The best way to use your hands to block an attack.

[phantom]

Many martial artists use an open palm to block an attack. However, one big problem with this is that your opponent can then grab your blocking hand and bend your fingers back, which is very painful. One way to avoid this problem is to keep your hand clenched in a fist when using it to block. Does anybody know of any disadvantage to blocking in this manner? Thanks in advance.

[dezhen2001]

For me anyway, it's quite difficult to grab a blocking hand even if it is open... it's only there for an instant and then changes, or changes as it is moving... i agree it is painful if caught though :D

blocking with fist clenched: makes the whole arm tense and u block more like using a club than being able to flow in to another movement etc. In my experience anyway.

again, it depends on what you are doing and how it is being used,
good luck,

david

[apoweyn]

has this actually happened to you?

i suppose it's possible, but personally i don't envision leaving my hand in a parrying position long enough to get routinely grabbed by the fingers.

perhaps i'm being naive.


stuart b.

[phantom]

Yes, it did happen to me sparring in class.

[RENEGADE_MONK]

There is no one best way to deal with an attack, reason being is it depends on the type of attack and how you are trained to deal with these varied attacks. Most systems have opened and closed hand blocking methods.

try posing this question to your sifu and see what he says.

[phantom]

Well, my sifu did tell me that blocking with an open palm is not the best way to block because of the danger of your hand being grabbed and your fingers being bent back.

[apoweyn]

it's curious to me that your sifu didn't mention anything beyond that. if it were me, i'd have advised blocking faster and retracting your hand or going immediately on the offensive or...

generally, i block with the arms, not the hands. if the elbow is the pivot point, the closer to your elbow the incoming strike hits, the less chance of your block 'folding' under the pressure.

i also tend to use a lot of 'shields.' cover up as in boxing, then use footwork to zone away from the force a bit.

i do usually maintain an open hand when i block though. as long as you don't leave it out there to be manipulated, all's relatively well. i'd advise you to be a little more proactive in your defense. block and then move, rather than leaving your hand out there.

perhaps i'm just not picturing this correctly though.


stuart b.

[scotty1]

No I think you're right Ap.

Plus, for someone to go from a strike into a finger grab would surely involve non-retraction of the striking hand?
See what I mean? For me to jab and then grab the fingers of my opponents block would involve EITHER not retracting my hand, which would make my strike really awkward, or retracting and then shooting ou for the grab, which would simply take too long.

Unless I'm imagining it wrong too. Maybe a non-retracted strike would be feasible? Or grab on the retraction?

[apoweyn]

scotty1,

exactly. i think you and i are on the same page. that just seems odd to me.

phantom, what does your basic guard look like? i have a much easier time believing that your basic defensive posture just leaves your lead hand too extended and your fingers to accessible to a quick grab.

as scotty said, if someone punches you, you block, and he then grabs your fingers, either it was a really odd attack (not retracted but also not 'stuck' into the target) or your blocking could stand to be quicker and snappier.

i agree with the observation, by the way, that blocking with a closed fist is less relaxed. it could slow the block down marginally, i suppose. but my bigger concern would be that i want to take control of the situation after blocking. and controlling with a closed fist is tough.

so that's my solution. hands open but block with the forearm. then the empty hands are still readily available to take control and counter (ideally speaking, of course).


stuart b.

[Royal Dragon]

I seem to block with my wrists, open hand. I have a block/grab/redirect to open for a plam or cutting slice sort of way of doing things.

Unless I'm dealing with a barage of attacks, then I block with elbows and forarms, depending on foortwrok to get me around and behind the opponent.

[LEGEND]

Sounds like u're SIFU is not even commiting to an intial strike that requires blocking...if he did he wouldn't be able to LOP SAO or pull back your hand...if he was fully commited to the strike.

[fa_jing]

Blocking with the palm is important, but it is less reliable than block with the wrists/forearms as there is less margin for error, in other words a smaller surface that you are trying to make contact with. But all blocks can be grabbed, I mean, if you blocked with your fist, that could be grabbed too. It is important to know what the range of responses is for the action you are taking.
-FJ

[Black Jack]

I block/sheild more like Apoweyn, using the backs of the forearms and wrists, that is if I block at all, most of the time its more of a guide to jam in, put some meat in the way and close, if I can not evade, weave, bob and close.

I think that it would be pretty hard to grab someones fingers and jam them back if that person was putting on a lot of forward pressure and not leaving his open palm out there to manipulate.

I had this question asked of me once about my ax-hand/knife-hand, I flag the thumb on the strike to get a more solid/tense striking surface, the way it is shown by in the WWII methods, the remark was don't you think someone can just reach over and jerk on your thumb, my reply was that I am going to be to busy hitting the guy to leave my hand hanging out in the wind.;)

[guohuen]

I usually use an open palm/wrist inward or outward parry, then the hand is repositioned for attack.

[David Jamieson]

Pak Sao is only one way of deflecting. To "block" as opposed to "deflect" is different.

If someone strikes at you, you slap there hand away and then... they grab your fingers? Just continue striking.

Chinese martial arts contains many handforms with some key handforms used for specific offensive or defensive tactics. It's not all "tickling the chi" you know.

Anyway, a palm slap deflection is not a bad defence. It depends on position and your choice of which hand to use, where to go (inside|outside|step). It's only useful relative to the attack also.

peace

[MonkeySlap Too]

Why in tarnation would I want to 'block' with my palm?

[Royal Dragon]

You start by blocking with the plam, but end up sticking, redirecting and GRABBING the hand.

I have to adit, I don't do it anymore, as I have found it's easier to block with the crook of the wrist as you get superior "Wrap", and thus better controll and less chance of missing.

I still do it occasionally, when I block with the palm to the inside, circle around and up from underneath to catch the next punch, which blocks and redirects with the crook of the wrist's back, and the hand I blocked with the palm now just follows it's momentum around and gets sucked right into the face about temple height.

I used it successfully many time over the years against Kick Boxers and other punchers. It seems utterly useless against guys trained by Choi though

[JerryLove]

You have a large variety of manners in which to use one are to defend against another; and there are so many variables as to make anthing shy of some video rather lacking. Some basics related to your question.

By first concern is to eccho the comments from page one; what are you doing to get your finger grabbed? I don't know about your oppoinent, but my abaility to grab a finger on a hand that is in the proccess of slapping or retreating from a slap is rather non-existant. This varies signifigantly from my abailty to grab a finger during a grapple or from someone who is not actively swinging his hand (for example, with an open-hand guard posture with his hands in range of mine).

The advantages of the open hand are several, firstly, an open hand is faster than a closed hand. Should you wish to punch, the act of closing your hand while punching actually speeds it up. Open hands are generally easier to manipulate because of reduced tension on the arms, they are also capable of "grabbing", which can be rather problamatic from a closed hand position; finally, the opne hand is more durable, and unlikely to be injured should you impact something hard and point with it (like an elbow).

The nature of what to block with and how is going to vary greatly and be bewong the scope of your general question. In short, if you are having trouble with opponents who can grab your finger when you block, I would reevaluate your blocking method more than your choice in hand position.

[FistOfTheNorthSide]

I think an open hand is a faster hand. There's different reasons to use a hard block or to parry instead. Dodging is always nice. Try the strike as a block aproach like shing yi and lots of other styles emphasise. I like to think if they grabbed my fingers I'd punch them with the other hand or china them but there's lots of what ifs. I was always taught don't just block.and at least follow up with a stike if not striking while you block.

[PaulLin]

Originally posted by Kung Lek
Pak Sao is only one way of deflecting. To "block" as opposed to "deflect" is different.

If someone strikes at you, you slap there hand away and then... they grab your fingers? Just continue striking.


Totally agree. It is better not to stop your opponent's strike with a block. Keep the motion continuing. Plus, sit there like a sitting duck and blocking punch is bad idea, not only you deflecting strikes with hands, you also should be moving your body position to suit your counter moves. Just sit there and thinking of not to get hit will put you in disadvantage position. You must focus on what is your move, what you want to do without pulse.

[Chang Style Novice]

After careful consideration, I have come to the conclusion that the best way to use your hands to block an attack is to hold a big stick in them.:D

edit - for real, though, I'm used to keeping my hands open for the purpose of sticking and seeking out opportunities for jamming and controlling my opponent's movement. I don't think there are any absolute answers to this question, though - like so much of what is debated around here, it comes down to the person and how he or she trains.

[PaulLin]

Originally posted by Chang Style Novice
After careful consideration, I have come to the conclusion that the best way to use your hands to block an attack is to hold a big stick in them.:D


Why not hold a bumb in your hand? It will surely to ward off your opponent :D

just joking.

[omegapoint]

Whether you should use an open or closed hand block is kind of case dependent. If your opponent is throwing a looping hook punch to your head and you have enough distance to react with an open lead hand parry, where you deflect ,say, a right hook with your left (lead hand) to the inside, and move outside his right arm, then a "slapping" open hand block can be very effective. You can also use the open hand to catch the hooking arm as you move outside of it, and pull your opponent into a counter strike.

Conversely, if your lead hand is balled into a fist and you have adequate maai (combat distance) you can use the lateral movement explained previously, and when outside his right punch, you can strike his arm with your left ulna styloid process (pinky side wrist bone) by "twisting" the strike-block into the attacking arm, as you move outside it. The arm was traveling at an inside lateral arc to the aggressors body and you can "help" it on its way by striking it and stealing your opponents balance. A follow up straight punch, backhand, etc. with the same hand to the face/head will often find its mark.

To facilitate full efficiency while performing closed and open hand blocks you can use as your guard a forward closed hand (like a western boxer) and a rear spare block or guard hand (open hand which protects your centerline or solar plexus). Using both hands to block and strike aids in defensive and offensive efficiency. For example, in the closed hand block-strike I detailed, your right spare block (rear hand) can be used as a controlling parry, checking the opponents hook, and if you want, pulling him into a strike or finishing with control of his right hand.


For hooks in close slapping is not as effective. Here you can block hooks with your "wrist bones" at the distal biceps (near crook) or forearms. Uppercuts are good here as are "sneaky" short, straight or hooking punches to the face and head.


With a little variation and experimentation on your own, these principles may be applied to defending against many linear and arcing strikes.

There is absolutely no way to detail all the ways you can block, deflect, or strike a strike. Most of the time ashisabaki (foot movement) and taisabaki (body movement) are more important than blocking. Getting superior position or being at an angle where you can do what you want with a myriad of weapons (both harms and legs) is the difference between the novice and the advanced "martialist".

Don't overextend on punching, blocking and kicking. Try to bring your strikes back as fast as they went out without short-arming a tech. Try and maintain balance, root, base, whatever you want to call it, and your techs will be more effective. Move with quickness and not speed necessarily, and control your breathing. Watch the higher ranking cats in your training hall and "bite" what is useful and formulate ideas about sparring with you in mind. After all who knows you better than yourself?

Next time someone grabs your fingers, immediately give him a good, but noninjurious, low kick. The key with standing grappling is to go with the lock and counter with the Chinna that your sifu has taught you. You can also use your other arm to strike down on the outside crook of the arm that grabbed you, using your ulna styloid process, with either a shuto (knife hand) or closed downward block. The former is fast and relaxed strike b/c there is not as much antagonistic tensing of the muscles. Use gravity and sinking power (bend your knees). If you cut down just right you'll hit his perinterosseus nerve (p.i.n.) he will feel an "uncomfortable" sensation.

There is a time and place for everything.... Peace and sorry so long!

[Ka]

Instead of the whole Blocking idea

How about striking at the oncoming limb while moving to an angle to make the attacker change his direction of attack.

ps Omegapoint great post dude.

[guohuen]

Nice descriptions RD. That's pretty much my favorite parry. I do it like wrist to wrist in both directions.

[NPMantis]

phantom, if you're going to block with palm you should never have your fingers open for an opponent to grab, in my school we are taught to block with fingers bent so that that tips almost touch the palm of the hand, this way, even if you do not block properly you will not get your fingers hit or injured.

We usually block with the forearm though.

Hope this helps!

[omegapoint]

Originally posted by Ka

ps Omegapoint great post dude.

Thank you sir, for your kind words. Hope my rant helps some of you. Have a great week!