What haven't been identified in WCK?

[Hendrik]

Tan, Fook, Direct, Short range power, YJKYM, ...
All has been popular.

Do you FEEL, something missing? something not quite right?
there are things which haven't been identified or reveal yet?


Something that will make the Tan, Fook, Direct.......Breathing and motion coordination while doing SLT......
to be crytal clear.

Something make the big picture, the details, and oneself become one pice. Something makes everything as clear and obvious as the gravity.

there, No need to argue anymore. No need to drop names... it is just clear, crytal clear, and tangible ---- what need to be done. what is the destination. what is the cause. what is the effect... not a single blur.


What do you FEEL?




------------------------------
Feeling don't lie.
Feelings.... oh oh oh Feelings. :D

[EnterTheWhip]

quite fulfilled in my Wing Chun.

(though sometimes.... just sometimes.... I feel that I'm missing Carl Dechiara.)

[red5angel]

EntertheWhip, you should be missing the Wing Chun training he offers ;)

[yenhoi]

I FEEL like im NOT missing someone who posts riddles. :(

[red5angel]

You cant escape the Whip Yenhoi!!!! ;)

[yenhoi]

I was talking about hendrik :eek:

When is whippinghand gonna be unbanned? :cool:

[red5angel]

he doesnt need to be, he has a new moniker..... see above :)

[reneritchie]

Hendrick stop trolling.

[red5angel]

Hendrick, some people are missing root, others structure or soft power. It looks like they are doing WC but with a few important details missing who knows? Is it a lineage thing? An instructor thing? I am going with a knowledge thing, thats what is mostly missing........

[yuanfen]

Hendrik- did you take a lesson from Firehawk before your last post?

[Mckind13]

Maybe they just lack experience and confidence!

You only need a single technique for any situation if you use it perfectly.

No soft, no hard, no Tan Bong Fuk just WCK done perfectly in the moment.

I'll tell you when I get there

;)


David

[kj]

Originally posted by Hendrik
Do you FEEL, something missing? something not quite right?
there are things which haven't been identified or reveal yet?

Not any more. At least nothing that more practice, development and experience won't fix.



Something make the big picture, the details, and oneself become one pice. Something makes everything as clear and obvious as the gravity.


Pun intended? :)



there, No need to argue anymore. No need to drop names... it is just clear, crytal clear, and tangible ---- what need to be done. what is the destination. what is the cause. what is the effect... not a single blur.


Not nice to tempt folks with something unless they can have it, or at least a clue how and where to find. ;)



What do you FEEL?


If I didn't know better I'd think you were selling something, LOL. Can you be more explicit and direct with your point in this thread? If you are on about something other than what seems obvious, I think I'd regret to miss it.

Regards,
- Kathy Jo

[fa_jing]

He means CHI POWER!
;)

[kj]

Originally posted by fa_jing
He means CHI POWER!
;)

Oh. Thanks for spelling it out.

Regards,
- Kathy Jo

[Hendrik]

Originally posted by kj


Oh. Thanks for spelling it out.

Regards,
- Kathy Jo


No, it is not about Qi power.....ect
Qi? to be honest, how many knows what it is and can activate it? or say, just simple to heal oneself.... just words without content?
it is not about troll.... wasting of energy.

It is about see and experimenting to master things from different angle... all angle..... justification to oneself.....what one "knows" not what one "thinks"

Why should I belive my sifu is right or correct? Why is the SLT is perform this way?
Why is people said those sam bai fut is intenal training? So how should I breath while I am doing that? what coordinate with what? how is this training produce the results?....

There is no absolute answers. But, the quest to know why. The paradigm beyond the fomula and open to question what one is doing.

It is always easy to say this is the way how my sifu thought me..... but then do one really understand? master the skill?

for example,
Say doing fok sau.
I would say, There are different dynamic diamention and phases interact and coexist.

There are link to the shift of body weight. There are link to the focus of intention...... There are Ying Yang interchanging....
When one touches or track others with fook similar to cover other's hand with a silk cloth --- one phase. when one decides to issue energy.... ----one other phase.

So, there are alots of things behind the Fook. how can one knows these? I guess question and question and try and question.....? no fomular..... no other can replace oneself.. needs to find out proper path........

Sure there is nothing wrong with what people practiced or do today. The question is what should want master before one knows one "have" it master.

So, it is not about oh I know it all or trolling...

it is about there are other paradigm.

as the Zen saying. 1, there is mountain.
2, mountain is no longer mountain. 3, mountain is just as it is mountain.......
Can't jump from 1 to 3. Can make belive 1 is 3. 2 is not the ultimate even one thinks he knows more then others.....

difficult to communicate but perhaps someone might know what I am talking about?

It is strange stuffs. But then it is not about thinking. it has to relate to both concious and subsconcious. otherwise I won't use feeling.....instead of thinking.

[yylee]

Originally posted by Hendrik

difficult to communicate but perhaps someone might know what I am talking about?


some one told me that the true power of WC comes from the unconscious, the rest are just levers and body mass distribution/transfer/movements.

honestly I don't know what he meant because my left brain hemisphere is in the way, and my right hemisphere speaks a different language ;).

[S.Teebas]

Sometimes WC requires an abstract path before it really IS wing chun.
Somthing my Sifu said to me (i think ive mentioned before) is you have to learn the rules before you can break them!

I like hendricks posts because they really make you think! :)

[kj]

Originally posted by Hendrik
No, it is not about Qi power.....ect
Qi? to be honest, how many knows what it is and can activate it? or say, just simple to heal oneself.... just words without content?
it is not about troll.... wasting of energy.

It is about see and experimenting to master things from different angle... all angle..... justification to oneself.....what one "knows" not what one "thinks"
<deletia>

It is strange stuffs. But then it is not about thinking. it has to relate to both concious and subsconcious. otherwise I won't use feeling.....instead of thinking.

Now I follow much better. And to the degree I may understand, I very much agree.

To learn and practice Wing Chun is not merely a cognitive exercise, nor a physical one. IMHO and IME it is also a strongly "experiential" one. It is also a journey of personal discovery.

I think it is not equally easy for everyone to be open and patient enough for this part though.



difficult to communicate but perhaps someone might know what I am talking about?


Much better now, and more what I thought you were poking at to begin with. Thank you for expounding.

I am also glad it was not one of those nettlesome "I have chi and you don't" kind of posts, LOL.

Regards,
- Kathy Jo

[Hendrik]

The kuen kuit said :

Gentlely subdue the opponents within split of an inch
tranquil similar to the autums' moon
active like the tronado......


how can one arive there without the details, the thoughts, the experiments, the view from different angle .........
until somedays "a mountain turn back into a mountain"

Otherwise,

" The Training on the essense of the movement's details" or SLT will lost it's "heart."

[Hendrik]

"I am also glad it was not one of those nettlesome "I have chi and you don't" kind of posts, LOL."




in Chinese, get mad is said as " give birth to Chi" or Shen Chi.
no one has to learn to get mad. LOL

Only dead people doesn't has chi.
:D

[Rolling_Hand]

--difficult to communicate but perhaps someone might know what I am talking about?--Hendrik Da Lips

**You always have a choice: you can limit your perception so that you close off vastness, or you can go on with your *hee hee hee* to touch your soul.

[EnterTheWhip]

Success in Wing Chun comes down to one simple concept - training. Whether you have the answers/secrets or not, the success comes down to that, not the knowing.

[teazer]

Success in Wing Chun comes down to one simple concept - training. Whether you have the answers/secrets or not, the success comes down to that, not the knowing.

I'd agree within certain parameters, though 'Success' is a fairly large brush with which to paint.
People can become remarkably effective at fighting despite doing inefficient things, training in inefficient ways, causing themselves irreperable injury etc.
Understanding why you do something is at least a nod towards evaluating it's likely efficacy. Then you follow up by training the bejeezus out of it, then back to reevaluate progress.

[red5angel]

Teazer beat me to it. I think knwoledge is important as well. I fyou dont know what you are aiming for, or why you do a certain thing it may not work as well.

[EnterTheWhip]

Originally posted by teazer
I'd agree within certain parameters, though 'Success' is a fairly large brush with which to paint.

Teazer, I use the words "success in Wing Chun". That's as specific as it gets. I did not use the terms "success in fighting", nor anything else.

[[Censored]]

If you train with the wrong idea your ability goes down. Train harder, and it goes down more. So how can we say it all depends on training?

If it all depends on training, should we say "the one who trains the most will be the best"? This prediction doesn't match the reality.

Call them secrets, discoveries, details, whatever. They have always been there, but they won't show themselves to everyone with a desire, and you can't buy them with a bucket of sweat. :eek:

[red5angel]

E-Whip, those phrases should be interchangeable. Success in wing chun should be the same as success in fighting.

Before MP or Yenhoi gets excited, success in fighting doesnt have to mean success in wingchun just that if you are successful in wing chun you will also be successful in fighting.

[yenhoi]

:eek:

True dat red5 :D

[Rolling_Hand]

--E-Whip, those phrases should be interchangeable. Success in wing chun should be the same as success in fighting.--Red5

**SUCCESS IN WING CHUN is a continual journey. To be a WCK warrior is to learn to be genuine in every moment of your life. Red5 is on the roll. humm.....

[red5angel]

I just thought I would cover my bases with you two Yenhoi, since you both jump on errors like a pack of dogs on a three legged cat! ;)

Rolling Hand - good point!

[teazer]

I use the words "success in Wing Chun". That's as specific as it gets

In which case, for a 'successful' wing chun school, the secret is $$marketing$$ (and coloured belts ;) )

[Rolling_Hand]

--In which case, for a 'successful' wing chun school, the secret is $$marketing$$ (and coloured belts )--Teazer

**This is just a little conversation takes place in your mind. It's your state of mind. We cannot redesign our physiological system, and for that matter, we cannot redesign our state of mind.

[Grendel]

Originally posted by Rolling_Hand
--In which case, for a 'successful' wing chun school, the secret is $$marketing$$ (and coloured belts )--Teazer

**This is just a little conversation takes place in your mind. It's your state of mind. We cannot redesign our physiological system, and for that matter, we cannot redesign our state of mind.

Who's we? You got a turd in your pocket?

[anerlich]

RH,

are you gunning for Hendrik's crown as "most incomprehensible poster on KFO"?

[Rolling_Hand]

--Who's we? You got a turd in your pocket?--Grendel

**You may feel that you have a good vision for society but then who's to say Rolling_Hand can't pull a rabbit out of your pocket?

Humm....

[Rolling_Hand]

--are you gunning for Hendrik's crown as "most incomprehensible poster on KFO"?--Anerlich

**What one cannot live with may not bother another man's conscience. The result is that conscience will stand against conscience.

[anerlich]

I guess I can take that as a YES.

[Fresh]

Originally posted by anerlich
RH,

are you gunning for Hendrik's crown as "most incomprehensible poster on KFO"?

At least Hendrik tries to communicate. Rollinghand tries his best not to.

Thanks to all the people on this board who try and contribute something real. There are a few of you make the reading worthwhile, even though there is a lot of junk to wade throuhg to find it.

I guess I am to stupid to turn on the ignore feature, but it breaks up things and makes threads more confusing to follow. Maybe some day I will learn not to care about the ones who are being jerks.

[Rolling_Hand]

--At least Hendrik tries to communicate.--Fresh

**Too bad that all the people who know how to run the world are busy driving taxicabs.

-- Rollinghand tries his best not to.--Fresh

**Harsh as it may sound. It's your privilege to believe what you like!

[Geezer]

Fresh wrote>

At least Hendrik tries to communicate.

I just ignore his posts, they never seem to pan out or make any sense.:confused:







I'm ready for the reply;)

[reneritchie]

3.4

[Geezer]

6' 4"

[Rolling_Hand]

--3.4--RR

**To be a warrior is to learn to be genuine in every moment of your life. That's the warrior's discipline. In other words, 10 should be the right number, and you only can have fun with your 3.4 in your own house.

[Rolling_Hand]

--I guess I can take that as a YES.--Anerlick

**Are you an expert of HOLD'EM poker?

[anerlich]

**Are you an expert of HOLD'EM poker?

No.

[reneritchie]

Sheldon - While ignoring trolling attempts is the best course of action, it's also a time-honored internet tradition to rate them on occasion. Unfortunately, we have few high quality trolls (those who manage to inform, entertain, and enlighten whilst trolling, and garner some form of community respect) here, thus the repeatedly low marks (without even the benefit of a Swedish judge).

[Geezer]

Rene, I thought you were telling me your height, that's why I responded with mine;)

All joking aside I find Hendriks cryptic messages too confusing, I find it easier just to ignore them. ;)

[reneritchie]

Hendrik is not a master of Western communication, and he's often the first to admit that. I find he does much better in Cantonese or Mandarin, especially to those of the same culture. It often takes me quite a while, and sometimes repeated re-questioning, to figure out what he's trying to say (and while he's a frequent tease, often times he's struggling just as much and is just as frustrated). Personally, I've found it well worthwhile on occasion. Of course, other people's mileage can and does vary.

BTW- This should be old hat to you. You know what they say. England and the US are two nations separated by one ocean and two different languages ;)

RR

[Geezer]

Rene wrote>


BTW- This should be old hat to you. You know what they say. England and the US are two nations separated by one ocean and two different languages

I fully understand, I find easier to talk to the Canucks(lots of Ex Pats) than the Americans, I still have trouble speaking to my wife seeing as I haven't fully mastered Red-Neck yet:D

[yuanfen]

Red Neck? Them are fighting words in some parts- you hear?

[reneritchie]

Geezer - Amen! You know you're a redneck when you get divorced but stay cousins! LOL!

RR

[Hendrik]

Originally posted by reneritchie
Hendrik is not a master of Western communication, and he's often the first to admit that. I find he does much better in Cantonese or Mandarin, especially to those of the same culture. It often takes me quite a while, and sometimes repeated re-questioning, to figure out what he's trying to say (and while he's a frequent tease, often times he's struggling just as much and is just as frustrated). Personally, I've found it well worthwhile on occasion. Of course, other people's mileage can and does vary.

RR


Hi Rene,

The reason of I am here is that I am trying to share and discuss information. I am not here to compete for best English composition writting.

Very often, the discussion of WCK become the discussion of my English. May be some has to ask themself on the shallow foundation of thier WCK instead of my English.

There is a term in Chinese ----" Chien Dee" in madarin or (Chien as see, Dee as ground".
So what is Chien Dee?
Why don't the English expert try to translate what is "Chien Dee"?
In additon, do one has "Chien Dee" in WCK.
Is that an easy job? LOL




You know, in 1850's , even the WCK ancestors choose NOT to Kow Tau to the invaders who bring opium to China even under the Gun point. Look at the Shang Hai Dien Chun Dong's history.

Today is 2002.
If communication is not under the condition of mutual respect. then,
Big deal.

I am only interested in communicate with people who knows how to communicate with mutual respect.

[kj]

Originally posted by Hendrik
I am only interested in communicate with people who knows how to communicate with mutual respect.

I feel the same, Hendrik.

There are a lot of two-way operations, communications and respect high among them. Peppering in a little patience can go a long way, as can a pinch of appreciation for effort.

I admit that you have me going on the chien dee thing now. :)

Regards,
- Kathy Jo

[yuanfen]

Hendrik's English is not very good but some of his references require an often intuitive sense of comparative semiotics given the subject matter. But he isnt a troll!

[kj]

Originally posted by yuanfen
Hendrik's English is not very good but some of his references require an often intuitive sense of comparative semiotics given the subject matter. But he isnt a troll!

His English is a whole lot better than my Chinese.
- kj

[EnterTheWhip]

Originally posted by red5angel
E-Whip, those phrases should be interchangeable. Success in wing chun should be the same as success in fighting. Red, I am making no reference to fighting, by conscious choice. It is not so relevant to the argument as you might think.

[Rolling_Hand]

--All joking aside I find Hendriks cryptic messages too confusing, I find it easier just to ignore them. --Geezer

** Obstacles have a funny way of working in Hendrik's favor these days. It may appear to be more trouble than it's worth, but it's because Hendrik's in the beginning stages. He enjoys talking about his feelings and frustrations in his WCK. Is that someone not getting enough fun out of life?