Mystical creatures

[Sui]

i'm writing this for a brother of mine,as to lead him and many others to a perspective so that may open the soul/spirit of our culture and conection to these cultures.

Dragons:thare are four dragons wich represent the four seasons summer,winter,autum and spring.they also represent the directions of a simple compass,north,south,east and west.

Heavenly dragon:this dragon can fly and is the most auspicious of all creatures.breaths fire in the form of lightening,is very colorful.amongest the stars is the heavanly dragon.

Water dragon:this dragon cannot fly,lives in the oceans of life itself.controls everything that is of liquid,the wisest of all creatures and is of longivety.

Mountain/earth dragon:this dragon cannot fly also,lives on mountain peaks.represents the nature of past present and future.this is the strongest of all creatures.

Ice/cold dragon:this can fly.breathes ice.lives anywhere represents the adaption in extreme conditions this is the most clever of creatures.

Pheonix:there is only one of its kind.represents resiliance {to all dragons creating a partnership}this bird will take you on mental journeys of all perspectives.....

Key-lin/kei-lun_unicorn:this creature is shy and magical with its hypnotic powers lives in the forests[woodlands]it is also ONLY acosiated with the true hakka ppl.unicorns are from the west and key-lin aren't but the have the same lives and powers.


so,to practice kung fu so that the dragon will come is like a boy/girl to call for a dragon and expect it to come.ONLY humans with regal blood of any culture can summon a dragon but the blood must be pure in the fact of"virgin" nature.eg virgin maidens.
now in the west the maidens were sacrificed to a dragon the reason for this is because the dragons were in partnership with man.then the man double crossed the dragons and started slaying them to prove their courage,and that men were more powerful.this created hardships with the dragons and the dragons would want a maiden for sacrifice.to balance the nature of man.some maiden kept an alliance with the dragons and this is showen by paintings in the old temples in china,where the maiden would shower under a fountain of the dragons mouth.
we believe that the dragon will not come this is cantonese philosophy.instead when you are crowned with "sin- gung"the conection with the dragon is eternal.but to learn"san da"is to defeat the dragons once again.

now,fire dragons are rare and are a part of adaption.........
i hope this helps you to reach beyond the advance stages of kung fu.........

ladies and gentlemen the floor is open.

sui

[Buby]

Thank you Bro!

take care,
Buby

[{i^(]

Joking aside, a very good post, and thank you.

[Yum Cha]

Sorry I missed this one, I was on holiday.

ttt

[Sui]

hi yum hope you had a good one?what do you recon?care to add?

cheers

sui

[Yum Cha]

Sui,
This is an interesting metaphore. It comes together with many other interpretations, yet, is different and has it's own "lessons."

I can't really comment on it, other to say that it stimulates a bit of thought, and you know how this donkey loves his apples.

Can you tell me where it comes from? Is this Chinese mythology, a Hakka thing, or Taoist philosophy? I'm pretty sure it isn't buddhist.

The directions (compass) and the Dragons themselves make me think of Taoism, but I'm only guessing. Does it come from literature, or folk wisdom?

I'm not sure what is meant by "sin- gung" and "san da" and that missing piece of the puzzle makes it incomplete for me.

I understand your viewpoint as relates to our previous discussion a bit better though.

[CLOUD ONE]

hey Yum,
why not talk on your own experience as a donkey for the donkey is revered in Christianity so it may not be 'mystical' but have qualities that could fit in with Kung Fu?

There are no set thing that is written execpt for sui's openning, so looking into books won't get you any closer;)
Open your heart and call for your mystical creature what ever it may be?
What is the lesson that sui talks of?
Why do you YUM personaly train the lion dance?

[fiercest tiger]

Why do you YUM personaly train the lion dance?

Thats easy........MONEY, MONEY, MONEY!hehehehe

and

YUM CHA,YUM CHA,YUM CHA!

just kidding wassup guys i prefer the turtle its slow like me and has a hard shell like me......oh yeah! hahahahaha

ft

[Yum Cha]

Lion dance? Honestly, I do it to bring honour to my teacher and my school. I consider it a privilege to be one of the 6 schools that dance Chinatown. And when we are offered multiple envelopes at some places, I see the respect coming back to us. It connects us to the community and to the traditions of the old ones.

Secondarily, when I dance, personally, I feel the lion's power and playfulness, and the brotherhood with my sifu and si di. The party afterwards is pretty good too.

[Ego_Extrodinaire]

When I was alot younger and did southern kung fu, I did lion dance for the party atmosphere. It was our tradition to knock down drinks that we were offerred at chinese restaurants. Naturally what started out as an astute demonstration of kung fu soon became drunken debauchery in its most disgraceful form by the time we lion danced at the last restaurant.

There was more than one occasion when I vommited out of the Lion's head and on to some diner as he was offerring me the red packet.

The lion's tail - manned by my kf brother Leroy was extremely nasty. His hand used to wander out from the tail end and helped himself with some of the diners and i don't mean just the food.

Eventually we sobered up when the waiters dunked us into the lobster tank. It's amazing what happens when the playful spirit of the lion takes over. It unleashes the true colors of chinese culture and fnally sobering up to reality that lion dancing and southern kung fu makes fools of us.

[Sui]

thanks yum,cloud

well i will say this gentlemen,the role of the mo-si/lion dance is that it represents"protection"from "bad"entities.but are all lions good that is the first question?

yum
as cloud has pointed out even a donkey has good and bad points,and you should never take it as an insult?

its a hakka thing,but,it will lead you to your own experiences and should not be as a gosple.

do not guess anymore,they are verbal down many generations.do you know the game "chinese whispers"?some will fool some will not thats why of the compass,you seem to grasp quite well yum.

sin gung and san da is of no importance unless you believe in the "dark arts"[in all cultures]are they the dark arts?-no they are not but there are connections.

thanks for reconition and that yes you feel the connection within all our conversations.

cloud,you seem to know me so well.i hope you can help yum that little further of understanding of hakka culture?

f.t the turtle represents wisdom of all ages and longivty not to mentions a loyal partner to the true empror of china.

ego.there was a man in a wheel chair queing at a bank,and a young boy of 3yrs old approached him and said
"i know how you feel mate,i hate it also when my mother forces me into my push chair/pram"so you see or are you blind too?

sui

[strangecaptain]

can...not...resist...must reply to...topic! Well, I sure find religious/spiritual/mystical/whatever you want to call it topics interesting. Always have. I was hoping this discussion would open up a bit. It floated on the board without much reaction for a few days. Talked with an interesting person not long ago who represented his/her culture in a number of spiritual/religious ways. Because of his/her role, he/she became interested in similar factors amongst the lores of various cultures. I think it is called the study of comparative religions in academic-speak. He/she talked about symbols being the language of the spirit (again, insert appropriate wording, e.g., God, spirits, grandmothers, grandfathers, loas, dragons, big cahuna, etc) and that some symbols seem to pop up in most cultures. More than any other: the symbol of two things coming together, e.g., tai chi symbol and the like. Also, 4-directional lores seem to inhabit almost every culture. Same symbols? Are we all trying to say the same things? In that sense, reading this 4 dragons/4 directions post struck a chord in me somewhere. I have avoided most dogmas lately cuz some have bit me in the a$$ before. Wrong dogma? Wrong attitude? I still am not sure. A little of both probably. Today, I save my loyalty for my kung fu teacher, my college major, and whatever it is that gets me out of bed each morning.:) Cool topic. Is the symbol empty when divorced from intent? If we forget the meaning of the symbol, does it still speak? Just a few musings.

[Yum Cha]

I like donkeys. I like apples. I like simple pleasures and simple people. Honesty is more valuable than sophistication, which in itself is dishonest by design. I think you understand where I am coming from, my friend.

The "Protection" provided by the Lion to the community is often lost on the casual dancer, but it is the heritage and I understand the details, enough said?

I'm no expert, and the three lions that represent the three partners in the Peach Blossom Oath are the only Lions I know, but I believe other cultures (Malaysian, Vietnamese?) have more.

Of the 3 I know, all three (the soldier, the merchant and the aristocrat) were virtuous generals who remained true and who followed their fate, and who paid the price of their actions.

Good? Thats hard to say.

Captain,
Yes, comparative religion, universal human interpretations of the phenomenon of life, CG Yung's dissertations, all quite interesting stuff to me as well. Understanding other people's viewpoints brings one greater understanding of themselves I find. As they say, don't let your dogma get run over by your Karma....

[fiercest tiger]

Howdy, what about the phoenix what is it good for?

good point about the lion being good, not as in the style of dancing but the people behind the lion?! You are definetly the sick man of asia, with an IQ!;)

Big Up for you mate,
RESPECT
FT:D

[Sui]

yum are you talking about the"fu-sin/shin?

ah,f.t the pheonix one which i left out hoping some-one like yourself to mention?destiny,maybe?care to burn the incense f.t?show us:)

strange,good post but jumping the gun aren't you?universal language will not help here yet we are still miles away and have different color skin[even the white man].

we are all on journeys aren't we?to stop and gaze at one's achievment loses all perspectives?yum cha what do you think?

sui

[fiercest tiger]

The phoenix indicates happiness and luck a sign of heavens favour.just as the dragon was identified with yang and the emperor, so the phoenix was associated with yin and the empress. The phoenix was the symblo of cardianl direction of the south-often being referred to as the Red Bird of the south and represented drought, the element of fire and the season of summer.

Whats your view on the white tiger?:)

death till dawn......

FT

[Yum Cha]

Originally posted by Sui
yum are you talking about the"fu-sin/shin?

>>>>> Tell me what fu-sin/shin means, and I'll tell you if that's what I'm talking about. <smile> You and I use our own words often to talk about the same thing, unfortunately, you know my words better than I know yours.

ah,f.t the pheonix one which i left out hoping some-one like yourself to mention?destiny,maybe?care to burn the incense f.t?show us:)

>>>>>> IN addition to what FT said, let me add that the western and native american mythology of the Phoenix is re-birth, a new beginning rising from the flames of destruction.

we are all on journeys aren't we?to stop and gaze at one's achievment loses all perspectives?yum cha what do you think?

>>>>>> I think I agree with you wholeheartedly.

sui

[Sui]

yum,fu-sin are 3 spirits from a different universe.one is wealthy,one is longivety and the other brings offspring.there is more to them but to hard to translate.

Phoenix,yes rebirth.also perspective and journeys to the unknown?

f.t.red bird we call "fung".it can mean red or pheonix.[pronouciation]

pak-fuw,well alot of denominations like christianity.there is pak-fuw in japan and more so represents the westerner who studys the southern hand.they are classed as equal to the tiger but the herritage is still within.you f.t could be considered as a pak-fuw,because of your color and your hand.[have you called this spirit yet?did it crouch before you as a tamed beast?]


sui

[fiercest tiger]

Its is said the white tiger has something to do with death or when someone dies, we burned 2 white lions when sifu died to accompany him to his next life!

ykm is based on the shaolin white tiger and pure dragon but uses the pak mei tiger and leopard to explain its speed and power etc.:)
'

anyway i am the tortoise man, that holds up the pillars of heaven and earth, without me it will fall.



lol

FT

[Sui]

f.t they all have something to do with death,not just the pak fuw.for example the phoenix as in rebirth,there is no death both are one.

sui

[Ego_Extrodinaire]

FT: don't they wrap the sifu up in white cloth and bury the body along with the white tigers in a pyramid? It is not in the Queens chamber but is accessible from the small northern shaft leading from that chamber. There could be number of doors within that shaft that would confound exploreres to this very day.

[crumpet]

Originally posted by Yum Cha
I consider it a privilege to be one of the 6 schools that dance Chinatown.
Which 6 schools are they out of curiosity?

[fiercest tiger]

6 schools are

yau kung mun
choy lee fut
guangzhou pak mei
chinese youth league
jin wu kwoon
chinese masonic club

I think thats right! :)

FT