Brutal technique?

[hughes]

Hi guys, in kinda an offshoot from Merry's discussion of technique in punching (pentrating/fa jing), what about technique in unorthodox situations?

For example, in a situation where the sh*t has really hit the fan, lets say its do or die, you have the advantage, you've mounted your opponent and see fit to start pummeling them. Would you say technique enters into it?

As stated many times before, power is a full-body affair, starting at the feet, transfering through the legs, hips, body and releasing through the arms to the fist. Is this possible in a situation where there is no orthodox stance being used? In this case, instead of power going up, up and out, it would have to go up, up and down, and also is the transition possible at all in such an akward position?

What do you all think? (not just my example, but other situations where technique can be overlooked/difficult or impossible to achieve)

[Merryprankster]

You'll get some hip torque, but from the mounted position, the trick is to use your bodyweight as a battering ram on the opponent, not just arm punches. You can also throw some more loopy type stuff that works--

at this point just pound on them and maintain the mount :)

[Mr Punch]

As Merry said.

This technique of dropping your bodyweight through your punches is found in a lot of arts.

For example, aikido isn't renowned for its groundwork but there is an expression 'keep your weight underside' which applies both to rooting in standing stances, and the kind of 'two-way energy' that Braden mentioned in the horse stance thread, which is a very common concept in aiki, especially in the kneel.

The kneel is often criticized for being an obsolete stance, because of the obvious applications in samurai households, but a lot of the dynamics can also be applied to the mount. You can keep your bodyweight down through a stable root to keep the mount effective, get an internal rising effect (think of a vertical version of the splitting motion in wingchun) to 'drop' your bodyweight back down through your fists. Kind of a 'directional relaxation'?!

[Dragon]

Personally if your goal is to do massive amounts of damage from a mounted position, I would not punch but instead use Elbow strikes. You can power them with twisting of the torso combined with dropping your body wieght into the strike. 1 elbow should be enough to end it if you strike the temple, jaw, side of neck or drop a forearm directly onto the nose or throat.
Of course if your going to do that, your likely going to end up in prison. Use of force is a fine line and if a judge feels you were excessive, your going to do time.
Its better to walk away then to die, but against a single attacker and you already have the advantage of a mount, I would advise a strike to the nose followed by one to the solar plexes leaving him winded and watery eyed. Thats enough to difuse the situation, yet not causing massive trauma.

[Kilik]

i think technique wouldn't fly outta the window if you had a guy mounted. I would agree with dropping you weight to pin him down and focusing on weak areas on the face like the nose which will break pretty easily if a punch is delivered effectively. Nothing beats a good 'ol slap in the chops. plus it's not as severe as an elbow strike which could disfigure the guy if you get out of hand...my two cents worth...

[omegapoint]

I love punching and kicking, but if I had someone mounted and wanted to end the fight quickly, and without blood, I would punch homey a couple of times and when he goes to defend with his hands, control one arm and execute an Americana lock.

Judo (newaza), submission wrestling and BJJ have good techs for this type of scenario.

Safe training!

[scotty1]

I don't think I could maintain a mount unless the guy was already weakend, as I'm so light. So I would (as stated before) pop off a couple of good shots and get off before I was thrown off.

Good points about jail though.

[hughes]

Thanks for the replies guys (that rhymes). Good responses, Dragon, what you said reminds me a lot of a K.O. in the UFC, in fact its in sherdogs knockout highlight clip, a guy has his opponent mounted and decides to use elbows, he rains down many and blood positively flies out the guys nose. Also, scotty 1, i don't know much about the mount, but i think while weight is important, if you position correctly, weight isn't THAT much of an issue, unless you are like really really light, but even then if weight is distributed towards upper torso your opponent would have a tough time moving you.

[chingei]

Originally posted by Dragon
1 elbow should be enough to end it if you strike the temple, jaw, side of neck or drop a forearm directly onto the nose or throat.
.

maybe, but I wouldn't bank on it.

[JWTAYLOR]

Scotty1, you'de be surprised how well you can maintain position in the mount even if you are light.

Especially a good, high mount.

We have allot of women in my Saturday class, and we always drill the mount, getting into and out of it. Once you learn that you can move YOUR weight in the mount you get the idea that you can move with them to stay over them. Just keep upright when moving and down let them pull you down to bridge you.

As an aside, if someone has little experience on the ground and you mount then, just give them a little space to move around and they almost ALWAYS give you their back. A wonderfull phenominon.

As far as punching in the mount, it is a bit different. But why would you just punch? Think about it. If you were in a standup situation and you knew that your punches wouldn't be full force, would you still just punch away at the head? Fu(k no. You'd go for eye pokes, you'de nail them in their throat. You'd throw a downward heal palm into the bridge of their nose.

All of that "soft target" stuff doesn't dissapear when you get your opponent mounted, it becomes all the more clear. It's a hell of allot easier to eye gouge your opponent when he is sitting directly underneath you with his arms up than when he is standing in front of you throwing punches.

JWT