Hey BlackJack:TKD Combatives!

[rogue]

After General Choi died I decided to get his TKD encyclopedias. Well besides p!ssing of my wife with having 15 volumes of martial arts books added to my library they are pretty interesting. And sometimes very funny.

In the self defense section (volumn 5) it even has a large section on defenses against a rifle with bayonet (Dae Chong Gum). Choi also included a very large section on how to defend oneself while seated in various kinds of chairs and sofa, I guess they get a lot of attacks at ****tail parties over in Korea. :D

The counter-knife work is against Japanese style blade work so I'm not sure how effective it'd be now. But it does use a lot of off angle and hit.

Choi even included a lot of ground work from various positions, some grappling though most if it is striking and kicking, and a subset of it can also be found in Marc MacYoungs book on Floor Fighting. If you're both on the floor and not in grappling range this stuff is pretty darn good.

Oddly I doubt many American TKD instructors have ever looked at these books. While I disagree with Choi's sine wave power generation theory and the wisdom of some of the techniques, the guy was serious about TKD as a fighting art.

[Black Jack]

Hey bro,

IMHO its all about the man behind the style. I once met a old school tkd guy here in lombard, the gent was in his mid 50's and one not to be messed with, fast and aggressive.

What was funny was when I asked him to show me some of his tkd self defense skills, he was ex-korean military, he did not do one single high kick, all hands, fast jabs, palm heels, and even elbows to the sternum and temple, all direct and no flu-flu.

Me and my bud walked away laughing, a little bit more reminded on how it really is the fighter, his mindset and his experiances, it's always nice to get humbled on ones perceptions, to show there are exceptions to the rules.

The fact that long gun defenses are even in there shows that in the begining it had roots in self defense. You can see the same in old school judo.

There is a south korean special forces system called tukong moosul I believe. Ever hear anything about it? I think it was used by the infamous ROK Marines?

How are the long gun defenses?

[guohuen]

I went through basic with a former ROK Sgt. (it was a point of honor for ROKs to serve in the US Army) He rarely kicked at all. What little he did was from the knees down . Alot of punches, palm strikes, elbows and knees mixed with a lot of joint locks and a few take downs. Kim Dong Su was a tough cookie.

[rogue]

I just checked out the tukong moosul site. Could be interesting. I remember seeing a ROK soldier doing a perfect flying side kick into some rioters face, and he still had his boots on. I've heard stories from some Vietnam vets about the ROK, I think they were called the Tigers. One US guy didn't believe they were taking out the VC they claimed they were (hardly using firearms if I remember), so they started bringing back the VC heads.

It's amazing how the Korean MA went from being some pretty serious sh*t to the brunt of half the martial arts jokes. And they did it mostly to themselves. Sometimes success is the worst thing that can happen. I'm just lucky to have good instructors and a master that still remembers the more interesting parts of the art, now I just have to get to the level to learn them.

One interesting thing about the takedowns and throws in the book is Choi included what counters to watch for if after the throw your opponent still had some fight left in him. That's something I can't remember seeing anywhere else. If Choi had added a little basic BJJ it'd be a pretty complete art.