got jumped

[norther practitioner]

OK, I'm a bit POed..... A friend of mine got jumped last night by four guys in a parking lot near the club we go to every once in a while. So, me, being a human (unlike the five or so chodes giving each other a play by play) knew I had to step in.

First, my friend, sorta started it, these guys were talking about us and were very disrespectful to a good female friend of my boys. So, he confronted the one guy, the guy said something and drove a little too close to him so he hit the car.

One guy gets out of the car and they start fighting, then end up on the ground, whilst this goes on the other three get out of the car, two go for my friend as well (who was doing rather well from the ground). I grabbed two of them and got the third away for a few seconds. One of the galutes had a **** beer bottle, and went berserk. One of those guys that has no control at all, and just looses it. I remained very calm concidering everthing and had two of them chase me a few yard down the parking lot, when I saw that third guy start hitting my friend, well, I tried to get around them the berserk guy kept threatening me with this **** bottle so I had to deal with him, he swung it, I got out of the way, then he kinda came over his head with the bottle and I got my head out of the way, it broke over my shoulder. I think I may have kicked the remaining portion out of his hand (I went for it, felt something, but wasn't really concentrating on the bottle at the moment (a big left hook coming my way). So, that didn't cut me through my shirt so I tried to talk this guy down again.....didn't work, he started swinging at me again, very uncontrolled, it didn't hurt, until he touched my face (which is that trigger for me most of the time) I didn't do anything accept take and block a few punches which didn't hurt at all (it was apparent the guy didn't know how to hit at all). So, I ended up sweeping this guy, he went down to all fours, the other dude who only swung once and missed came at me, he grabbed me, so I parried his hands to one side, put my right foot behind him and tripped/pushed him away, unfortunately, I didn't disable the other guy long enough and he actually got a decent shot it (right on the side of my jaw) which is a little sore today (along with my wrist from when I through the other second guy, he sorta hung on).
Anyway, I am kinda ****ed at myself for not doing more to protect myself. I saw so many openings that I passed up hoping these fools would just sorta cool off....I had absolutely no beef with them until the bottle broke, when and after which I was still calm and tried to talk to them. At the same time, some of the openings I saw could have lead to real trouble (I haven't fought in so long for real against multiple guys) because if I got an advantage I didn't know if and when I would stop pummeling this first guy. Most of the openings I saw were to the throat an eye shot would have been really easy just before I swept him as well. Anyhow, thats not all that important, I guess I would just like to hear some comments on how people held up in similar situations.
oh, fyi, the cops came, I approached them, so they believed me (my friend was just getting up from the ground) as opposed to this crazy ass story the guy with the bottle told, anywho, no legal stuff (which is another thing that went through my head a few times during the whole exchange). There was no way I was going to take the day off whilst encarcerated.
amitabha,
Northern Practitioner

[Liokault]

sounds like you did ok over all.

[Mumbles]

It actually sounds like you reacted pretty sensibly. If you had gone for their vitals and hurt them, they probably would be suing you right now.

[fa_jing]

How could you forget about your punches and your kicks? Your most basic techniques?

[Royal Dragon]

You did OK, but if it was me, I wold have knocked the wild one with the beer bottle out cold as soon as I was confronted with a weapon. That is generally my trigger. That and if I take someone down, and back off and they get up and come for more.

I always try to take guys down really hard if it goes that far. Better to say were were in the heat of it and he lost his balance and busted his head due to his obsession with trying to harm me, than to be seen beating him, and NOT be able to say it was an accident.

[norther practitioner]

Err, I didn't forget about them at all..... The point sort of was that I made the contious effort to avoid that as long as possible. I did sweep (front sweep, like a mui thai kick to the leg) the chode with the bottle. The throw was from yang style tai chi, I didn't forget my training in the least....I was just trying to minimize the amount I had to use. I just was wondering if you guys thought maybe I should have knocked them senseless, or just did what I did and minimize the pain for both sides.

[norther practitioner]

Thanks RD.....
I guess the whole beer bottle thing ended quickly (I did land a punch during that first exchange to his ribs)...but next time I looked the bottle was broken on the floor (after I kicked at it in his hand and he threw the hook). It is kinda hard to explain in detail how everything went down....

Thanks for the replies guys.

I did punch a few times, more trying to create space rather than knock out (actually didn't go for anything that I would concider a "knockout punch")

[HuangKaiVun]

Nobody got hurt, nobody got sued, nobody went to jail.

You were in total control and had mercy on your opponents.

In short, you fought like a MASTER. You did great!

[NPMantis]

You did the right thing. You got out safely with no legal proceedings.

Looking back on it I'm sure you're angry and wish you'd have knocked them out cold but in reality it would have only been the start of it, remember the police tend to take the side of a loser of a fight not the person who started it in the majority of cases from what I hear.

Well done for maintaining your calm, a lot of people wouldn't.

Take care,

NPM

[Former castleva]

Do you do shaolin?
Well anyway it sounds like it went up pretty well,relatively.
If you do,it would sound like that you used the principle of mercy (my translation)
Bad thing your friend went out for them when they were wielding their long tongues,no offense to him but it sounds like it could have saved the situation from going further.Ignoring them would probably have been enough,but each situation is different so there could have been the possibility they would have entered your zone but so far I don´t know.
The amount of danger in the situation sounds to have been high.
Multiple/part armed opponents.
That is always a serious matter,hard to tell their mindset and the rest but using lethal force would not necessarily a cruel idea.
But it sounds like your skill level was naturally significantly higher than theirs and you had the skill to demonstrate,even though you could have taken them out the hard way,possibly legally.
Good thing everyone´s OK there,best wishes.

:)

[Sharky]

at the point when the confrontation turned physical you should have made 100% effort to either get out of there or disable them.

what if one had a knife concealed? you can't take chances about talking them down when he's swinging fists and bottles at you.

you were lucky to come out alive, you waited far, far too long before you acted.

glad you're ok.

(ps, did i actually just read you saying your 'trigger' is when someone 'touches your face'?!?!? do you not think that's just a 'bit' late eh?)

[DelicateSound]

Given the situation, and your strange obsession for not wanting to hurt the angry guy who was trying to bottle your face in, you did OK.

Should have put him down properly though, the other guy could have beat you in good. Or like the Sharkmeister said, stabbed you.

[Royal Dragon]

DelicateSound,

Love your Avatar!! Looks like it came right off "My" site!!! http://www.dreamwater.net/biz/royaldragon/Smilies.html


norther practitioner ,
In reality, you should have MMA'd em by taking them down and mounting in your guard with a double leg takedown and an armbar!!!:D

Royce would be so dissapointed in you........................................

[DelicateSound]

Getting desperate for publicity aren't we RD.....


Actually mate, I nicked it from E-Budo 6 months ago. As likely you did....


:D

[norther practitioner]

When I say trigger there, it's more like it turned (for me), to getting these two dudes out of picture as opposed to just sort of dealing with them. The guy with the bottle, had so little control it was probably comical from a spectators perspective (until he finally got a good shot in, which didn't even really phase me).

As far as not wanting to hurt them, calling into work from jail....not an option, I had my phone, a friends jewelry etc. in my pocket, didn't want anything to get damaged, plus, I tend to hesitate a bit on throwing down with my injury (I blew my knee out this summer, just started training again). It is risky for me to pivot off of my left leg without fealing it in my knee. I did, it turned out ok, got the guy down, if there wasn't two he would have been done......the other guy just was a smaller guy that would have pulled something on my friend way before me, he tried to pull the bottle wielding freak for a second, then stopped, and was standing on the side, threw once, I pushed him aside right before the sweep, the sweep, then the guy tried to grab me.....There were multiple peeks, it wasn't just one flury or anything like that. After the bottle was broken I wasn't too worried about that guy, he was easily contained by the fact that he couldn't hit the broadside of a barn with the way he was throwing (looked like a girl angry with her boyfriend or something) it was sorta like a blocking drill that we do.

[Nexus]

There is no need to rationalize defending yourself. You either choose to defend yourself or you don't. Many don't because of fear of 'what might happen as a repurcussion'.

The excuse range from 'I hesitated because...' to 'I wasn't sure if...' 'I didn't want to...'

There is no right or wrong action in your situation, you walked away alive, a successful story.

[mysteri]

i agree w/ sharky. u did very well given the situation, but i doubt u could be so lucky should somethin like that happened again. if there was one or maybe even 2 guys, then not tryin to be too aggressive might have been an okay idea. but IMHO, tryin to be nice to 4 angry guys ALL possibly wieldin weapons is jus plain suicidal. the police have to do their jobs yes, but they also try to use their common sense. seeing that ur friend was doin aight u should've tried to minimize the threat by takin at least two out pretty quickly(especially the psycho w/ the beer bottle.) ur patience could've gotten u maimed or killed(i hope that bottle wouldnt have been the first thing to touch ur face.) wheel-punches and quick, low kicks would've prolly been the best thing for the situation right there jus to fend them off long enough to get urself and ur friend outta there, but that's about as nice as i coulda been. the situation coulda been A LOT worse cuz next time u could be against 4 skilled MMA ****ed-off about the dent in their car. then u might've been in a whirl of trouble! so u did well for now, but next time it should be about preservance of life! glad ur okay..

[norther practitioner]

Thanks Nexus....I agree, thats why I am where I am I guess.

[fa_jing]

Hey dude, I wasn't there so I don't really know the circumstances. It sounds like believed you were in relative control, whether or not that was actually the case. In some way, I'm sure that you mentally sized up the opposition. You and your friend are alright, that is what's important. I was just asking to see where you are coming from. And, next time, punch somebody in their eye and make us all happy :cool:

[norther practitioner]

Word, will do, and while I do that, I will yell.....
"This is for all my martial bros and sis's on kfo!" Seriously sorry, this confrontation put some demons in my head for a spell, and I was just a little edgy this morning. Funny thing is, this is the first time I can remember in a while, that we haven't rolled at least 4-6 deep. Guess it just goes to show.....

[Ryu]

norther practitioner ,
In reality, you should have MMA'd em by taking them down and mounting in your guard with a double leg takedown and an armbar!!!



First, he was pretty clear that most of this fight was on the ground. His friends were on the ground, and even though he didn't follow the man to the ground, his winning technique was a throw that PUT the man on the ground. Whether people like it or not, all these scenarios in reality are including the ground in some shape or form.


Other than that,
from what you posted, it sounds like you really kicked ass in this situation. I think you did excellent. Glad you're okay too. I can see why you didn't act first off......to be honest, I probably would have reacted similar. Very good throw.
Could you explain the throw you used a little more? It was from a clinch obviously

Ryu

[norther practitioner]

The throw, is almost like a school yard prank, only you don't have the person on all fours behind the guy you are pushing. I learned this from the choke (as in you are getting choked with two hands). Anywho, it works when someone grabs you with both hands near the chest or shoulders, or if you are fast enough when they push you two handed to the chest. As there arms are extended you have two options one is to strike to the top of the body (head, neck) while stepping with the same side as you are striking with, placing your foot behind theirs. The second option, which I vied for, was to stike/parry/block the arms, it is a very strong movement that sets things up a bit more.... it starts by circling your arms in the same direction simultaniously (if they have you by the collar or something), I like to bring my arms below theres (both) circle up with both arms on the same side as one of theirs and sidestep a bit if you have room if not take the step foward with your side that is closest to them, step behind, pressure there arms then shove, or strike them.

[Nexus]

The application you described northern_practitioner is similar to a tai chi application where you circle the arms to the outside of one of the arms coming towards you, grabbing the wrist of the other person and turning it over as well as using the available arm to hold their arm down behind the back of the elbow. You also make the step behind yourself giving you the leverage and power generated by the waist.

It is a rollback of sorts. Very effective and very quick, and leaves the entire side/face/body of the other person open.

[norther practitioner]

Same move, this was from yang style tai chi.....
I learned something (if not the same thing) you described as another alternative (that one being like needle to the bottom of the sea, or snatch the pearls).

[Nexus]

Right. Needle at the bottom of the sea is a pull down, and a very effective one when applied properly. And you are also correct, the application was derived from yang style tc. there are several variations of it.

One of the variations is that the movement exposes the pearl of the ear, which you strike with a fist after the application is performed. This is a jaw shattering blow.

[LEGEND]

Positives...
1. u're alived.
2. didn't get hurt.
3. kept your senses and didn't suffer a panic attack that would have reverted you to basic motor skills( haymaker type punches ).

Negatives...
The only one I saw is u're not a FINISHER. This maybe cause u have a GOOD HEART...that's cool and all...but you MAY want to change this. You should have KO any of the doods given the oppt. Better to be judge by 12 then carried out by 6. No place for sincerity in the street.

[joedoe]

You are alive and unhurt. Sounds like your friend is alive and unhurt too. You accomplished your misson. You did very well.

You made your choices in that situation and you lived to tell the tale. Maybe in the next altercation you are involved in, you will make different choices. Who knows. The main thing is that you survived.

[Royal Dragon]

DelicateSound,
"Actually mate, I nicked it from E-Budo 6 months ago. As likely you did.... "
Reply]
Ahh, E-Budo!!! es, I remember it well!!!

And yes, I'm desperate to get some people talking on my forums. No one like me and they won't talk there anymore :(



Ryu,Ryu, Ryu, what am I going to do with you?

I said "In reality, you should have MMA'd em by taking them down and mounting in your guard with a double leg takedown and an armbar!!!" AS A JOKE!!

How can you Mount and Guard at the same time?? Isn't the guy on the ground in the gaurd, and the guy on top in the mount?? You can't be both guys?? Can You?? Also, you can do a double leg take down if your already trying to do a Guard and mount at the same time. Also, how do you Arm bar an simutaniosly do a Double leg take down?? I was being silly, silly
:D

[SevenStar]

Actually...

How can you Mount and Guard at the same time?? Isn't the guy on the ground in the gaurd, and the guy on top in the mount??

he could have thought your wording was messed up and that instead of mounting him into the guard, you meant "pulling him into your guard"

Also, you can do a double leg take down if your already trying to do a Guard and mount at the same time.

That's not what you said. You said "taking them down and mounting in your guard with a double leg takedown and an armbar!!!" Also, how do you Arm bar an simutaniosly do a Double leg take down??" meaning that you take them down with a double leg, then guard/mount.

You try for a double leg, and he sprawls, not properly, but enough to stop you, as you didn't follow through. you grab an outstretched arm and try a flying armbar.

See, it's all in how you read it! :D