breathing?

[Ajax]

</lurk>
Hi all. I wonder if any of you could give me some basic advice on proper breathing technique. The school I train with teaches us to hold our breath until after a strike, but I know that's not right, and I don't have any conception of breathing rhythm/timing for sparring and forms. If anyone has a link to a good web page on breathing technique that would be enough; I just need something to start with. Thanks from a struggling newbie :confused:
<lurk>

[eulerfan]

We are taught to breathe out as we strike.

[Former castleva]

Opinions and methods vary but it is quite universal that breathing out while striking both saves your health and does wonders for your technique.

[SaMantis]

Yup you should breathe out with the strike, not after it. If you give a little yell (or a "yee" or whatever your system likes to holler) with each strike that will ensure that you breathe correctly and adds power to the punch.

On really hot training days the instructors tell us to yell when we strike -- it ensures that we keep breathing and don't pass out.

When we do warmup kicks (not regular kicking) we breathe in as the kick comes up and out as it goes back down. For regular kicks we breathe out with the strike. Just FYI.

[[Censored]]

Exhaling when you issue force is not "better"; it just raises the stakes.

[Ajax]

Raises the stakes of what? Yeah I knew holding your breath was stupid, too bad I can't just trust that what I'm being taught is "real" kung fu. I'm still curious as to what to do with a long sequence of motions like a form or a series of kicks or punches (one shallow breath per strike, or one deep breath in followed by a partial exhalation on each strike?) Thanks for the responses tho.

-A

[Former castleva]

Partial exhalation with serial strikes is used,again,not the sacred pattern but used still.
Like as you´d strike three times,you´d regulate your breathing to exhale a bit on every strike.

[[Censored]]

What happens to your car when the tires don't have enough qi? LOL. Or, what happens when your lungs are completely empty and you get hit? Try it yourself and see what happens.

Why does the breathing need to be fancy?
If you don't yell, will you forget to breathe? :rolleyes:

[dezhen2001]

i trained in systems that say breathe out as well as what i do now which says just breathe naturally... both seem to have different functions.

what happens if you have to strike while at the end of the out breath or breahting in?

dawood

[Merryprankster]

I was taught to exhale as I punched in boxing, FWIW.

Of course, boxers know nothing about punching or getting hit so maybe you shouldn't follow that advice ;)

Honestly, I don't think the reason is that mystical--I think a lot of people hold their breath when exerting themselves. If you train yourself to exhale when striking, it's not like you'll forget to inhale :D

[eulerfan]

Originally posted by [Censored]
Why does the breathing need to be fancy?
If you don't yell, will you forget to breathe? :rolleyes:

Not fancy and, well, yes. Generally, when I spar new students, more than anything else I have to keep reminding them to breathe. I think that, when you're nervous or tense, the tendency is to hold your breath. You just tire out so much easier when you do that. I've sparred new students who were runner, so they had more stamina. But I exhausted them because they got tense and forgot to breathe. Same with doing forms. You're concentrating on so much else you sort of forget to keep breathing steadily.

So, by training a student to breathe out when she hits, what you are really training her to do is keep a steady flow of air through her lungs.

So, dezhen, I think the two schools are sort of the same. If you are having trouble breathing naturally, training yourself to breathe out when you punch is a way to get closer to it.

[Merryprankster]

Great minds think alike. :p

[[Censored]]

So, by training a student to breathe out when she hits, what you are really training her to do is keep a steady flow of air through her lungs

That's crazy talk. The mark of an oxygen-starved brain. LOL, you'd better start punching your monitor before you pass out. ;)

[eulerfan]

Originally posted by Merryprankster
Great minds think alike. :p

Heh, I missed that before. Steal my thunder will you?!?!?!

We'll see about that.

;)

[iron_silk]

eulerfan

I make that exact mistake all the time

[censor] guy...so what happens if you get punched with no air?

[eulerfan]

Originally posted by [Censored]
So, by training a student to breathe out when she hits, what you are really training her to do is keep a steady flow of air through her lungs

That's crazy talk. The mark of an oxygen-starved brain. LOL, you'd better start punching your monitor before you pass out. ;)

Hmmmm. Interesting.

I find you interesting.

[Lowlynobody]

....so what happens if you get punched with no air?

You might find that its a little hard to breath in after being struck with no air in your lungs. As for multiple strikes I use short explosive breaths out and always hold some breath in reserve ie don't let it all the way out.


Lowlynobody.

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by dezhen2001
i trained in systems that say breathe out as well as what i do now which says just breathe naturally... both seem to have different functions.

what happens if you have to strike while at the end of the out breath or breahting in?

dawood

Some styles do advocate breathing in on certain techniques, like choking.

[NYerRoman]

Come on people.
Of course breathing out while striking is necessary.
Weight lifters do the same when lifting or pushing.

I just had my testicles operated on. I had varicous veins in them. The problem was when breathing and doing strenuous activities, (the blood circulates from the kidney area to the groin and back again), my breathing wasn't corresponding with the force. WHAM! CLOTS.

You had BETTER be sure your breathing out when striking.

[Former castleva]

Well when you get hit while exhale/d,it is less likely to "get the wind knocked out" of you.Things being like this,exhaling and striking simultaneously also serves to naturally tense your abs so you can better resist against such blows (besides being hard to...do I have to say really?)
Getting struck while inhaling is a "perfect" time to be struck and stunned pretty bad.

[Merryprankster]

No air, huh?

Be reasonable. You have to WORK to exhale so hard that you only have minimum capacity currently in your lungs.

Deep, deep breathing like that when you're doing a REAL athletic activity, like fighting, isn't going to happen. It's a short sharp exhalation and it's for making sure you breathe back in. :rolleyes:

Lastly, take a full breath from the gut like you're suppsed to, and have somebody whack you in the body. See how you like that. Oh wait... this is the part where somebody tells me about golden bell training, right?

[Merryprankster]

NYERoman:

Exactly! Holding your breath during strenuous activity drastically raises your blood pressure. This destroys the valves in your veins as they can't stand up to the backpressure and increases the likelihood of clotting (small tears in tissue provide a rough surface for coagulation)

Holding your breath is bad, mmmmkay? :D

[[Censored]]

Come on people.
Of course breathing out while striking is necessary.
...
No air, huh?
Be reasonable. You have to WORK to exhale so hard that you only have minimum capacity currently in your lungs.
...
Deep, deep breathing like that when you're doing a REAL athletic activity, like fighting, isn't going to happen.

The best lack conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity. That's what they say, anyway.

Generally, when I spar new students, more than anything else I have to keep reminding them to breathe.

And when you spar them, do you get hot, tired, and short of breath? If not, why not? It's a REAL STRENUOUS ATHLETIC ACTIVITY, right? :D

[eulerfan]

Originally posted by [Censored]
[i]Generally, when I spar new students, more than anything else I have to keep reminding them to breathe.

And when you spar them, do you get hot, tired, and short of breath? If not, why not? It's a REAL STRENUOUS ATHLETIC ACTIVITY, right? :D

Yes. Strenuous. Yes. Athletic. Very perspicacious of you to note that. Perhaps you can put that perspicatity to work on a problem I'm having.

You see, I'm not catching as many shrimp as I want. I set these little traps for them. It takes a long time to catch shrimp in them and I never really catch a whole lot of them. Can you think of some better way to get a whole load of shrimp?

[TaoBoy]

It can depend on the strength of the strike. Heavier strikes require greater exhalation. You should never exhale completely - get winded once without air and you will understand why.

[[Censored]]

Yes. Strenuous. Yes. Athletic. Very perspicacious of you to note that.

I didn't note, I asked. There is a significant difference. Like the difference between SKILL and ENDURANCE. Or the difference between martial arts and aerobics.

You see, I'm not catching as many shrimp as I want. I set these little traps for them. It takes a long time to catch shrimp in them and I never really catch a whole lot of them. Can you think of some better way to get a whole load of shrimp?

What makes you think I know how to bait shrimp? :)

[eulerfan]

I didn't note, I asked. There is a significant difference. Like the difference between SKILL and ENDURANCE. Or the difference between martial arts and aerobics.

Ah, yes. I'm sorry. How feckless of me.

What makes you think I know how to bait shrimp? :)

I don't know. I just get that feeling. You know how it is? When you get that feeling?

Like when you're strolling along in California and there's just this strange, nonspecific quality to the ground that makes you think, "These may be those La Brea tar pits I've heard so much about. I do believe I'll head back the way I came."

[[Censored]]

I don't know. I just get that feeling. You know how it is? When you get that feeling?

Sorry, I'm not really into that mystical stuff. :confused:

[eulerfan]

No need to be sorry. We all have our own paths in life.

[Serpent]

Breathing is as important to kung fu as any other part of your training. There are a number of different methods taught for different reasons. If you don't know the fine detail, just stick with the basic rule of exhale when you strike.

Ajax, dude you need a new school, big time!

[Censored], you're an idiot. eulerfan's being really polite, but you're either taking the p!ss or really embarrassing yourself.

[eulerfan]

Serpent,

A little advice before you get into this.

This guy is all about force. When somebody is all force, no technique, you want to break out the Tai Chi. Deflect. Absorb. Lots of 'come on in' moves.

Oh, and remember to keep breathing!

[[Censored]]

Yes, I'm an idiot. :) Welcome to the ancient Chinese art of steganography: don't benefit the insincere. Anyway, who needs bad advice given politely?

You recommend that one should let their opponent control their breathing. That is ridiculous. I think you won't dare address the issue directly, so start on the ad hominem or give up altogether. :)

[Serpent]

:rolleyes:

What can you do? Some people just don't want to know better cos they think they already do.

[eulerfan]

Originally posted by Serpent
:rolleyes:

What can you do? Some people just don't want to know better cos they think they already do.

Serpent. Take a deep breath, step back, and look at the conversation with [censored] as a gestalt. This is not about breathing. I could suck this guy's **** and he'd tell me the back of my head was ugly.

[Serpent]

Originally posted by eulerfan


Serpent. Take a deep breath, step back, and look at the conversation with [censored] as a gestalt. This is not about breathing. I could suck this guy's **** and he'd tell me the back of my head was ugly.

Dayum, that was funny! Well said, eulerfan. It's not even any fun to poke him with a stick, cos he's just so stubborn and ... well .... irrelevant really.

[Merryprankster]

LOL!

eulerfan is starting to make an eulerfan-fan out of me!

But I ain't changing my name, nohow!

[eulerfan]

No, Merryprankster is a great name! Makes me think of Puck.

[[Censored]]

Well, it was about breathing, but you've changed the subject. Now it is about empirical validation for all outrageous claims made above, I hope.

[eulerfan]

I've had to study quantum mechanics. I'm ALL GOOD with uncertainty.

[Ajax]

Well then, I've finally kicked the habit of holding my breath while striking. It does feel a lot more natural, and if it saves on just one little cerebral aneurism later on, then it'll have been time well spent. Thx for all the responses

-A