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Hendrik
07-12-2002, 10:44 PM
WCK has two types of histories.
They are Lineage history and the root of Art history.

The lineage part depents a great deal on who is writing it.

The root of Art part has to satisfy
Purpose, Principle, Architecture Vision, signature of dominant Core technics, implementation, ....

WCK is not a collection of fragmented technics over time. WCK is not an evolution of a collective fragmented style. One can not just add everything up and claim this and that.

Often, people is trying to use the Lineage history combine with Hung Mun or other history to explain and Justified where is the root of WCK from. And ofcause he who does that will end up that his lineage is the oldest.....

Not too long ago some master of other style even claim that his stlye has all WCK....
For me, he might be a master in his own style but he doesn't know WCK.
Master or best fighters title cannot substitute
the facts in the root of art history.


What is the point to do research if the preset conclusion is to prove one's lineage ( with whatever unspecific, unrelated, oral/society/history/relegion data can be found but disregard the root of the arts.
) is the oldest.

On the other hand, what is the point to do research if deep in one's heart preseted to never belive there is a dominant root of Art for WCK which lead the search to a unconclusive result.


Finally, what is the point to do research if deep in one's heart preseted to no matter what other find one has an attitude of " oh, I know it already. Mine is the best."

S.Teebas
07-13-2002, 12:14 AM
Not too long ago some master of other style even claim that his stlye has all WCK....

Yeah i heard about that hung gar guy who said that. I cant see the resembelence. The concepts seem radically different to me.

reneritchie
07-13-2002, 04:09 PM
People have long said that perception was reality, and many have taken that to mean if they can mold perception, they can mold reality. Unfortunately, because of pulp novels, Kung Fu flicks, and the like, there already exists a rich and long standing fantasy culture (like Sinbad or Disney's Alladin to Arabia). Tweeking this seems to be a good way to mold perception, and hence reality. It becomes a grand farce where fiction is now defacto truth and the original culture is scoffed at and treated as bunk. Since people have rice bowls to protect, egos to feed, and legacies to create, this has been, and probably always will be, difficult to deal with. IMHO, education is the only answer. As more scholars write well researched, clearly referenced, logically supportable works without blatent conflicts of interest, as these works are disseminated, and as the future generations learn not to grant martial arts teachers instant god-like faith, hopefully some small steps can be taken.

Rgds,

RR

Hendrik
07-13-2002, 05:10 PM
With Lineage history, an art can never be complete.
With Technical root history, an art had never been incompleted.


Time to close the Chapter in Lineage history,
Start the Technical root history............

yuanfen
07-13-2002, 08:56 PM
With little history- correctly practicing the art takes you as far
as you want to go or can go in doing it well.. Lineage or art history are both prone to stories, agendas or problems of methodology of distinguishing between propositions, operational definitions and non tautological verififcation. Slippery slopes..

Hendrik
07-13-2002, 10:52 PM
Apple operating system is not Microsoft Window.
And Microsoft cannot claim Apple steal their window idea.


Ermei, Shao Lin, Wu Dang,
Esoteric buddhism, Zen buddhism, and Daoism have cultivation characteristics of their own. They are Well document, Well preserve, and can be cross verified.

There is no Gray for the root of art. There are only people who resist to see the raising sun.


Indeed, The Root of Art has to begin with the Raising Sun....
When the Sun Raises one praise the spring.

Sun always is there but Spring can never be Everlasting since there are always winter.

Siu Lien Tau is about Sun not about Everlasting.

TargetAlex
07-13-2002, 10:52 PM
A slight twist to an old aphorism by Basho: "Do not seek to follow in the footsteps of the masters, seek what they sought."

Hendrik
07-13-2002, 10:57 PM
To see it as it is is Zen.
In the name of Zen is no longer Zen.

yuanfen
07-14-2002, 03:43 PM
True, but one has to tame bone and muscle and breath and mind!

Hendrik
07-14-2002, 07:17 PM
There are different approaches to condition mind/Qi/Body.
The be clear about what is what is also Zen.

black and blue
07-15-2002, 06:27 AM
Apple's OS is most certainly NOT Windows... it rocks - Windows sucks.

Microsoft stole it from Apple who purchased it from Xerox.

As for all the Wing Chun stuff, I'm too new to the art to comment


:)

dezhen2001
07-15-2002, 06:54 AM
like ur post about MacOS!

As for wing chun: who will know the real history? Is it important to know the definitive history or understand the skill? :)

david