Real World MA:One of the most usefull things I've learned

[rogue]

I spent time this weekend practicing my shooting. As a bonus I learned how to clear a house (and not from eating old cheese). My instructor taught me how to properly check out the interior of a house using a handgun. As odd as it sounds this skill is great even without a gun. Say you hear an odd noise in your house and for some reason you have to check it out, what would you do? How do you check out a room and see the badguy before he sees you?

Many times we train how to handle ourselves in bars, in the ring and in the street, but I've never met many people that really trained what to do if they suspect or know that something is wrong in their own house. If you can find a good handgun school that teaches these skills sign up.

[Xebsball]

just do it like the cops do in the movies

[Radhnoti]

I would LOVE to take a course like that, but there's not even a NRA class available in my area, in fact I only found one in my whole state! That class is about 3 and a half hours away, the closest one would take a two hour drive to another state...and I have no idea what the prerequisites are for taking a firearm into that state.
What handgun did you use for the course rogue, if you don't mind my asking?

[rogue]

Various ones Radhnoti, though I've fallen in love with the Glock 17 that I used, but I still like the reliability of revolvers.

[guohuen]

My security six is always my backup.;)

[red5angel]

Rogue, what is it he showed you? I was on an anti-terrorist team in the marines and I leanred to clear houses in a dozen different ways depending on if you are alone, with a team, and how many people are with a team.
Doing some thinking about my training, a good thing to have is a mirror, on the walls at key locations in your house, specifically at the end of hallways and near corners.

[FatherDog]

At the moment, I'm living with my parents, helping them with house and yardwork (they both have bad backs) while I save up money for my own place. My mother doesn't want any guns in the house, and I respect her wishes, so I don't own one.

When I get my own place, I plan to get a shotgun for home defense and a pistol for target shooting at a range. I also plan to invest in a few courses like the one you describe. Is your instructor part of an organization you could recommend? Is there any particular type of class you would advise, or advise against?

[Stranger]

Fatherdog,

There is a place called The Gym in Howell, NJ that teaches WWII Combatives and at an offsite location combative handgun skills. GOTO www.ghca.org
Another instructor in this organization, Kelly Mcann aka Jim Grover, has released a video on extreme close range handgunning (ie almost belly to belly, employing clinching and infighting)


Gunsite makes some of the most highly rated videos. GOTO www.gunsite.com

As far as I know, the most highly recommended CQB firearm training available to civilians is Roger' Shooting School. You had better be really good before you walk in he door because it is very fast paced and not for beginners. Military and LEO personnel have commented that they have been in firefights that were less stressful than the course at Rogers.

[FatherDog]

Stranger:

Thanks for the links. I'll have to look into these places. Still a ways to go before I'm gonna do any serious training in firearms, though. Ah well... one thing at a time.

[rogue]

red5angel, Just the single person stuff. Pie into the room and pie the hall on your way out. I was also jamming myself when going through doors by staying too close to the door jam. There are just so many little things to consider when doing RC.

I personally don't care for mirrors as they work both ways. I prefer well placed motion detectors. For instance I have one placed so it overlooks the main room for downstairs and I can see it from the the top of the stair. Red light something is moving down there, green light I might be clear. The hard part is setting them up so so you can see them before entering the room but not set them off yourself. I drove the guy from the alarm company nuts getting them right.

[red5angel]

Sure, motion detectors work great but not everyone wants them in the house. We used to call mirrors and windows the poor mans motion detector. The trick is you know where they are and your intruder probably doesnt.
Its one of the things we used to look for, reflective surfaces we could use to see around corners and such. Watch for shadows, lighting etc... All those simple tricks.
Getting hung up is pretty common, thats just fear getting you to hug the wall, but you learn some interesting facts, for example, 80 some percent of all gun battles happen in less then 12 feet. Of these, only about 8% of fired shots ever hit the target. It goes up considerably with training, because you learn not to go into "protection" mode, trying to protect yourself from being shot. for example, you might put a hand up to try and "block" the bullet, but once you really think about the silliness of that action you start to learn to not worry about it so much. If your opponent has a gun and you can shoot him, he can shoot you, and putting other body parts in the way isnt going to help, so you put other stuff between you and him, or you make your silhouette smaller. Moving around doesnt help either.
I was reading an inteview with one of the guys from the whole blackhawk down incident. It was pointed out at some point he remained extremely calm during the entire thing and een under fire, was often seen almsot "strolling" from location to location. He said it was partially for morale, but artially because he knew he could run into a bullet just as fast as he could walk into one....

Personally, coming from all the stuff I learned, I would say, if I were in the house alone, and there was someone else in the house as well, I am going to set myself up somewhere where I can see him and have a clear shot when he comes out of a room. The other thing I am not going to do is warn him before I shoot him, I dont know his intent and if he is on the ground I dont have to worry about him trying to kill me.

[joedoe]

Care to share any of the techniques you were taught? The reason I ask is that a few nights ago my partner woke me up in the middle of the night because she heard a noise downstairs. I had to go check it out, and thankfully it was a false alarm, but the whole time I was thinking "Is this guy going to see me before I see him? Am I a sitting duck?"

[red5angel]

jodoe, stay mobile, dont get down and crawl around or any of that othr crap.
Also, keep one thing in mind, its going to be quiet in your place, if you heard him, and he is trying to be quiet, odds are he may hear you even if you are trying to be quiet so you move as little as possible.

[rogue]

joedoe, There are just so many little things and I'm still trying to absorb them. If you can't train I think Red gave some good advice. Set yourself up somewhere, stay quiet and wait for him to come to you, a good old ambush can work even without a gun. If you think you hear something downstairs and you don't have kids or someone else dependant upon you close the door and call the cops. One other thing to do is get familiar with moving around your home in the dark. Do it while wearing sunglasses and then eventually blindfolded. I was amazed at how unfamiliar I was with my own home when I first tried this.

[diego]

ABIT OFF TOPIC, BUT STILL INLINE: abit ago, i thought i heard a intruder, not owning a gun i flexed my pecs, went to the knife rack and grabbed a cleaver "wich is perfect for the hopgar i do's longarm strikes"; then went to the cupboard and grabbed a can of wd40. Thier was no intruder, but i would like to ask yall, do you know how good household spray appliances are as a MACE replicant?. I don't wish to test my sprays, and they have the poison symbols; How bad will items like spraypaint, paint thinner etc make you cry.

I seriously want replies or links here, as if someone does come i dont want to just make him flinch, I want the spray to make his eyes water, so i can hatchet him up!.
Goodday:)

[joedoe]

Thanks for the advice. So would you say the following things are bad?

*Using a flashlight.
*Calling out and warning them that you are going to call the cops (bear in mind this is Australia and guns aren't as abundant here).
*Actively seeking them out.

[Daredevil]

red5angel wrote:

I was reading an inteview with one of the guys from the whole blackhawk down incident. It was pointed out at some point he remained extremely calm during the entire thing and een under fire, was often seen almsot "strolling" from location to location. He said it was partially for morale, but artially because he knew he could run into a bullet just as fast as he could walk into one....

This reminds me of having watched the pros play tournament paintball (yes, I know -- paintball is hardly a portrayal of a firefight, but on a modern speedball field, the dynamics of the thing are close). The best players don't necessarily run full tilt from cover to cover, but develop this eerie ability to walk like a ghost on the field, sometimes in areas which (to observers) seem like foolhardy. It's all about timing and understanding the angles and fire arcs. Know where your opponent is and know your territory and you can do just that.

[ZIM]

The advice re: home defense from red5 is veruy sound.

Other things to consider tho (by way of adding): well-placed lighting can be a godsend. IME, well-placed nightlights can throw good shadows throughout. Yep, they can be taken out, but thats also a give-away that an intruder is in a specific area...a good glossy paint or wood finish is helpful too [in add to mirrors].

Also you should know what the composition of your walls are if youre using shotguns for home defense. Know which walls you can shoot through, firing angles, etc. and that goes both ways [ie that intruder might fire through them too]