.

we are over this alooong time ago! do you know this fool rooling hands?

you really should be talking to him about attitude, ill let my guys know all the same even though we havent said a word!

sui fuw and cloud one isnt my students if thats what you are implying :)

is your sifu back from europe?

ill be going to foster this weekend so ill be passing by newcastle this weekend.. :D

later mate

come & visit us!
http://home.iprimus.com.au/ykm
yaukungmun@hotmail.com

[Rolling_Hand]

Waffing right now will only detract and get the neglient party's attention. Don't worry. You're better at being bossy than you know.

[fiercest tiger]

i take back calling you a FOOL!

:D YOU KNOW BEST!

come & visit us!
http://home.iprimus.com.au/ykm
yaukungmun@hotmail.com

[Yum Cha]

I can't believe you guys give this prat the time of day.

Look at his other postings, anything familiar about them? Wing Chun vs (fill in the blank)?

Resist the temptation...

[This message was edited by Yum Cha on 11-07-01 at 11:01 PM.]

[vingtsunstudent]

sorry if you misunderstood me guys.
i didn't really think you you were putting down wc, i was just trying to tell you not to let dickheads get to you.
vts

[triskellin]

doesn't anyone find it appalling that a 63yr old man, and his daughter-in-law got sent to a coma?! who gives a flying **** if the wing chun guy beat up a bak mei guy, and if wing chun's chain punch is better than bak mei because of that?! :rolleyes: what the hell happened to the morals and values of ppl?? so she threw a chair at a guy... if she's trying to save her hubby's life, then that's good reason enough! and the poor old man... *shakes head* senior citizens should be left alone by thugs! even if he knows kung fu, he's still a SIXTY THREE yr old man getting bashed! how disgusting. how old were the ppl beating him up?? it makes me really mad to know there are ppl out there who have absolutely no respect for their elders!!

To see what you want to see is worse than being blind.

[Rolling_Hand]

--Why would i need to open your gates? Would i be attacking you?

Not compotent to attack your opponent?!?!
Is there something wrong with your style??? - RH

[Rolling_Hand]

--A SIXTY- THREE yr old man...

That was a real life challenge, not a kung fu movie. A big mistake to underestimate your opponent. Your actions may not be wise, but you need to be free in combat. --RH

[tnwingtsun]

Five years of study and you have mastered VT.

Wow,you must be a wiz kid.

Like I said......

You seem to have tunnel vision on the technique aspect but missing the concept of
WT/VT/WC all together.

:rolleyes:

[Rolling_Hand]

--You have master VT

Don't focus on unfinished business, just keep things moving. When the time is right, you'll know the difference between " WATER " and " TEA ".
Are you still sitting on the station?? - RH

--a wiz kid

Gauge your strength carefully. - RH

--but missing...

Pointing fingers won't help. Nor can you expect anyone to be held accountable. Rethink the tactic, it is time back to train kung fu. - RH

[Rolling_Hand]

--this prat the time of day
--Wing Chun vs ( fill in the blank )?

My strength ( Wing Chun ) makes you feel defenseless, but you don't want to overcompensate. Think again, restraint makes a powerful statement. - RH

[sui-fuw]

if you were to attack lil ol mee then your gates would auto open for me,are you not aware of this?didn't your si-fu teach you correctly,that v.t is for self-defence!!! :D oh but then again you must of learnt from books and comics? :D :D :D
rolling pin,go and roll some dough for me :D :D :D thats all the k.f you'll need :D :D :D

[Rolling_Hand]

Just chalk it up to too many chief and not enough braves. - RH

[sui-fuw]

are you a cheif?or is it a chef? :D :D :D whats up,no sense of humour,did i strike a nerve? :D :D :D come on?is that it? :D :D :D

[Rolling_Hand]

The painted ponies go up and down, you're captive from the carousel of time.
A few words for you, when you're older and we talk some more...

[Ginger Fist]

--- if you were to attack lil ol mee then your gates would auto open for me,are you not aware of this?

hey hey susie-foo u lil ol p)ussy hakka boy u. since u admit ur kf sucks it doesn't matter how his gates present. :D

--- didn't your si-fu teach you correctly,that v.t is for self-defence!!!

ahhh ... and the sh*t ur dragon face dead mommy taught u is for ? :D :D :D

--- oh but then again you must of learnt from books and comics?

share with us the schools u closed down susie-foo so that we will know u r real :D

--- rolling pin,go and roll some dough for me thats all the k.f you'll need

susie-foo, go roll around in the honey pot, that's all the kf u'll ever have :p

[Ginger Fist]

--- are you a cheif?or is it a chef? whats up,

y u keep asking the same ? p)ussy hakka boy as the answer is always the same, what's up is ur head and it's up ur a*s*s :p

--- no sense of humour,

must be it. i think u r the best joke around :D

--- did i strike a nerve?

ohhhh, ur dragon face dead mommy taught u dim mak, huh, p)ussy hakka boy. of course it was really secret stink mak based on ur bathing in the honey pot right p)ussy hakka boy? :D :D :D

--- come on?is that it?

yes, that is it, ur stink mak is really, well ... stinky :) :) :)

[Rolling_Hand]

--If you were to attack.... would auto open for me

Keep on dreaming, Santa Claus is coming to town soon. - RH

[jon]

RH you are obviously a troll and the only reason im going to waste my energy here is in the vague hope that by saying this other people wont be encouraged by this kind of debate.
This sort of talking is a detriment to the entire cma population. IF the this actualy happened in the way you discribe it. Then it sounds like the WC guy should be ashamed of himself. NO self respecting master would attack another stylist based purely on insults, let alone one who was also a master. Having said that why on earth would you be PROUD of it??? is that the kind of kung fu your taught? Really if fighting is all you want, buy a darn gun its much quicker and takes less training!
I have a lot of respect for not just Pak Mei but also Wing Chun and its a disgrace to see there names used in this way. If your purpose was just to try and start an arguement then well done. However if your a serious student and judging from 'some' posts you know a little about wc then your a disgrace to both your teacher and the entire art and im sure most would distance themselfs from your comments. I study Hung and there is no way in the world i would take an argument like this as a way of defining the effectivness of an art.
Just my opinion but you will never understand true cma becouse you obviously have no respect for others and any sifu worth his weight would see that a mile away and tune your training accordingly. IE even if your master is good he is proberly teaching YOU rubbish...

you cant win all the time but you cant always lose either...

[sui-fuw]

rolling pin,why how old are you?not old enough to know that some day you will die. :p does a young student deserve less?you talk of chain punches :D :D :D six gates :D :D :D fighting :D :D :D you class me as a young dreamer.is that all you can talk about? :) wow you have great philosophy :p oh i forgot styles beat styles :D :D :D :D :D :D

p.s yes santa is coming,but not to you :)

[TIger Hand]

double post oops

[TIger Hand]

sui f.-

Hahahahaha...... I think rolling hand is gonna be disappointed when the cookies and milk by the chimmney will still be untouched christmas morning.

Awww...

[Rolling_Hand]

--the WC guy should be ashamed of himself...

You aren't the only one questioning a *****y issue. Let's make it clear, the WC guy accepted the challenge to defend his honor. During the fight, the Bak Mei guy's wife was also attacking WC guy with a chair from behind. In other words, two against one. - their fight, their interest - why argue??? Despite paying lip service, it's clear certain people don't want to know the details of what's going on. You're on you own with this one. - RH

--No self respecting

Anyone who could back up his words with action earns my deep respect. - RH

--Why on earth would you be proud of it...

Be true to yourself and your adversary. In other word, be real. - RH

[Rolling_Hand]

--how old / not old enough...

Like I said, we'll chat some more when you're older!! - RH

[sui-fuw]

why chat later can't you handle it from a yungster?what,are you not enough?thats your w/c isn't it,not enough? :D :D :D

[BIU JI]

I think you take yourself far too serious mate !!

VTS- I hope you didn't take my post as some affront towards WC, I was merely stating what someone said and wanted someone who had more knowledge to ellaborate on it!

Why is it everytime something is said about WC people get their knickers in a knot?

I mean I certainly would not want the wrath of WC on my door ;)

[Ginger Fist]

susie-foo spews --- why chat later can't you handle it from a yungster?

there are laws against child abuse p)ussy hakka boy :D :D :D

--- what,are you not enough?

so u r a child with masochistic tendencies. maybe someone will hurt u so u feel good, keep surfing, freak :p

--- thats your w/c isn't it,not enough?

now about all those schools u claim to have closed down susie-foo. share with us ur great deeds, can't be secret as the schools no longer exist, so tell us :rolleyes:

ohhh ... u r total bull**** p)ussy hakka boy & don't even know how to close ur own mouth, ur degenerate hakka sh*t isn't enough is it? ;)

[Rolling_Hand]

--Why chat later can't you handle it...

I have no gifts to give it to you, just be patient, Santa is around the corner.

[Rolling_Hand]

--WC people get their knickers in a knot?

You cannot manage this intricate system, you have to step up to the plate. Time away from the arena brings insight. - RH

[Rolling_Hand]

--I think you take yourself far too serious mate!!

Within all that discussion lies the seed to your next great idea. - RH

[BIU JI]

Exactly what idea is that bright spark !? :eek:

[Rolling_Hand]

Now that everyone's had a chance to vent, you can pick up the pieces and make things right again.

Be aware of the wing chun asking hand - Mansau. - RH

[tnwingtsun]

>Both ! Why ?
Did you lose a sense of direction?<

FYI I moved.

[Rolling_Hand]

It's time to leave the station, good luck to you!!!