wing lam learned hung from a girl

[word]

You guys can verify this if you want. DUring the very short time that wing lam was with Lum Jo's school he learned most of his Hung from his wife , who was at the school longer, now is his exwife, but he claims today to learn from lum jo but if you go ask lum jo's sons at the school they have the same questions we do, the son asked if wing lam learned his hung from yc wong, but wing denies it and keeps claiming to learn from lum jo heheh, wing's hung isnt' good anwyays, no hung expression and no foundation...

[TenTigers]

Yim Wing-Chun/Fong Wing-Chun was a girl, Fong Chin-yang was a girl, Mok Gwai-Lan was a girl, I would be proud to learn from any one of them, Ngoh Mei P'ai is handed down from Mother to Daughter. so...um, what's yer point?

[iron_silk]

I think the title is miss leadingly sexists.

I main issue was that there was potential fraud and misrepresentation.

But I have no idea what the truth is...

[once ronin]

there is alot of fraud out there, not just this issue.

[neito]

skill is skill nomatter where you learned it. lying is always stupid. plain and simple.

[word]

my point is that he is a liar and only cares about his wallet, which is why he refuses to admit that he learned from the girl, yc wong, wong jack man, and all of that stuff, no honor, and hey he teaches northern shaolin, hung gar, hsing i, pa kua, wing chun, tai chi now too,

[JAZA]

It's ugly to talk bad of a person.

[GeneChing]

I find this statement particularly ironic since 1. Wing Lam is my Sifu and I administrate this forum and 2. One of Hung Gar's great female masters, Shui Ying, just passed away (see our Jan/Feb 2003 issue for an obituary.)

word trolled Wing Lam a long time ago but did it enough that many of my martial brothers remember him and relly wanted some retribution. Now I'm in the position to ban him, but I'm not going to at this time, since I firmly believe everyone here has the right to voice criticism, even if it is unfounded. This is sort of that old strategy of giving someone enough rope. So bring it on, word, bring it on.:cool:

[Nevermind]

Very well said Gene, and I have to commend you for taking the higher approach and simply ignoring a useless troll. Like the poem says, "if nothing is done, then all will be well". Ignorant people usually fade away when they are ignored for long enough. By the way, Wing Lam is my kwoon's SiGung and although I have not had the honor of meeting him or seeing him in action, if my Sifu and SiHing's knowledge and skill is any reflection of his teachings, I would definitely say that this troll's comments are totally unfounded.

[BearBear]

Is his Kung Fu Good?
Is wot he Teaches Good?

If so... who gives a *hit if he learnt from man, woman or martian ... Lam Jo or Lam Jo's gardiner ...

Tell me more about Hung Gar Kung Fu ...

1. Respect others no matter what art they practice.
2. Never condemn anyone.
3. Every art has something good.

BearBear

[hasayfu]

I'm with Gene. I ignore him because he has no basis for his statements.

Wing Lam is my sifu and his reputation stands long and strong so word requires no response.

I am concerned,however, that many of the new folks may believe his rantings and cast a shadow on his reputation.

First, he says ask his sons. Have you asked them? I admit that I haven't but why should I? I've visited Si-Gung Lum Jo and seen the registration picture from the records he keeps. Kinda of stupid to ask if he studied there. Si-Gung recognizes him. Lam Chun Fai came and visited Lam Kwoon and calls him a peer.

For YC Wong, it is true that when sifu first came to the US he searched out his kung fu elder brother YC Wong and they trained together. But if you claim his time with Si-Gung was short, then his time with YC was even shorter. Fact is, he was not living in Chinatown and it was easier for him to train near his work. That's how he eventually got into teaching.

Sifu has been very open about his instructors. No Fraud or misrepresentation.

Bottom line, his Kung Fu is good. Many have learned and benefitted from his 35 years of contribution to the MA community.

I've never understood word's unfounded hatred towards Sifu. I won't even try to convince him otherwise. For all the others, you can decide for yourself.

Oh, and before word rehashes the tired mantra that Sifu made up Ha Say Fu Hung Gar, buy the iron palm book. You'll see the pictures of Sifu Training with Leung Wah Chew.

[BearBear]

wow 2 posts were made while i was typing this..

geneching sums it up well :P

[yuanfen]

Gene- Sifu Wing Lam is too big a figure to be affected by trolling.
Anonymity and hiding behind a key board brings out all kinds of trolling. I wouldnt give it a second thought- I know it rankles-
understandable.

But regarding "I firmly believe everyone here has the right to voice criticism, ".....

any chance of unbanning Whipping Hand and issuing an invitation to return? Lots ot worse stuff on the forum than WH's posts.

[phoenix-eye]

I recently had the honour of training with Sifu Wing Lam in the UK.

All I can say that if it was a woman who taught Wing Lam then she must have been amazing and it would be a privelige to train under her. Sifu Lam's kung fu is fantastic.

I am only interested in advancing my own kung fu - not denigrating others.

[GeneChing]

...intelligent criticism is always appreciated. And Wing Lam is human, just like any other master, so he possesses human flaws like the rest of us. So I challenge word to voice an intelligent criticism. You can search the archives on his prior comments - as hasayfu mentions, they are all pretty weak.

It reminds me of a person (who will remain unnamed) that I used to compete against regularly. We faced off several times in forms and even once in sparring, and I had this guy's number. I could slam him at will. At that time, his skill was no where near mine. I tried to be nice about it, but he took it real personal like, and constantly said bad things about me. I took it in stride becuase when it came right down to it, I bested him. I won. Anything he wanted to say was just sour grapes. Same goes for word. I don't see his students/books/videos/store/etc.

So word, bring it on. Let's see what you got, boy.:cool:

[STUDD WILSON]

Hey, correct me if I'm wrong but isn't word the poster formerly known as James? Wasn't he originally banned from the forum? And didn't he claim to have learned Wing Chun while living in England through videos or something?

[STUDD WILSON]

You're such a tool. Supposing Wing Lam is a fraud as you claim, have you ever seen him in action? IF so he's one of the baddest mutherf*&$#$# frauds there is. I would feel like a bad ass if I could do just 1 of the shaolin forms that he can.

[STUDD WILSON]

Sorry if I was a little hard on you in that previous post. As a troll you're not nearly as big of a ******* as Ralek(Rolls) or Knifefighter.

[yuanfen]

Anonymous trolls like Word deserve no attention. Replying to them give them the attention they crave. They relish being shocking in their episodic appearances. Sifu Wing Lam needs no defense.
joy chaudhuri

[once ronin]

years back i had the chance to work out with wing lam on filbert st.

i was walking pass his school and noticed a poster advertising driving classes. i walked up the stairs and thru the front door wasa stairs on the right going to the basement.

i thought the building was pretty unique. there was an upper and basement area for training.

wing lam was a good martial artist. he had 2 systems in his program you could choose from. at the time it was if i remember northern and southern.

at the time i remember talking with him only about hung gar. this was 20 years plus ago. anyone practicing hung gar for this period regardless should be alot better and doesnt deserve the trolling he is getting.

with lum jo's status he has never came out to troll anyone so way does this guy word do this? lum jo has always let people come out and do their own thing. the truth is the truth you can ask his daughter at the school, there are photo's of wing lam's ex but lum jo's daughter will say lum jo could care less what people say or do. i hope word will not use lum jo's name in any trolling again.

[word]

Yes I have asked Lum Jo's sons and students there and they told me what i said in my first post. Now forget about the lineage stuff for now, you guys say that wing lam's skill is awesome. And someone said that wing lam is honest and open about his teachers, does he admit learning from wong jack man? before he got kicked out of course

intelligence is my middle name. just playing . when i take a look at lam doing his hung sets or shaoiln sets they don't have the distinct flavor that those two DIFFERENTE styles are known for. When he plays the sets, they both have the same power. if you guys have seen yc wong's hung in the last few year you would know exactly what i'm talking about, that is the expresion of what hung should be,and lam's hung doesnt have that expression of power, it looks like shaolin and his shaolin looks like hung, only different movements.

foundation, lam has no foundation, his horse is weak to me. a horse does not have to be high or low, only the alignment matters. and whether the horse in any style, it should have that suction, that melting and rooting inward, more of an internal feeling, now thta is horse stance and when you get a horse then you can start to get power from the earth, all of which lam does not have.

conclusion - he doesnt know what makes a certain style a style, every style has it's unique look and fighting ability, he has no foundation, no horse, no internal skilll. but hey he'll take you to china on an expensive tour to that you can train with some bald chinese guy with a long chinese name that twists your tonuge when you try to say it.

[word]

in the end, if you guys don't agree wiht what i say, nothing that i say more will make you agree, but oh well, you may not have reached that level or been exposed to that type of kung fu, in the end it doesnt matter anyways, there's too many people that don tkonw hwat they're doing that i should be used to it by now, someone onec told me if a sifu talks higly of himself and prmotes himself so much, that doesnt' matter, but if the sifu talks down of others to make himself look better, then that's a problem and so far wing hasnt done that, not that i have heard of, but anyways, whatever, no more typing on this topic, it's pointless, gene will think he's good and well,. .. ok. ok **** mymail jut came and i got myspeeding ticket.

[tparkerkfo]

Hi word,

Out of curriosity, how have you seen Wing Lam? Videos or inperson? I am not defending him as I really don't know him and have not seen his stuff. I have several videos, but I know first hand how decieving videos can be. Perhaps first hand experience is better judgement.

As far as qualifications, I can't answer that. Lam sifu has done many things to promote kung fu. I am sure his skills are fine. I am also sure there are many better, though that is probably subjective. I also don't see any problem with Wing Lam training with YC Wong or Jack Man Wong. I doubt wither would claim him as a student as I am sure Lam doesn't claim them as teachers. Are you in the Bay Area? Does YC Wong and Jack Man Wong know your using there names? How about Lum Jo's son's?

And just what is your purpose of this thread? Do you study Hung Gar? Are you better than Lam Sifu? Who are you? Does Lam Chun Fai even know you? Probably should worry about yourself more than worring about Lam Sifu. If Jack Man Wong or YC Wong have any problems with Lam sifu, that is between them and I am sure they would clear it up if need be. I doubt it is much of an issue, but I suggest you talk directly to YC Wong or Wing Lam if you have any quesions. Both have Net representatives and neither are too hard to find.

Tom
________
****ing face (http://www.****tube.com/categories/821/face/videos/1)

[fuhok-kid]

Originally posted by word
in the end, if you guys don't agree wiht what i say, nothing that i say more will make you agree, but oh well, you may not have reached that level or been exposed to that type of kung fu, in the end it doesnt matter anyways, there's too many people that don tkonw hwat they're doing that i should be used to it by now, someone onec told me if a sifu talks higly of himself and prmotes himself so much, that doesnt' matter, but if the sifu talks down of others to make himself look better, then that's a problem and so far wing hasnt done that, not that i have heard of, but anyways, whatever, no more typing on this topic, it's pointless, gene will think he's good and well,. .. ok. ok **** mymail jut came and i got myspeeding ticket.

WORD SEEMS TO HAVE A BIG AXE TO GRIND WITH SIFU WING LAM AND HIS EXECUTION OF FORMS, BUT READ THIS QUOTE " If a sifu talks down of others to make himself look better, then that's a problem" NOW THIS IS WHAT HE ALSO SAYS "you may not have reached that level or been exposed to that type of kung fu, in the end, it doesn't matter anyways, there's too many people that don't know what they're doing that I should be used to it by now". I DON'T KNOW IF WORD IS A SIFU OR NOT, BUT WITH WHAT HE SAYS IN THE SECOND QUOTE, I THINK HE DESCRIBES HIMSELF IN MY FIRST QUOTE.

[Turiyan]

Women in general are better teachers and better students than males. Just dont trust them with secrets. They have a psychological need to gossip. They have four lips.

[once ronin]

the truth is what people wants to hear or feel they dont want to hear.

i feel for "word" for the point he tries to make. but i dont believe in trolling someone in public.

what has been said in the house of a school should remain there as it is the opinion of the students and teachers be it truth or gossip.

highest authority on this matter is lum jo and he doesnt make a public issue of it so no one else should.

now if you have information on how things are misinforming then on a public forum you can state it.

if you present yourself as trolling someone then no one will listen to you. if you say the history of things someone said is wrong and back it up with records people will take your words more constructive.

[omarthefish]

I guess I haven't been on this board long enough to be innured to the rantings of Word. He made a couple of comments that are just beyond my imagination.

Did he actually try to make a comparison between Lum Jo and YC Wong's Hung Gar and say YC 's was more authentic or did I just dream that?

Jum Jo is YC Wong's Sifu for cying out loud. How could YC's Hung Gar be more authentic than his own teachers? I am well aware of the differences seeing as YC Wong has been my Sifu for about 9 years now. I know that the Hong Kong guys play it a bit different from us, but it is hardly more "the expresion of what hung should be". I'm in a mine field here because I can't state too directly on a public forum how I feel they are different without risking influencing my relationship with various students of Sifu or maybe even Sigung, but I gotta say, Trying to put YC above his own Sifu just takes the cake.

This is all for now. LMAO ROFL and anything else I can say to express the idocy of a statement like that.

[BearBear]

Word ... u must be pretty awsome.. and very high level skill to critise people of 20 or 30 years experience.. how long have u study hung gar?

can i see some pic or mpeg or vid of u doing hung gar please?

thanks

BearBear

mm ho yong hao, yong sao
don't use your mouth, use your hands

[Nevermind]

If Word has a beef with SiGung Wing Lam, perhaps he should go right to the source. Or maybe speak in person with some of SiGung's senior students. I'm sure they would be more than willing to discuss these matters. Word, what do you have to gain by mouthing off about someone on the internet? This goes for any troll who uses the internet to discredit an established Grandmaster. These are people who have paid their dues and dedicated their lives to promoting the arts. Regardless of what you think of their style or their skills. They deserve respect because they have worked for it. So again, Word, who the hell are you to discredit them?

[GeneChing]

"in the end, if you guys don't agree wiht what i say, nothing that i say more will make you agree," "
That's because your criticisms are unintelligent.:eek:


"someone onec told me if a sifu talks higly of himself and prmotes himself so much, that doesnt' matter, but if the sifu talks down of others to make himself look better, then that's a problem and so far wing hasnt done that, not that i have heard of,"
Case and point - you're talking down of others, word. Just what is your beef with my Sifu anyway? Aside from the fact that he produced a martial pest like me?:p


"no more typing on this topic"
Is word good to his word? I think not. Let's watch and see.:rolleyes:


"**** mymail jut came and i got myspeeding ticket."
That's karma. :D

[Subitai]

Hmm word,

You said Wing Lam does his Nothern Shaolin like his Hung Gar and vice versa...

If someone were to accuse me of that, i'd take it as a compliment.
I guess HG didn't come from shaolin roots so that must be a bad thing...poppy****!
* That's totall nonsense, Shaolin kicks are my standard to judge by. Not many can equil the kicks of shaolin in speed and power. At least as performed by the top monks.

Never mind that EVERYBODIES kung fu should be an evolutionary process, always changing and never standing still.

I guess whomever you are learning kf from is still doing HG the same way he learned it from the beginning?
** Word, are you implying that Y.C. is your Sifu? Say it isn't so, he is too respected to have a moron like you as a student.

And I don't even need to get started with the whole Wong Jack Man accusation. We kicked your arse verbatim with sound arguments long ago. You've only waited what(1 yr?), to resume your idiotic dribble.

You didn't have a leg to stand on then, nor do you now.

haha
"O"

[kai men]

Hi everybody.
Yes, I have heard that nonsense before. GM Kwong Wing Lam is an uncle in Beishaolin to me, and I respect him a lot. Curiously, what I most like from him is:
1) His strong fundation in Hung Gar Kung Fu
2) His nice students who are a proof of his integrity and skill
3) His videos which show he has kept training as his new ones show him better than in the older ones.
Skill is skill. I can't assure nor deny the true in the accusation, but I cannot deny he is something. He has made a lot of contribution to Bak Siu Lam, Hung Gar and Ha Say Fu styles.
He has had the humility to compete in Jinan in 1991. I have the pleasure to see him performing the same tai chi chuan movements I do.
I am a humble instructor in Buenos Aires, Argentina, student under GM Chan Kowk Wai (Bak Siu Lam). KWL is my aunt in kung fu. In my country, my brother and I are (perhaps) among the most important kung fu sifus of our country.
I have received emails saying that I am not Chan Kowk Wai student, that I am not a teacher, that...many nonsense words.
I allways say the same: NOBODY KICKS A DEAD DOG.
Or as in Spanish Literature you can read:
"they are barking, Sancho, that means we are riding".
Peace
Horacio

[omarthefish]

NOBODY KICKS A DEAD DOG.


Senior Quiote obviously doesn't go online much.

[Diamond Talons]

Both you HDR & your brother are known by those that travel those parts of the world. Good season's greetings to you & your brother & I hope all is well with the both of you & your families.

[yuanfen]

Horacio is for real. Hi Horacio-greetings to Claudio.
Just passing through! I dont visit much here.
As you know Sifu Wing Lam's standing is not affected by
the xxxx chats that occur on lists.
joy chaudhuri

[GeneChing]

KWL is my aunt in kung fu.

I think you mean "uncle." Wouldn't want anyone to get sexually confused, especially given the topic of this thread. ;)

Nice to see our BSL cousins outside the Shaolin forum!

[kai men]

Dear Gene:
PLEASE forgive my mistake! I must have been confused by the macho attitude of the first post jaja...anyway, kindest regards to your Excelent Master, you and your families, and greetings extended to my Dear Friend Joy and other fellows who have had so nice action to salute.
Peace
Horacio

[GeneChing]

I'm sure I'd make even more mistakes like such if I had to write in Spanish (or Portuguese.) No problemo, mi primo.:)

[md1]

so what if sifu lam learned from a women. does that make him any less a sifu. how many of you learned anything from your mother?.......does that make you any less a man.
get off your high horse.

md1

[omarthefish]

Wing Chun anyone ?

[Je Lei Sifu]

Back in September, I had the pleasure of meeting Master Kwong Wing Lam and two of his students. He (KWL) was a very gentle and kind man who had demonstrated great calm in a situation where others may choose not to be calm.

I think the focus on who he may or may not have learned from is irrelavent if you are not a student of his. Just as he has demonstrated his calm in the past, I believe he would under the circumstance that are written in this post which is aimed at criticizing him.

A person who has not put himself in the eye of the public to be criticized should not make an attempt at someone who has. It does not matter what you think of his skill level or who you asked to confirm the authenticity of his training. The one truth is that he has displayed his ability to master himself and his emotions.

KWL should be respected for his ability to spread the martial arts of China but northern and southern. His contribution to martial arts have kept many interested in gung fu be it through media or directly at his kwoon.

Peace

Je Lei Sifu

[word]

SUBTAI

If someone told you that your shaolin looks just like your hung then thta's a negative comment, because why is each style branced out in a different STYLE anywyas/ because they all have their own distinct flavor]

Yes, marital arts revolve aroudn the same principles, but they have their own uniquess and that wong jack man thing, what you mean you aruged about it before? i'm saying he learned from him before he got kicked out, but will your sifu admit that he trained there? i never said yc wong is my sifu but i sure say he represtns good hung in the usa, i've seen him demo his hung , tai chi in tournaemtns, teach shoalin and wing chun at his school and seen a few of his great wepaon videos. sarcasm. i'l end on this note, all styles dont look the saem and shouldn't look the same, where did KWL master shaolin, hung, tai chi, xing yi, wing chun, shuai chiao along with all the weapons and other sets? wow look slike he's getting his hands on any style , sets , forms that he can sell .

[David Jamieson]

word-

I totally disagree with what you say about the shaolin flavour coming through in styles.

many styles have been "touched" by shaolin and if not for shaolin, many styles would have fallen away long ago.

also- there are fundaments of body mechanics that are same same across all human form. the shaolin codified and cannonized these fundaments long ago. the shaolin flavour is quite apparent in "walking" for instance, because if done correctly, then the body mechanics and kinetric motion are 100% efficient.

if 2 styles show the same body mechanics then this is good because it shows that both styles ( or 3 or 10 or what have you) understand the correct principles of kinetic energy and bio mechanical motion of the human form.

the position of strength, the root, the fluidity, etc etc, is all the same, to say different or to think different imho is incorrect assumption.

practice more.

[Gold Horse Dragon]

Personally, I find this whole thread one that should have been deleted long ago! To attempt to discredit a good sifu with such nonsense is quite childish and it seems to me that this is driven by jealousy for the success of Kwong Wing Lam sifu and his Kwoon.

No two individuals are the same and thus every person brings their own uniqueness to any given set. That said aside, Kwong Wing Lam sifu does not perform Hung Gar like Bak Sil Lum nor his Bak Sil Lum like Hung Gar and this is CLEARLY evident in his videos which I had the opportunity of viewing a number of years ago.

GHD

[HuangKaiVun]

What's wrong with Kwong Wing Lam SELLING videos?

Lam Sifu does a great job of marketing and presenting his information. I know - I have bought all sorts of stuff from him and not once have I been dissatisfied.

As far as learning from a woman goes, some of the most vicious techniques I ever learned were from women. Don't mess with women who know how to fight.


word, you have stated repeatedly on this forums that your videos would be vastly superior to Kwong Wing Lam's.

Since you are allegedly a kung fu man, PROVE IT by putting your videos on the market. Let's see if your videos sell more than Wing Lam's do.

Better yet, pay Lam Kwoon a visit and voice your opinions. You've been there in person before but were too afraid to present yourself. But maybe you've gained strength since then.

Perhaps they'll learn a thing or two from you, since they're the ones you're criticizing.

[omarthefish]

Originally posted by word
[B]SUBTAI

If someone told you that your shaolin looks just like your hung then thta's a negative comment, because why is each style branced out in a different STYLE anywyas/ because they all have their own distinct flavor]



That's a silly comment because Hung Gar is Shaolin. I know not all gong-fu styles are actually Shaolin but Hung gar is about as close to southern shaolin as your going to get.

Now if you mean your northern Shaolin looks just like your Hung gar, that's another story.

[word]

omar, that's what i meant, his hung looks like northern shaolin.

[Gold Horse Dragon]

Word...in one word...NONSENSE!

GHD

[GeneChing]

When word first started posting here again, it was ironic to me. He trolled Wing Lam way back in the archives and got several of my martial brothers quite upset. That was before www.KungfuMagazine.com inherited this forum. So naturally, when he popped up again, they got upset again, and have contacted me about this.

Perhaps my perspective has changed after administering this forum so long, but I'm doubtful that I'll delete this thread. Sure, Wing Lam is my sifu, and I will fight to defend him. But at this point, word has yet to put together a significant argument worth defending AND everyone else on this thread supports my sifu. So in a way, it's a great endorsement. To me, it's kind of like if some sparring partner started talking smack but he was someone you could easliy defeat. You wouldn't kick him out of your school necessarily. You just keep beating him. It's fun and proves your point.

As for the crossfertilization of styles, I'll be the first to cop to that. Wing Lam's Hung Gar influences his Shaolin, his Tai Chi, etc. Of course it does. Just like a classically trained jazz guitarist might have influence from his prior training, he can still make music. Every martial artist should examine every other style and, to qoute Lee, "absorb what is useful." Purity is for petri dishes.

[word]

oh well, it doesnt matter, making music or not, i give up. but i know there are those few people on here reading this that agree with me but choose not to come out and say it because it's of poor taste, thtas' why i keep my identity hidden . blah blah if you guys dont understand, then i dont konw, maybe you will some day, hopefully for the sake of kung fu.

[GeneChing]

This is kind of like someone who claims their technique is better and their technique is to strike your fist with their face. Please don't give up, dear word. You can continue to slam your face against my fist as long as you desire.

Let's look at your last statement:
but i know there are those few people on here reading this that agree with me but choose not to come out and say it because it's of poor taste, thtas' why i keep my identity hidden . The part that I really enjoy is "poor taste." You're admitting your actions are in poor taste. That just slays me. :D Then you go on to say that this is why you are hidding your identity? Too much! My fist is getting sore from smashing your face. This is
for the sake of kung fu :confused:

word, you're a gem. You do for Wing Lam critics what Quayle did for elected officials. Wing Lam needs more like you. :p

[word]

gene i'm glad you're enjoyin it , no point in bringing up other stuff cause you guys dont even get what i'm saying in the the first place, wing lam's fighting applicaitons are horrible and his weapon applicaitons are even worse, not to mention he cannot fight, i heard once that he was teaching wc, and then one of his wc studetns went somehwere else to learn for liek 6 months and came back and had wing on the wall. , in the end he's empty. but oh well, no more of this post.

[Sandman2[Wing Chun]]

Wow! I can't belive that word has returned to the forums! Of course, if you want real "old school" trolling from word, you have to look back even more, to when he would troll on the Wing Chun forum back before he even started trolling about Wing Lam. That must have been almost 3 years ago! And he's still trolling! Astounding!!!!!

[GeneChing]

Now I'm just baiting him to see how many times he'll say,
i give up.
no point in bringing up other stuff cause you guys dont even get what i'm saying in the the first place &
but oh well, no more of this post. It's boxed him in a corner since now everytime he posts, he sticks his foot in his mouth by invalidating his previous posts. He's great fun for me, esepcially since he's coming after my sifu.

[bean curd]

a sifu's skill in transmission is not only how he does this with his martial skills but also how he teaches his students to conduct themselves.

when to speak, when to be quiet, when to fight and when to laugh.

reading this thead it is clear lam kwok wing does this well, it is not enough to look at a sifu, family is larger than this.


for what it is worth, to those students who are lam sifus' :D you have much to be proud off

take care

[hasayfu]

Thanks for the kind words Bean Curd.

Si-Hing Gene,

Your forum-fu is BERY good. No can defend.

I wasn't going to post to this anymore but I couldn't resist the props. Everyone can go back to ignoring this thread....

[GeneChing]

Told ya so.


I love saying that to my little brothers....:p

[kai men]

Dear Gene:
I have rescued a great post from this thread. Of course, word didn't write it jajaja, you did.
You said that every sifu that has studied several styles gets influenced in all his actions by the different styles he performs.
Quite a real thing!! completely agreement here.
Let's take Su Yu Chang. All his mantis movements look like Ba Ji, not because they are wrong, but because he has the Ba Ji power in the mantis movements. I dont see anything wrong here. Even Beishaolin might have been in some time, a mixture of different skills from someone who mastered other systems.
My sifu Chan Kowk Wai (sorry I will say Kowk as he writes kowk ;-) knows shaolin , pa kwa, tai chi, hsing yi...obviously his skills he has got from that training are in everything he does.
So what some say about Kwong Wing Lam (with the intention to discredit him) is something that happens all the time, and is perfectly normal!
I have always thought that Kwong Wing Lam's strongest skills are the Hung Gar skills. I am not an expert in the subject but I have trained Hung Gar some years, and I have always got shocked by his Dragon Shape form, for example. And your performance of Ha say Fu in Jinan (I ve seen the video tape) is something excellent and has to come from a qualified teacher indeed.
So DEAR WORD you can say anything you want from your annonimous personality, it is quite an easy thing to talk as you do, specially when the "target" of your comfortable virtual battle is someone who is completely exposed because has devoted his life to the nice job of spreading his arts.
Take care
horacio

[Gold Horse Dragon]

I can agree with a little transference across styles in a sifu or student, but not to the extent that the southern becomes northern and vice versa. As having seen Lam sifu's tapes, IMHO (finally know what this acronym means now) there is a most distinct flavour separating Lam sifu's northern and southern sil lum (shaolin).

GHD

[GeneChing]

Undoubtalby there is a point where all of the cross training breaks off into something new entirely - JKD or BJJ, even Aikido is a fairly young style. I don't think Sifu Lam has reached that level. His northern and southern are still distinct, but I won't deny you can see influences. As long as those influences are positive, I don't see a problem.

You got to keep in mind, I'm here in CA where mixing flavors has created its own style, CA cuisine, and it's yummy.

This brings us back to the initial point of this thread. If memory serves, it was Sui Ying (a woman) who introduced Butterfly Palm (a northern set) into the Hung Gar curriculam. She was the one who passed away recently, that I mentioned earlier in the thread. I was told she introduced it to bring some northern tactics that she felt Hung Gar lacked. Now for many, it is an important introductory set for many Hung Gar practitioners, but it definatley retains a northern flavor, and rightly so. Now, is that southern or nothern?