A seminar with George Xu

[I.M. Toast]

Greetings:
I attended a seminar given by George Xu last Saturday, and all I can say is "Man, what an eye-opener". He completely changed some of my impressions of Taichichuan and gave several impressive demonstrations of internal strength.
His main focus was on using the dantien as the center of strength, and performing each move with "whole body strength". He examined each student while they were performing each move, and told them where they were disconnected internally.
He also metioned that Hsing-I was a great method for strengthening the dantien and whole body connection, but it was a "stupid art" (I think he acutally ment simplistic or unrefined) compared to taichi. He said "With Hsing-i, I can use dantien to break a piano; with taichi, I can use dantien to play a piano".
Since I am new to the internal arts, and TCM in general, I asked him if a beginner such as I should start with Hsing-i to develop the Dantien and whole body connection. He replied that if he was starting new that he would copy what my instructor did externally, then try to bring out internal power to repeat the same motions, then use solely internal strength to move. I don't know if he didn't understand the question, or I don't understand the answer.
Anyhow, I still don't know "how" to have whole-body connection, and to use dantien power in the hand, etc. Heck, I am still not sure where to start in my study of the internal arts. But at least I have an idea where I am headed. I guess that you could say that I am really in over my head, but I think I know which way is up.
If I can remember any other pearls of knowledge, I'll let you know.

I.M.T.

[crumble]

Originally posted by I.M. Toast
I asked him if a beginner such as I should start with Hsing-i to develop the Dantien and whole body connection. He replied that if he was starting new that he would copy what my instructor did externally, then try to bring out internal power to repeat the same motions, then use solely internal strength to move. I don't know if he didn't understand the question, or I don't understand the answer.

This is what I get when I read that. What he was saying holds true for all internal arts. Basically, you can only copy the external movement of a teacher. But then it is up to you to find the internal aspect. The internal aspect is just moving efficiently.

First, you need to find how to do the movement without straining. It feels almost too easy, too wimpy. When you find out how to do that, you have essentially identified the correct muscles to use to do the movement (no more, no less). Now you need to keep training that movement so that it becomes natural to >only< use those muscles, even as resistance is increased.

It doesn't matter if it is a punch or a block... the idea is you have to commit to using efficient movement to get things done, rather than grunting and using extra muscle to make it happen.

You will probably find that you need to use your arm muscles less and your torso more. Saying "the torso" is essentially the same as saying "the dantien".

And really that is it. Internal is amazing, but simple. It is an approach that emphasizes getting the movement right without power and then developing that movement until it is powerful. External starts with power which becomes more refined as you practice it over and over.

-crumble

[Scarletmantis]

Hey Toast,

Sorry it's taken so long for me to read this and get back to you. What Master Xu was saying about being a beginner had more to do with paying attention to details. Remember that when he told us "First learn external movement, imitate your master as close to exactly as possible. Then take the movement you have learned and ask yourself: 'Is my shoulder resting inside my Dan tien? Is my hip connected to the ground? etc.'. Once you have the movement down internally, then learn the next movement from you teacher. Each movement like this."

Remember that the whole focus of the seminar was on how to "Self Correct" using those ten "tests" he taught us.

By the by, I've decided to move to San Fransisco in order to train with Master Xu full time. In ninteen years of study I have never met a person with his level of internal training. You are lucky to have met him so early in your training, and I hope you make an effort to continue practicing with him. The fact is that if you let him guide you NOW, you actually may have a chance at being as good as he is when you're seventy, and you won't develop bad habits the way I have!

[I.M. Toast]

Good to hear from you again!
So, your moving to SF just to study with Master Xu? That's dedication! I'm hoping that you already have a fairly well-paying job set up for you here, because it isn't cheap to live here.
If you don't mind, I would like to ask a couple of questions:

Does Master Xu teach Bagua, and if not, are you going to learn Chen tjq or Xing-yi, or just apply his internal techniques to what you already know in bagua?

What bad habits have you picked up, and are these the results of training in different arts, or poor instruction?

I would like to continue my training with Master Xu. Unfortunately, finances are tight right now and money for MA is coming to a halt, but I hope to have the opportunity in the near future.
Good luck with your training, and tell me how it goes!

I.M.T.

[Scarletmantis]

Yes Toast, there is a Ba Gua Claus...

Okay, Master Xu does teach Ba Gua. I intend to allow his wisdom to choose the direction of my training while continuing to practice my Ba Gua sets on my own. Master Xu graciously offered to continue to correct my form while I train with him. I am not interested in mastering a particular internal martial art anyway, just in manifesting true internal power with ALL of my movements, irregardless of what system gets me there.

The weaknesses/habits I've picked up are a result of insufficient training in the fundamentals of internal power. Like you (and I daresay most practitioners I have met), I have drilled Form, martial applications, sparring, and conditioning, but have had absolutly no instruction in what it means to be properly linked internally.

This hasn't really been the fault of my past teachers however. They wern't able to do what Master Xu does because they didn't have proper instruction either. Unfortunatly, I've trained with some big names in the American IMA scene, so it appears (to me) that all of the harping we hear about the art's being watered down, and teacher's being insufficiently trained may be valid.

I for one will never again waste my time training with someone who explains internal theory very well, but who cannot express it physically. I am grateful to have been effectivly dis-illusioned.

[Spirit Writer]

Sounds like you guys had a great martial experince. Congrats.

I would like to adress this quote though: "The internal aspect is just moving efficiently. "

In a broad sense, almost true. That is the beginning. One must learn to generate power, always using the optimum source, then sources, then everything for power. Very efficient, that is good anything.

But, do not discredit breath, the control of breath, the combination of breath and intent. Without that, it is not internal, just good external.