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View Full Version : They're all talk with nothing to back it up



ricksitterly
01-13-2003, 12:27 AM
"Most people, normal people, will do just about anything to avoid getting in a fight" ~ Fight Club

In regards to the whole cell phone situation from 'not as civil as you think you are' (and others like it), my take is that you're average non-martial artist (better yet, your every day macho a$$hole), does a lot of tough talking (this is related to that other thread but is addressing a different issue). How many times has a guy told another guy "I'm gonna take your head off!" or something to that effect, meanwhile, in reality he's not, in any way, a trained fighter... usually just a college kid who watches too much TV. Not that I don't enjoy the tough attitude of people these days, just that there isn't much to back it up. You see this "hard" image portrayed in our media of music, television, sports, etc, and as a result of this, you see it in our every day citizen. *(or perhaps it works the other way around, but that doesn't matter, I'm really don't care about that argument)* The point is, people are all talk and little action and when it comes right down to it, if the situation really does escalate into a fight, these people look like fools. I see it all the time, and it doesnt matter who the winner is because they basically look like two monkeys engaged in combat.
Also, I dont think a lot of these people really expect a fight to happen. They're just so used to talking sh!t, and showing someone "what's up", that they fake it to a point where the other guy is afraid of a physical confrontation, and therefore the other a*zhole walks away the "winner" (and looks cool in front of his friends). Of coarse, in the rare even that they messed with a real fighter, they would get their as$ handed to them in ten seconds. A good friend of mine who trains has been making people eat their words for a little while now. The last instance went as follows: He was following someone a bit too close, (since this guy was driving like an old lady), and this must have really bothered them, because when they finally caught a red light, the guy got out of his car and was yelling like a tough guy "so you think you're smart huh??". The guy was roughly 220 lbs and a good 40 pounds heavier than my friend. My friend got out and said something like "get back in your car you fat piece of *** or you'll be sorry." Long story short, he proceeded to beat this guy down and left him laying in the street next to his car and then got the hell out of there. This was a crowded intersection around 3pm. While my friend can be an real a$$ with the way he drives, the other guy is the one who decided to take this confrontation outside of the vehicle, and I feel he got what he deserved. As heroic as I thought it was, I've noticed that he's had about 4 fights like this in the last year. Which goes to show that for every person you teach a lesson, there's another 100 waiting in line to take their place. You can't change society by beating up one guy who's acting tough. So what's you're take on it guys and girls, is it worth it to teach these people a lesson?

friday
01-13-2003, 12:44 AM
dont know about the fat guy but i think your friend probably needs some driving lessons or a course in 'how not to drive like an Ahole and **** ppl off'.

:D

Laughing Cow
01-13-2003, 02:00 AM
Not worth to go out an try to tech people lessons.

Sooner or later someone, somewhere, somehow will teach you a lesson.

Reminds of the story of one Martial Artists in Asia.
Tough fighter took everybody on, in the end he got in trouble with some powerful people.
They didn't send people to beat him up as he was too good, but they killed him in a drive-by shooting.

Your decisions.
Do you want to go around making possible enemies or live your life quiet and comfy.

Excession
01-13-2003, 03:50 AM
I agree with Laughing Cow.

"the other guy is the one who decided to take this confrontation outside of the vehicle"-ricksitterly
So did your friend, he could have drove off, tried to avoid a fight, but didn't, he chose to fight. Most (I think) legal systems apportion blame, so while your friend may not legally be totally accountable, he will share some of the blame. I also apportion moral blame, but thats just my belief system. I suppose thats why we have a legal system, to provide common accountable ground between belief systems.

Do I believe I should be teaching people a lesson because they irritate me? Maybe, but certainly not by fighting. I like my life thanks.

dezhen2001
01-13-2003, 04:50 AM
the guy got out of his car and was yelling like a tough guy "so you think you're smart huh??".

so the guy was just venting coz someone caused a problem... it would have been just as easy to stay in the car or diffuse the situation... BUT...

The guy was roughly 220 lbs and a good 40 pounds heavier than my friend.

great odds, how silly is that! Oh but he can FIGHT so it makes this ok... what if the other guy had a crowbar or gun?:rolleyes:

My friend got out and said something like "get back in your car you fat piece of *** or you'll be sorry."

What kind of person says that? Someone who is not in control themselves - or they are just looking for trouble. Everything we do has a repercussion, especially if we train and use our MA skills.

Long story short, he proceeded to beat this guy down and left him laying in the street next to his car and then got the hell out of there.

impressive:rolleyes: What kind of heroic thing is that to do? Just to leave the scene after causing injury to someone? great... What if the guy had a heart condition or other illness? What if the beat down was MUCH more serious than a bloody nose? very intelligent...:rolleyes:

if this is what martial artists are supposed to be like im glad im not like it,

dawood

Royal Dragon
01-13-2003, 05:25 AM
I see nothing heroic about it. Maybe in days gone by, fighting was something forced apon people, but I today's day and age, you should be able to avoid prettty much all hostile encounters.

In my day, in have taken plenty of "Street challenges", but still there is something quite different about two fighters testing skills in a competitive way, even if it's a street fight. When real hostility is present, your talking a whole new ball game. One where either side can justifiably feel like thier very life is threatened, and use lethal force to defend themselves.

I always avoid a real violent encaounter if I can. I make them persue me, making it clear they won't let me go standing. Once it has become physical, only when THEY physically engage first, do I respond with incapactating force.

ricksitterly
01-13-2003, 05:33 AM
i agree that both sides were wrong. I personally dont go around fighting like that, and somehow, my friend has never been arrested. I agree that he has some serious anger management problems, but i'm entertained by the fact that he doesnt take any lip from anyone. Yes, he even starts some unprovoked fights. In today's world, messing with someone can be a BAD idea(if they know how to fight), but fighting with someone who messes with you can be worse(especially if they have a gun / knife/ whatever ). I sarcastically called it "heroic", but if you read closely I wasnt implying that his actoins are "right", just that I found them entertaining (with my twisted sense of humor). I also have NO intentions on defending his ability to drive a car(which is dangerous to himself and everyone not driving a tank). People have taunted me in traffic before, but I've never actually gotten out of my car to fight. You have to admit that people have really tough attitudes behind the wheel of their car (sometimes even Moms driving station wagons). I like the idea of someone that makes people back up their tough driving attitudes with their fists. Havent you ever wanted to strange someone who cut you off and gave you the finger?

ricksitterly
01-13-2003, 05:35 AM
oh i meant strangle someone, not strange someone lol

dezhen2001
01-13-2003, 05:51 AM
theres a difference between feeling emotional and acting upon it.

dawood

ZIM
01-13-2003, 06:56 AM
They're just so used to talking sh!t, and showing someone "what's up", that they fake it to a point where the other guy is afraid of a physical confrontation, and therefore the other a*zhole walks away the "winner" (and looks cool in front of his friends).

There is a sociology term for this phenom- the "Bad4ss". Its been discussed in the literature for about 20 years, I believe. You see it with bikers, gang members, prisoners, lawyers even. They do it so that they do not have to fight, but still terrorize in order to get their way. Society supports the Bad4ss effect, whether we admit it or not.


A good friend of mine who trains has been making people eat their words for a little while now.

A lot of ppl have been giving you crap about this- they are correct in that your friend is becoming what he despises. He is establishing himself as the new "bad4ss". I understand, in a way- theres nothing like popping someone who's been giving you crap, but it can go too far. Dude! Anger management and decaf! Get him a girl! :D

MAs don't train you to become some kind of punk. Still, I'm curious: what art is he training? How long? Does his sifu approve?

ricksitterly
01-13-2003, 07:39 AM
We trained at the same tae kwon do school for roughly eight years, and also did a lot of jiu jitsu. Since joining the military a couple years ago, I believe he got into a small kung fu training club there. I dont remember any instructors from these various arts ever approving of such behavior.... well, probably our old jiu jitsu instructor wouldnt mind lol, but those bjj grappling people tend to have a different mentality to fighting (namely a redneck, egotistical mentality... where I've trained anyway).

It just goes to show that you can teach an art with the best intentions, but there will always be people who misuse it. If I ever start a school, I'll be sure to try to produce respectable citizens, not tough inmates. ;)

GLW
01-13-2003, 09:20 AM
An interesting aside...

In China, the Instructor could be held accountable for the wrongdoings of the student. Facing jail or worse for actions of a student would definitely make you think about who you taught.

ewallace
01-13-2003, 09:33 AM
A trial just finished up here a few weeks ago with a man being sent to jail for about 20 years. It was essentially the same situation as your friend was in. Guy was driving a mustang, and someone cut him off. He (mustang man) got out of his car at the stoplight to confront the driver of the car that cut him off. The other guy got out too. I'm not sure who actually started the physical confrontation but it ended up with the mustang guy getting stabbed. He died at the scene.

ricksitterly
01-13-2003, 11:50 AM
lol mustang man!!!! i like that..... (the name i mean, not the guy gettin' stabbed). next time i meet a guy with a mustang, i'm gonna call him that.