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firepalm
07-17-2001, 12:06 AM
Now that Beijing is confirmed for the Olympics & the likelyhood of Wushu getting into the Olympics is pretty much set (recent Chinese newspapers have stated it as confirmed), how many out there will consider the change or foresee wushu becoming a part of their school ciriculum? Just curious.

Subitai
06-20-2003, 06:38 AM
Like it or not, it will help the (sport / M-art).

http://www.usawushu.com/resources/index.html


It doesn't matter what gets you there, so long as you train hard. Eventually, as wushu rises, more and more people will hopefully be interested in other more tradiional arts.

what ever gets there man,

"O"

MasterKiller
06-20-2003, 06:46 AM
I'd rather watch Wushu than Sport Karate.

Brad
06-20-2003, 06:47 AM
It's still not 100% in...

Hopefully they'll come up with better set up for events than the crap that was proposed before. Personally, I'd like to see them do away with international compulsory routines. Or at least regulate them to only being used for qualification for the team.

GeneChing
06-20-2003, 09:08 AM
The terms of its addition aren't clear. Don't trust any information that you hear from the CMA community because we're all spinning in circles. Remember when we were all saying san shou was going to go in. And look was pankration has been saying about being in Athen's but they haven't even applied for official status.
Nothing is certain until the IOC says, and even that is subject to change.

TonyM.
06-20-2003, 09:09 AM
It's a sub sport like syncronized swimming and should not be included. While their at it maybe they could weed out some of the other sub sports. Then getting out of bed with bankofamerica would be in order. Maybe if wushu is completely rejected the pathetic cheats at usakwf would get a life.

Vapour
06-20-2003, 12:47 PM
This is an interesting question.

Do you think TKD contributed greatly to the martial arts. Many say TKD and it's McDojo tendency epitomise what is wrong with martial arts. But many people who cuss TKD often started their martial arts in TKD.

As of Wushu in Olympic, no, I don't think it's a good idea. As far as "Olympic" Wushu goes, it's just gymnastic adopted to martial arts. Open Pushing Hand competition is much more productive for the martial arts in the long run, IMO.

Brad
06-20-2003, 01:17 PM
Maybe if wushu is completely rejected the pathetic cheats at usakwf would get a life.
If wushu were accepted into the Olympics, it's my understanding that the USAWKF would have to change a lot of things about their organization in order to become recognized by the USOC. As they're set up right now, they wouldn't be elligable to send a team to the Olympics.

firepalm
06-20-2003, 01:24 PM
Sport Wushu is here to stay, like it or not, and for the most part one of the better organized martial arts out there. It is however not the be all & end all of Chinese martial arts, just one aspect of it. Folk out there should just come to accept that it is just the 'performance sport aspect' of Chinese martial arts. Few Asian martial arts have the diversity that we have & I think this is one of the things that will carry CMA forward. Finally if Sport Wushu makes it into the Olympics it will bring greater exposure to Chinese martial arts, maybe not the exposure that some traditionalists would like nonetheless exposure.

My two cents:D

xiao
10-31-2005, 03:14 PM
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2005%5C10%5C17%5Cstory_17-10-2005_pg2_17

lkfmdc
10-31-2005, 03:24 PM
what a surprise! ....... NOT! :rolleyes:

Mortal1
10-31-2005, 04:39 PM
That is too bad.

GLW
10-31-2005, 05:11 PM
Not at all surprising...

No big support structure...

All rules and judging aspects are controlled by a single country

That single country - with the exception of the Sanshou arena - would dominate ALL medals in the event...either by skill or a deft change of rules...

Given the ethics problems the IOC has had in recent times, they would reject Wushu as a sport based on the ethical issues alone....like they NEED another headache.

But there are simple logistical and appeal issues as well.

Like NO ONE could see this one coming a year ago....

I am aghast....:):eek:

MightyB
11-01-2005, 06:30 AM
Am I the only one who's dissapointed in hearing this?

All politics aside, it would be cool to see Wushu grow into an international sport that's endorsed by the Olympics.

This is really dissapointing.

GLW
11-01-2005, 08:49 AM
On one hand I would have liked to see some form of Chinese Martial Arts in the Olympics...and Wushu (Taolu AND Sanshou) seemed to be the best fit.

On the other, having worked with the organizations and having witnessed the things that go on in the US, Canada, Mexico, various South American countries, South Africa, and the PRC in regards to judge training, recognition, money, events, etc... I am NOT disappointed.

To move forward with such a flawed and inherently biased and unfair setup would only end up being a big scandal. The IWuF should really focus on getting their act together and getting out of the mindset they have always had and build an organization and sport that everyone can view with pride.

They also need to focus on building an infrastructure for competitors. How can they hope to compete with things like gymnastics as an event when there are no real athlete development orgs focusing on getting young kids involved and keeping them involved.

The contradiction is that the PRC wants to hold all of the cards for control of the IWuF. Fine and dandy....but what comes with THAT territory is that they also have to offer to pay some bills, supply help in building and promoting an infrastructure in countries, and in short working to develop Wushu throughout the world in words, deeds, AND Money

firepalm
11-01-2005, 11:17 AM
Bad news about CMA surviving a little longer is it's in YKW's one dimensional bonehead perspective. :eek:

Mortal1
11-01-2005, 11:41 AM
"Good news. CMA may survive a little bit longer."

You have got to be kidding. That is a blow to kungfu training. Just because it is different then what you do doesn't make it any less valid. When a good kungfu movie comes out is it a blow to kungfu because the actors do wushu? Enrollemnt went up big time at my old school after crouching tiger came out. I don't see anything wrong with that.

"Bad news about CMA surviving a little longer is it's in YKW's one dimensional bonehead perspective."

lol Agreed.

MightyB
11-01-2005, 01:31 PM
It's funny how I don't hear complaints about how the Kodokan controls everything in Judo circles... Although I do hear nothing but complaints and animosity in TKD circles between the ITF and the WTF.

Of course there were going to be many problems with the first appearance of Wushu in the Olympics, but you have to start somewhere.

mantis108
11-01-2005, 02:33 PM
I don't agreed that Kung Fu will survive a little longer in fact it's pretty much hanging by a thread. But I and with YouKnowWho all the way on this one.

Please check this thread started by me on the Mantis broad:

http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=39042

Modern Wushu is pure mockery of tradition period. It's like the Manchurians court wanted uniforms so some smart Han tribe official gave them those robes that's symbolic of animal (peac0c k plume hat, hoof cuffs, etc). So the Han tribe can always make fun of those "Royals" (pun intended with the selected few who did Wushu in the beginning). The smart TCMA masters that were given the task of designing Wushu and presented it to the Communist did the same trick. But ignorance is bliss I suppose but it doesn't turn what is wrong into right.

The line between Wushu and Kung Fu has to be drawn firmly. That's the only way to preserve real skills.

Mantis108

Mortal1
11-01-2005, 03:17 PM
If you master wushu basics you could master any traditional style.

But if everyone has a potbelly and does there forms slow, mixed with some sloppy sparring, like most traditional schools. And every Sifu has 3 years experiance. Only these people are the true slayers of TCMA.

Not sport wushu.

TonyM.
11-01-2005, 06:40 PM
I'm glad wushu won't be at the olympics. It has enough problems as it is without hanging out with organized crime types. If you think the triads are bad wait until you get even a glimpse of the camorra.

xifanghong
11-02-2005, 04:40 AM
No Wushu at the Olympics. Great.

There is no case for Wushu being a continuation of TCMA, or an evolved form. It was an intervention by a massive political power. Replacing one with the other over the course of a few boardroom decisions.

Modern Wushu is just a floor gymnastics comp that is modelled on kung fu shapes. It has a judging system that judges forms on a points system that requires specific technical moves. And it's a slap in the face of Chinese Culture.

And please don't be confused by Sanda. Sanda is simply the Chinese national kicboxing system/ regional rules. It's as separate from Modern Wushu as K-1 is.

The biggest problem is all these Wushu people who promote it as Kungfu. And the amount of magazines and media who eat it up.

Not having it in the olympics buys a lot of time.

But anyway, the olympics. The air won't be cleaned up in time and al the athletes are going to choke.

Wong Fei Hong
11-02-2005, 06:47 AM
modern wushu taolou is gay and has nothing to do with martial arts so i dont see why anyone should mind wether its in the olympics or not :D Its like saying oh no flicking bogeys has been removed from the olympics.
All the forms look the same its all one basic longfist form with butterfly kicks flips and jumps and then depending on what style you are meant to do they stop and pull a pose, so its like jump flip roll kick fly stop, erm pull EAGLE pose run kick flip flop get your balls out butterfly kick high kick flying kick flip.
Now if you want you can substitute the eagle pose for mantis or tiger, dragon, bald minged beagle. And you are a master of 148 wushu forms.
Or you could do the nanchuan southern form , which is the conglomeration of 128 southern styles into one modern wushu form,the only souther wushu form, and that actually looks more like karate on methamphetamine.

On another note i cant believe the tkd guys have a federation called wtf hehehehehe

MightyB
11-02-2005, 07:49 AM
I watched two of Nick Gracenin's students compete in a TCMA empty hands and Weapons forms competition and they both took top honors. They won because they were good.

Yeah, the contemporary competition forms are too prancy and tin foil weapons are quite "gay" (YKW's term) BUT they are now trying to base judging on the level of difficulty of the forms. It's true that they emphasize acrobatics and not function because the acrobatics are harder to perform. Should this be addressed, yes. The problem comes from the need for publicity and audience appeal and the difficulty on agreeing on what's important. How do you get agreement on who expresses jing or who's form execution determines who's a better fighter?

Can there be a way to create a couple of compulsary TCMA forms that could be used for competition?

Plus, why is it so wrong for a TCMA teacher to teach a contemporary Wushu form so that their students would be able to compete in the international games? There are competitive Tai Chi forms now being taught that are less "gay" than the prancy forms... why couldn't a TCMA school adopt those for forms and then compete in San Shou, Shuai Chou, and push hands competitions for fighting?

GLW
11-02-2005, 08:20 AM
Actually, back about 10 or 12 years ago, BEFORE there was a huge schism between the Kuoshu folks and the USAWKF, a couple of people were asked to put together a southern and a northern TRADITIONAL routine.

I never saw the southern one but the northern one looked like a combination of Chaquan and Paoquan...with a very heavy dose of Tantui as the glue that held it all together.

The age of a routine has nothing to do with Traditional or Contemporary...and I can say that the northern WAS Traditional in approach, flow, flavor, power, AND definitely retained applications.

It went nowhere.

The different teachers either would not or could not step up to learn a single routine and agree to simply add it to their curriculum. The idea was that it would be used as a qualifier and then individuals who made it past qualifiers did their own traditional set....

TCMA folks preferred to argue.

MightyB
11-02-2005, 08:42 AM
I didn't know that TCMA was so close to having enough organization to become a truly international sport.

GLW, do you know if the form survives and anybody who'd know it?

Also, who's in the lead, Kuoshu or USAWKF?

There's hope yet...

Mortal1
11-02-2005, 09:06 AM
If You Could Do Wushu Long Fist Well, You Can Learn Any Traditional Form Easily.

GLW
11-02-2005, 10:37 AM
The ORIGINAL intent of both the Kuoshu Federation and the USAWKF was to be a national body that organized CMA in the US and then interacted with international organizations and events in one voice.

The big schism occurrec - in part due to Huang Chienliang and Anthony Goh not working well together...but..should I say it, that conflict was at best a minor distraction.

The REAL issue was backing

The Kuoshu Federation, as if anyone did not know, is backed in large part by people in the ROC (Taiwan).

The IWuF is the PRC body for Contemporary Wushu.

Now, if you have an organization that supposedly supports Sanshou, Traditional CMA, and Contemporary Wushu (the idea of the USAWKF), you SHOULD be able to have a connection the the IWuF AND the Kuoshu people.

The Traditional Taolu rules COULD be made to be the same for both. The Sanshou rules could be used for Sanshou and the Kuoshu rules for Kushu events. Kuoshu did not really do any Contemporary Wushu so that was a non-issue...back then...

But the 50+ year old Kuomintang vs. Mao issue came up. Kuoshu heads in ROC said you can't be Kuoshu if you have anything to do with the PRC. The PRC folks didn't really care.

So, the ROC/PRC issue immigrated to the US and caused a major schism in the CMA arena.

Neither body is doing all that well.

There are no USAWKF regionals as there were before 1999. USAWKF has its Team Trials and its annual national event...that has gotten much smaller than the 600 - 700 competitors back in the pre-2000 days.

Kuoshu has a bit more events...supposedly...but they still have the single big thing sponsored by Huang.

It is more fractured than ever....and no real unifier or ANYTHING on the horizon.

As for the routine, I know who put it together...but they may have thrown away all notes and documents on it after it all fell apart.

David Jamieson
11-02-2005, 04:42 PM
looks like contemporary wushu is gonna get it's face punchd in by an overweight xingyi prac named bubba. lol

there will always be a division between the gymnastic routine of modern wushu and combat effective martial art.

mma can't see the difference and just clumps it all into one pile.


most people because of the movies can't tell the difference between traditional kungfu and wushu.

wushu is an art form gymnastic dance with martial expression.

To modify it back into martially applicable would change it entirely.

a lot of flash, very little martial substance and frankly it wouldn't be any easier for a wushu athlete to learn combatr skills than anyone.

It's apples and oranges, ballet vs jiterbugging etc etc.

People who practice authentic chinese martial arts don't mind wushu being around, but they don't make the error of calling it a fighting art. lol

Sifu Darkfist
11-02-2005, 04:44 PM
If You Could Do Wushu Long Fist Well, You Can Learn Any Traditional Form Easily.

movement means very little, try getting the modern wus shu expert to project the power in a baji one punch. Ba Ji Looks simple but perplexes even the best althletes including the gymnasts dubbed Wushu artists. Im sorry but YouKnowWho is right on target here.

GLW
11-02-2005, 05:01 PM
"To modify it back into martially applicable would change it entirely."



Not really. A lot depends on if you have ties back to the originators of Contemporary Wushu or not.

The original intent was to keep what WAS traditional and simply create a set of standards that allowed for competition in a way that would be an apples to apples view of each athlete.

Now, what it is becoming is different. Seems the more that those in that generation die off and / or retire, the weaker the link is.

Mind you, my roots are traditional northern. So, to me, the modifications required for taking changquan, jian, dao, gun, chiang back to traditional are not as big as if I were a southern stylist.

The 42 Taijiquan WITHOUT the tornado kicks and such are no big stretch that way either.

But....that is the OLD set of compulsories. The new ones...well, the new changquan is simply a bad routine. It doesn't flow at all. They took some things that are merely training exercises for balance, flexibility, etc... and included them in the routine as if they were martial instead of Gong aspects....

Now, the old changquan...only minor changes would be required to make it fit within a traditional Chaquan framework.

BUT...the bigger thing is what is STATED to be judged and what actually IS judged.

The RULES talk about each move being required to exhibit apporpriate speed, power, focus, martial intent, understanding of the technique in regards to attack and defense....

In practice, the judges tend to do whatever the folks from the Beijing group do...flash, speed instead of stances, stability, and power..no focus if you can get to the next pose and show fire... that type of thing.

BUT...what they give points for that way is in direct contradiction to what they SAY they are looking for in the actual judging rules and training.



"frankly it wouldn't be any easier for a wushu athlete to learn combatr skills than anyone"


Not really true.

IF the person can throw a punch with correct form, has stable stances, good and fast footwork, is very flexible, has good basics, a good sense of kinesthetics, etc... They WOULD find combat skills easier to master. They would also have a lot more weapons at their disposal simply due to the things they can physically do.

BUT....the big thing is that NOT everyone CAN or SHOULD be trained in the combat aspects. There ARE people that are naturals. There are also those that absolutely do not have the predatory approach or that have too much fear of getting hit, injury, or whatever, to ever be able to learn to use it.

There are also those that can learn to do things in a controlled environment...like a class...that will always freeze and panic in the real situation. This issue of bravery and ability to react appropriately...that to a large extent might not be teachable....can be as much as 50% of the proposition.

Mortal1
11-03-2005, 10:08 AM
Sifu Darkfist

It might interest you to know I train Baji also. I have a good wushu base and learned the form in just over a month. I also train wingchun. I am well versed with short power. Guess what though. If you could do long fist, short power is a cake walk. My teacher has shown me applications for many wushu moves. It is more martial then people give it credit for.

Also wushu players have the best kungfu basics I have ever seen. There stances are PERFECT. If you could do perfect wushu stance and move in and out of them effectively you could learn ANY other style in short time and make it look and feel better then veterans of that style. True the focus is on forms. I don't see why that is such a problem for people.

GLW
11-03-2005, 11:47 AM
:confused:



"Another example, almost all the LF forms, when you punch out your right hand, your left hand will always pull back to your waist. For different combat purpose, your left hand could be at different position, above your head, in front of your chest, below your knee, ..."

What....I guess i will have to go back and undo all I have learned even in Tan Tui where this is not the case. The pull back to the waist or chest is common for ALL martial art forms (TKD, Karate, Northern LF, ...) but in Chaquan system and other LF systems. there are multitudes of ways to execute the non striking hand. From over head with a block grab, to a cover down and punch over, to a back hook, and on and on...It DOES change from technique to technique and routine to routine.





"PRC Wushu team designed a set of forms for competition standard and won't allow anyone to change it. "

There are new routines out all the time. They DON'T allow you to change the COMPULSORIES. They ARE COMPULSORY STANDARD ROUTINES for competition - meaning EVERYONE does the same thing so the judges can compare apples to apples.



"Is that a good comment or bad comment? If you punch high then your bow-arrow stances should be high. If you punch low then your bow-arrow stance should be high. If you spin then your bow-arrow stance should pivot. They should never look the same."

The basic form of ALL stances should allways look the same. The use varies and therefore MAY impact the approach...but sorry Gong Bu is Gong Bu. Pu Bu is Pu Bu. you CAN specify high or low...but stances being stances is a foundation basic.

Similarly, punches being punches are foundation.

If you are judging and a person has the wrong foot placement in Gong Bu, the first time you see it, it is a standard deduction... The third time you see it, you quit marking off for it and simply deduct a larger standard deduction and it is labeled as an HABITUAL fault.

There is somewhat of a misunderstanding in HOW judging works going on here...as well as what Contemporary wushu IS now vs. what it was desired to be by those that put it together.

GLW
11-03-2005, 01:26 PM
"The main purpose of Tantui is to stretch your body into a straight line. When you punch, you will never hold the other arm straight back in combat (Tantui #1)."

To put it politely...or not...TOTAL BS.

The MAIN purpose of Tantui (as in Shrlu Tantui) is to teach the basics of stances, movement, quan, zhang, gou.... Tantui is the foundation of ALL routines in the Chaquan family (Cha, Hua, Pao, Hong).

The moving of the arms straight back...as with the closing of the fist fully overhead when doing a Ma Bu, side punch, overhead block grab is to train you to go all the way through.

For example, if you open the hand to do a grab and then close it to do a grab, you do NOT close it to resemble the formation that it would have if you actually had something in the hand (like the opponent's arm). You close it to a full fist so you build the habit to close the hand as tightly as possible when you do the grab...so the other guy does not get away.

Now, you are also getting way confused between Taolu and use. Form is the idealized TRAINING that gets put into practice in Sanda.

Typical idea from Chaquan for example:

Train low, use high.

You do your stances in Taolu low and strong....KNOWING that in actual use, you WILL stand higher...but also knowing that you will have more strength and stability from doing low.

Overextending a knee....You MAY do that in application but I would not recommend it as a rule of thumb... To do so often gives away your balance...and also does damage to the knee.

A typical northern approach is not to go in and lock a knee in a static sense but to drive through it with a step locking it as you go through. Southern...not my thing so they MAY do the more static lock...


The STANDARD is a standard for training and for Taolu. If someone REALLY thinks that they will make their fighting look like doing Taolu, they are either going to have their a$$ kicked by the other guy or their Taolu will look like $hit....

They compliment each other but Taolu is NOT Sanda or vice versa. If it were, EVERY good Sanshou person would have technically perfect form.

The reality is that there are very few people that truly excel at both.

Now, Taolu SHOULD be made your own. I can do the moves exactly as taught and I will NEVER look like my teacher..nor should I. Each person brings their body, coordination, and personality.

But, the basics are all the same.

IronMonkey
11-03-2005, 02:15 PM
On the USAWKF page, it sure says it will be in Olympics lol.. guess they gotta update that then ? :rolleyes:

SPJ
06-10-2007, 09:01 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOZznc6xMcY&NR=1

A talk show. guests are Ma Ming Da (tong bei) and Zhu Ren Qi (Nan Quan).

--

Japan asked Judo to become an olympic event when Japan hosting the games (1964).

Korea asked TKD to become an olympic event when South Korea hosting the games (1988).

China will be hosting the games in 2008, if wushu enters olympics, too?????

--

The first time Wushu or Kuo Shu appeared in the games as an exhibit was in the games in Berlin, 1934,

--

your comments?

--

what are the hurdles?

--

:D;)

Mega-Foot
06-10-2007, 09:10 AM
The hurdles are a spriting even in Track & Field, where you basically run a 100, 200, 400, or 800 meter race, jumping over small sign-like impediments during the course. It can get really exciting.

SPJ
06-10-2007, 09:14 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SpV4DFDCeF0&NR=1

In TKD, you get points by kicks.

In Judo, you win by doing a throw.

Tao Lu comp is dependent on difficulties in execution of techniques and timing, spirits, characteristis etc.

--

Ma Ming Da said, the wushu comp is consisted of Tao Lu, San Shou, short weapons and long weapons traditionally. Wushu went thru re organization from 1953.

Modern wushu started in 1957. With the advice from Russian gymnastic athletes, Tao Lu competition forms were started to be perfecting. San Shou and weapon drills were dropped.

In 1980's, San Shou and weapon drills comp came back for a while. Weapon drills then dropped again. San Shou continue till present day. However, Tao Lu comp and San Shou went their separate ways. meaning Tao Lu competitors do not compete in San Shou. and San Shou atheletes do not do Tao Lu comp.

--

:)

SPJ
06-10-2007, 09:37 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keqyMR3T5A0&mode=related&search=

Ma Ming Da said.

Wushu as a form of competition is there since the very beginning. It is a tradition.

In modern time from 1920', 1930' to 1940's, Wushu or Kuo Shu had 12 competition items. It was already a complete competition system.

Tao Lu, San Shou, short and long weapons, Shuai Jiao, archery, --

:)

SPJ
06-10-2007, 09:45 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yW2bcmP6Tsc&mode=related&search=

Ma Ming Da said. during culture revolution, traditional Wushu was persecuted. there was only the dialogue quan.

after that, Wushu was de-cultured or thinned out. only the surface/form/skin left. fighting aspects were left out. producing only visiual effects such as Jet Li in the movies.--

--

Judo and TKD both have Tao Lu/forms. but they presented the competition format into olympics.

--

SPJ
06-10-2007, 09:58 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwwJL19ZFqY&mode=related&search=

Ma Ming Da said. the Tao Lu format to enter the olympics may not be the good way. It would take the spirits of Wushu away.

Ma drew a cartoon to express his oppinion.

In legends of water margin. Wu Song was a very tall and strong guy. And his brother Wu Da Lang was a short person. Wu Song may beat a tiger with barehand. But when it comes to Tao Lu comp, Wu Song had to take a seat and watch Wu Da Lang winning the championship on the stage. To do some tumbling and jumping, a short person is better than a tall one.

--

SPJ
06-10-2007, 10:07 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mE3wSTZvP-U&mode=related&search=

San Shou still has safety issues, similarities to other events etc.

Quan Shu: long fist, Tai chi, Nan quan. Tai chi is slow and takes 4 to 5 min. Tai Chi was dropped due to length of time. Chang Quan and Nan Quan Tao Lu last 1 min or so.

Short weapons: boys Dao Shu and girls Jian Shu.

Long weapons were dropped. because the long spear is made out of Bai Lang Gan. due to weather, not many countries may produce it.

--

these are some formats considered.

GeneChing
11-07-2017, 08:54 AM
http://image5.sixthtone.com/image/5/6/30.jpg
BroadTones
Kung Fu Superstar Jet Li: How I’ll Bring Tai Chi to the Olympics (http://www.sixthtone.com/news/1001134/kung-fu-superstar-jet-li-how-ill-bring-tai-chi-to-the-olympics)
The iconic actor hopes to light up future Games with an innovative take on traditional martial arts.
Nov 06, 2017
Lu Hongyong
Lu Hongyong is an editor at Sixth Tone.

This Saturday will see the premiere of a new martial arts movie, “Gong Shou Dao.” With a run time of just 20 minutes, it certainly wasn’t made for its box office potential. The short film, which stars Jack Ma — the founder and executive chairman of Alibaba, China’s largest e-commerce platform — brings together 11 of China’s best-known martial artists and will premiere during the eighth annual Singles’ Day shopping event, when hundreds of millions of the world’s consumers will scour Taobao, Alibaba’s shopping platform, for deals.

The man behind the film is Jet Li, a celebrated actor whose movies include “Shaolin Temple,” “Fist of Legend,” and “Hero.” Li and Ma are co-founders of Taiji Zen, a lifestyle company that promotes wellness through a combination of tai chi and meditation. Central to the company’s ethos is gongshoudao (GSD), a new form of tai chi that Li and Ma hope will elevate Chinese martial arts to Olympic status.

Sixth Tone sat down with Li to talk about the power of tai chi, his friendship with Ma, and his future hopes for GSD. The interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

Sixth Tone: What is special about GSD compared to other forms of martial arts, and how does it relate to the Olympics?

Jet Li: I was just 8 years old when I began studying martial arts. I’m 47 now, and over the past four decades or so, I’ve been fortunate enough to make something of a name for myself, acting in Hollywood movies and traveling the world giving talks on this distinctly Chinese form of combat. Countless Chinese dream of the day that martial arts are officially recognized as an Olympic event, but so far, we have been unsuccessful.

A key reason for our failure to date is the fact that there is no consensus on the standards or categories of the various forms of wushu — martial arts. There are simply too many styles and variations to merit inclusion in the Olympics just yet. Use your fists, and people call it boxing; use your legs, and they call it taekwondo; throw your opponent to the floor, and people call it judo. How, in the end, should we codify something as broad as Chinese martial arts? Jack [Ma] and I hope that GSD will at least define it for the purposes of international sport.

Sixth Tone: You have mastered several different martial arts styles. Why did you choose to base GSD on tai chi?

Jet Li: About seven or eight years ago, I read a Harvard University study that looked at 800 published medical papers devoted to the relative merits of tai chi, some of which concluded that it could provide relief for sufferers of heart disease, high blood pressure, arthritis, and depression. This level of discussion is almost nonexistent in China, where we tend to take it for granted that tai chi is good for us. Yet even if it is good, that doesn’t mean it’s a magical cure-all or that it obviates the need for medicine. We must keep putting our faith in science.

I used to believe there were only four things that mattered in life: fame, money, power, and love. Now, I know that I must gain a clear perspective on what life is really about.
- Jet Li, actor
Around the same time, Jack and I met to talk about his dream of shooting a film to help popularize tai chi. Having practiced tai chi for 30 years, he sees it as a symbol of traditional Chinese culture. Two years later, we founded Taiji Zen together. Our shared goal is to get Chinese martial arts — specifically GSD — enshrined as an Olympic event. To this end, we have drawn up detailed rules for GSD, with an eye toward making it more combative and watchable. Domestically, the first GSD tournament will be held in Beijing on Nov. 15.

Sixth Tone: In the past, China has failed to convince the International Olympic Committee (IOC) to include traditional martial arts at the Games. How do the prospects look now?

Jet Li: In January, Alibaba put its name to a 12-year partnership with the IOC. Covering the next three Olympic cycles, the contract establishes Jack’s company as one of the IOC’s premier global partners and doubtless gives GSD a leg up in the fight for Olympic status. In fact, Jack personally explained GSD to the IOC’s current president, Thomas Bach, in August.

I don’t doubt that the Olympic spirit is a good thing. Yet even as the quest to be higher, faster, and stronger has allowed us to redefine humanity’s limits, it has also damaged athletes’ bodies. In our attempts to push ourselves, we’ve lost sight of an important part of the sporting mindset: balance. The world today is changing at an extraordinary pace, so it’s only natural to feel off-balance. But to paraphrase one of Jack’s most quoted comments, it pays to slow down if we want to live happy lives.

In 1997, around the time I was filming “Once Upon a Time in China and America,” I found myself overcome with doubt for the first time in my life. Ever since I was a little boy, I had always believed that if I simply worked hard, respected the law, and did my best, there was nothing I couldn’t accomplish.

However, at that point, I realized that in spite of all my wealth, I was still eating the same things I had always eaten and drinking more or less what I had always liked to drink. The only difference was that when I was younger, I’d relieve myself in Beijing’s public restrooms, where other guys stood in lines ****ing all over the urinal trough. Now, though, I lived in a big home with something like eight bathrooms. That was the grand sum of all my achievements: a different bathroom for each day of the week.

Fundamental to tai chi is a spirit of peaceful coexistence — the belief that in you, there is a piece of me, and in me a piece of you.
- Jet Li, actor
I used to believe there were only four things that mattered in life: fame, money, power, and love. Now, I realize that’s not the case, and I know that I must gain a clear perspective on what life is really about. Not long ago, I found myself chatting with Yang Xingnong, Taiji Zen’s CEO and the dean of our academy. Over the course of two hours, we talked about everything from movies and martial arts training to charity and altruism, yet we kept circling back to the same questions: What is life? What is pain? What is love? What, at the end of the day, is the point of living?

continued next post

GeneChing
11-07-2017, 08:54 AM
Sixth Tone: How does your adaptation of tai chi capture those moral revelations?

Jet Li: GSD combines physical training with the sort of meditative self-reflection you might expect from Zen Buddhism. Over the past few years, I’ve spent six hours a day meditating, searching for the answers to these questions. I’ve tried going without life’s mundanities — I once went over a week without showering — and attempted a couple things more grandiose, such as when I spent several years staring into caves high in the Nepalese Himalayas. I’m happier than I’ve ever been, because today, my thoughts and purpose are fully aligned.

When people hear the name Jet Li, they tend to think of the martial artist, the kid who started studying when he was 8 before becoming a national champion and entering the film industry. My first movie, “Shaolin Temple,” came out in 1982 and broke Chinese mainland box office records for a Mandarin-language film. Though I went on to enjoy a successful career in Hong Kong and Hollywood, that Jet Li has now stepped out of the public eye.

These days, I spend my time thinking about how I can help people live better, including through charitable work. Ten years ago, I launched the One Foundation, a charity focused on helping communities recover from disasters, protecting and educating children, peer support, and innovation.

Sixth Tone: Your 1982 film debut, “Shaolin Temple,” made Chinese viewers fall back in love with martial arts. Are you expecting to leave a similar impression with GSD?

Jet Li: I like to say that while “Shaolin Temple” revived interest in martial arts, it failed to capture their essence. The action-packed movie inspired a generation of kids who dreamed of one day being martial artists, but ended up as security guards. My current hope is that Taiji Zen will cultivate a generation of Zen practitioners, thinkers, and warriors — a generation in which everyone has their own thoughts and outlook on life, and everyone is receptive to feedback and willing to support one another. No more children will grow up dreaming of becoming mere fighters; they will also know the value of Zen as a guiding path to self-realization.

China’s national character is scarred by memories of fighting foreign aggression. But the tide has turned. Today, there’s no need to go around talking about how strong the Chinese people are. Fundamental to tai chi is a spirit of peaceful coexistence — the belief that in you, there is a piece of me, and in me a piece of you. All of us share this spirit, regardless of ethnicity. At present, there are about 150 million tai chi practitioners around the world, and the global influence of Chinese martial arts is something I am immensely proud of.

I hope tai chi, in the form of GSD, has a good chance of becoming an Olympic sport. Two of the characters in its Chinese name, gong and shou, stand for “kung fu” and “defense,” respectively. China has been an agricultural civilization for centuries, and although the country is now industrializing rapidly, different forms of kung fu, including tai chi, play a vital — I would even say foundational — role in Chinese culture as a means of protecting our homes, land, and territorial integrity. In the future, I hope to see GSD become a symbol similarly deserving of our pride in China’s martial heritage.

Translator: Kilian O’Donnell; editors: Lu Hongyong and Matthew Walsh.

(Header image: A still frame of Jet Li’s character in the 2006 film ‘Fearless.’ VCG)


The Art of Attack and Defence (Gong Shou Dao) (http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?70541-The-Art-of-Attack-and-Defence-(Gong-Shou-Dao)) = The Olympics & Wushu (http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?1480-The-Olympics-amp-Wushu) + TaijiZen (http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?65314-Jet-Li-s-TaijiZen-International-Cultural-Development-Company) & ONE Foundation (http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?36920-Jet-Li%92s-ONE-Foundation).