8 Step people

[JMagnano]

Are there any 8 Step Southern Mantis people on this board? Let me hear from you and say hello. By the way, James Sun has a web page www.8step.com if you'd like to read something interesting.

You can contact me direct at josephmagnano@hotmail.com and/ or JMagnano@Martialmail.com

[Anon]

As far as i know its a northern style. Correct me if there a is southern 8 step.

[Eddie]

Im not an 8 step practitioner, but I did learn a few 8 step forms from a good friend of mine, who was a close student of some master (forgot the name now) in Malaysia or Singapore. Great style, but to be honest, I still prefer southern fist.
like anon said, I also thought 8step was northern.

[JMagnano]

Maybe people are confusing 7 Star which I THINK is northern with 8 Step which LAST I KNEW was derived from Plum FLower which went to Southern Shaolin while 7 Star stayed North. 7 Star is northern, an offshoot of Plum Flower. 8 Step founder Sam Dart was from the Bamboo Forest which is Southern. By the way if you want to know more about 8 Step from a Grandmaster, go to www.8step.com
and you 'll find James Sun's web page.

[Tainan Mantis]

8 Step is a Northern PM style unrelated to Southern PM.
GM of this style is Wei Hsiaotang. He came to Taiwan in 1949 where he spread the style.

At this point in time no record of this style in China has been found. Nor is there a record of his teacher Feng Huanyi.

As some people mentioned there is a James Sun teaching in the states.
In Taiwan no record of him ever having studied with GM Wei exists.
This has caused a great controversy in the different Western 8 Step schools.
In Taiwan nobody gives a hoot.

Previously private footage of the 8 Step GM Wei has become available. It bears absolutely no resemblance whatsoever to the 8 Step of James Sun.

7 Star is also a distant cousin of 8 Step. Both are Northern PM styles.

Eddie,
What are the 8 Step forms you learned?

[NorthernMantis]

Ok I think we went over this like months ago.

8step mantis is northern because:

1) I checked out the webiste you gave and wich I saw years ago, it does not say it is southern or claim any llink to southern mantis

2) As a northern mantis stylist I can veryfy that it is northern

3) Traces it's lineage to wong long like all the other northern mantis styles

4) There's 8step practitioners in the northern mantis forum ie stacey ,Paul Lin among others

5) Plum flower never went southern

6)There was a big battle between Shyuns students and other 8step mantis guys (even went to court to I believe) that was publicised in the northern forum

7)The sevent star/tigerstance/hanging stance/etc is particular to northern mantis

I've talked dot many 8step practitioners including 8stepsifu who is no longer a parrt of kfo.

Quite frankly I'm starting to believe you want to make trouble for Master Shyun because of that problem that 8step guys had and that you might have anger towards him sicne we went through this months ago.

If I'm mistaken and you still dont' believe me come to the northern mantis forum and discuss it with your fellow 8step mantis brothers and your other mantis relatives.



8 Step founder Sam Dart was from the Bamboo Forest which is Southern.

Correction the 8step founder was Wei Hsiao Tang and even Master Shyun's site and other 8step mantis sites can back me up on that.

[Stacey]

Dear Tainan,

you have absolutely no clue what Master Sun teaches. I respect that you do some 8 step forms. You have no idea what 8 step is, so please stop fashioning yourself as an expert. I believe that no one in Taiwan gives a hoot. From what I hear, either does Master Sun. If Paul Lin wants to make a name for himself by bashing Master Sun, he can try, but in reality, he's nothing. Please don't make assumptions about something your not apart of. I'm not saying that I am, but I've seen those forms Master Wei was doing and I've seen Master Sun do the same. Neither you, nor I are in a position to make blanket statements. I can't comment on your Sifu, so please don't comment on Master Sun unless you have seen him. As for the "no documentation" please look on www.8step.com for Mastter Wei's certificate. To those that absolutely hate him, nothing with prove it anyways and its really a mute point. No one who has challenged Master Sun has had even the balls to fight students of his students, so those making the "controversy" don't have enough faith in what they are saying to back up their challenges. Its pathetic really and cowardice has no place in the martial arts. I don't associate you with these people, because I beleive that you are someone with a great love for tang lang chuan and want to see everyone at their best.

Thanx a bunch


Stacey

[Tainan Mantis]

Stacey,
I assume Master Sun is a good fighter since his students back him up.

In part my comments are based on a video of Master Sun performing a Taibei version of Luanjie which includes a marker to identify where it comes from.

This is a modified form originally from Zhang Dekuei.
The form is still good, but why does he teach this one?

All I know about his teaching are the forms I have seen him do, about 5 or 6.
They are done differently from GM Wei. I would think that if the two lived together the style of performance would be similar.

GM Wei looks somewhat like Tong Bei and Ba Gua, Master Sun does not.

And his demo fighting with students. That was PM no doubt and of the short strike variety which is good too.

[NorthernMantis]

lol sorry Tainan I didn't see your post before mine's it was really late and didn't bother to correct my spelling mistakes.

Oh and this was gone over a few months back with Eddie.

[Tainan Mantis]

Northern Mantis,
No problem. I thought it was a strange reply to what I said.

So I guess I can forget what Eddie said about 8 Step being it other parts of Asia?

Eddie?

[Stacey]

Tainan, the reason is that he doesn't like videotape.

He did and then some guy in Florida was claiming to teach 8 step from Master Sun and he was terrible. He didn't want to see every karate school teaching 8 step like they did "grappling" after watching a ufc tape.

So whatever he does in public is "modified" so that people can't copy it.

As I get into it more I have relearned parts that are more indoor in their application. It used to be frustrating, but we get more in depth techniques. My Sifu (not Master Sun) points out the movements that tell where the set came from, why its different with the public version etc etc.

There is also a wide range of material, so some classes dealing with kicking could appear to be tkd, while other classes have been strait ba gua or suaii chiao, while others deal with palms or hand techniques that are from snake style. There is so much, that I can't say with any authority what 8 step looks like and am naturally skeptical of people who claim to be able to. Sometimes 8 step looks like CLF and other times like wing chun or Tiger Style because of the grabbing.

I saw Master Wei's movements, what his body looked like and it looks like Master Sun doing sets. From what I understand, the sets train the core movements, after these are understood, there is more flexeblity with application.

[Eddie]

sorry guys, didnt read the post until now.

Tainan,
I have a group of friends who came from all over asia few years back. one of my friends came with this group.he moved here about 6 years back from south east asia. he wasnt a qualified teacher or sifu, but once we shared some ideas. He taught me two mantis forms, and some basic drills. The first form was called meihua chuan, and the second im not to sure about. i have always been interested in mantis style, thats why i liked learning the sets. it was more out of curiosity from either side so it wasnt anything formal. After that, I never really trained the sets often, so now i have probably forgotten most things.

I really like kung fu, and I like sharing some thoughts with some of my friends. i believe this gives me a better understanding of kung fu, and ultimately help me improve my own kung fu. The only reason why I commented on this forum was to show some support to your great style ļ.

northern mantis,
I cant remember chatting to you about mantis style before? Im not sure what you meant in your post. Im not interested in any politics wrt kung fu. I only now remembered the things that went on in this forum re the spm. I don¡¦t know any of the people involved
Nice chatting,
eddie

[Jamesbond_007]

Is this the same 8 step mantis that was in the most recent Inside kung-fu magazine? Or was that a different version? Just wondering

[JMagnano]

I never said Plum FLower was southern only that 7 star stayed northern and 8 step went south. How do you explain Bamboo Forest being southern and 8 step is not according to you. 7 star is a northern form of plum flower and 8 step left the northern system. Again I ask you if Bamboo FOrest Temple is Northern or Southern. 8 Step came from the North buyt how do you explain Bamboo Forest.

Thank You,
JOE


Originally posted by NorthernMantis
Ok I think we went over this like months ago.

8step mantis is northern because:

1) I checked out the webiste you gave and wich I saw years ago, it does not say it is southern or claim any llink to southern mantis

2) As a northern mantis stylist I can veryfy that it is northern

3) Traces it's lineage to wong long like all the other northern mantis styles

4) There's 8step practitioners in the northern mantis forum ie stacey ,Paul Lin among others

5) Plum flower never went southern

6)There was a big battle between Shyuns students and other 8step mantis guys (even went to court to I believe) that was publicised in the northern forum

7)The sevent star/tigerstance/hanging stance/etc is particular to northern mantis

I've talked dot many 8step practitioners including 8stepsifu who is no longer a parrt of kfo.

Quite frankly I'm starting to believe you want to make trouble for Master Shyun because of that problem that 8step guys had and that you might have anger towards him sicne we went through this months ago.

If I'm mistaken and you still dont' believe me come to the northern mantis forum and discuss it with your fellow 8step mantis brothers and your other mantis relatives.




Correction the 8step founder was Wei Hsiao Tang and even Master Shyun's site and other 8step mantis sites can back me up on that.

[NorthernMantis]

Jook lum ( bamboo forest) praying mantis was founded in the south by an entirely different person and does not have any connection to any northern mantis style.

Any southern mantis practioner on this board wether they be chow gar, jook lum or any other southern mantis style can verify that.

peace

[NorthernMantis]

lol my bad eddie I mistook you for JMangano

[Eddie]

no worries Northern mantis. nice topic.
I have another one for you guys.
there is a kung fu sifu down here who cames from china/mongolia. he teach a style called san xi seven star mantis which obviously comes from san xi district (same place as bagua, yi chuan etc). This style of mantis looks very different than other sevenstar of which I have seem. Its more internal, very similar to taiji. to be blunt, it seems like an awsome style. Have you even heared of this style before?
Eddie:cool:

[mantis-1]

JMagnano, there is no connection between 8 step or 7 star mantis to southern praying mantis not to chow gar, Chu gar, Dit Ngau or jooklum tong long pai's.

peace

[NorthernMantis]

Not really but I have heard that seven star has sub styles (like most arts do) that are of just a different family that had the system more personlaized to fit their philosophy.

Coming form san xi I'm not surprised at all since it was obviously influenced by those arts. It's great that you had the chance to see it.

[Tainan Mantis]

Eddie,
If you learned this form then it is surely not 8 Step. This form was probably created by Luo Guangyu of 7*. He is responsible for introducing PM to the South of China.

Shan Xi 7*.
I am interested in this style.
I have seen the Tong Bei from this region and it looks very similar to 7*.
Does this Shrfu have a web page?

[Eddie]

Here is the website for the sanxi 7star mantis.
http://www.hualongwushu.cjb.net
Eddie

[David]

JMAGNANO is really making me laugh. Give it up, man - it's not SPM: apples and oranges m8. jeez.

[Tainan Mantis]

Thanks Eddie for that info.