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View Full Version : Kung fu represented at a fairly recent MMA event



DragonzRage
01-24-2003, 01:15 AM
I was shopping for a birthday gift for my roommate at Suncoast and came across a Gladiator Challenge tape in the sports section. Compared to UFC or Pride, GC is a b-level event more along the lines of King of the Cage. However, many up and coming fighters compete in such events and many solid fight teams are represented. The tape was only 11 bucks and included a fight with Duane Ludwig, who i am a fan of. So I bought it. I was surprised to see that there were two kung fu fighters in the mix. This event happened in 2001, but that is still pretty up to date in terms of fighting standards for current MMA. I hadn't seen any kung fu guys in a serious MMA event since the old UFC days. So it was a surprise and I also looked forward to the added variety.

Unfortunately neither of the two kung fu guys was too impressive. One guy was a Wing Chun guy who also seemed to have some basic grappling knowledge. He fought Duane Ludwig, who is an up and coming MMA fighter known for his fierce Muay Thai skills. Ludwig is a skilled kickboxer with K-1 experience. I give the wing chun guy credit for fighting spirit and being able to put up at least somewhat of a fight, but Ludwig spanked him pretty hard. He managed to land one or two sidekicks and made a couple failed attempts to blitz Ludwig with straight punches. I think he tried to set up some techniques in close range, but Ludwig would just put him in clinch and manhandle him. Ludwig showcased some very nice Muay Thai combos at his opponent's expense. The ref stopped the fight onceit seemed obvious that Ludwig was pummeling the guy with no response. If they let it go longer he probably would've maimed the poor *******.

The other guy was some dude they billed as having studied kung fu and kempo all his life. I don't think they mentioned what specific style of kung fu tho. This guy was more pathetic than Ludwig's opponent. Altho Ludwig's opponent was easily outclassed in his match, he at least seemed somewhat competent and prepared for a fight. This dude just didn't have a clue. As soon as the bell rang he runs across the mat and jumps at his opponent with a flying sidekick. The other guy (who was a submission wrestler) simply caught him in mid air, slammed him down to the mat, took his back and choked him out. It lasted less than ten seconds.

In any case, it was interesting to see a couple kung fu dudes fighting in a more current MMA setting. Once Sanda guys start learning submissions, I think they'll make definite waves for the Chinese arts.

dezhen2001
01-24-2003, 02:44 AM
its cool that they were at least 'represented' in some way, but a running flying side kick? OMFG! :eek: i cant even fight well and know not to try something like that - especially against a guy who grabs people and does all manner of nasty things to them for a living!

very unimpressed at that thought - and as for the chain punches:rolleyes:

kudos for them getting up and doing it though - i know i would have got pummelled and cried for my mommy as well :D

dawood

DragonzRage
01-24-2003, 03:48 AM
"its cool that they were at least 'represented' in some way, but a running flying side kick? OMFG! i cant even fight well and know not to try something like that - especially against a guy who grabs people and does all manner of nasty things to them for a living!"

I agree with you, but I guess some people watch too many movies. I have doubts about that guy's legitimacy. Altho the wing chun guy who fought Duane Ludwig wasn't that imressive, he was still a lot more credible than Mr flying sidekick.

dezhen2001
01-24-2003, 04:09 AM
i guess impresiveness also depends on the comparison between you and your opponent. if my opponent was a pride or K1 champ like his was, then for sure i would look crap in a MMA event too! :D

dawood

ShaolinTiger00
01-24-2003, 07:41 AM
from the underground... thanks "Steve" !

Cung Le's student James Franshier fights in King of the Cage, last two times he won (don't know how many total fights he has had) without even having to go to the ground.

Houston's Mike Altman has fought MMA and is undefeated in that format

Current national amateur champion Adam Resnick is 3-0 (2 KO) in shoot fights

3 members of Brazil's national san shou team fought three BJJ guys in 98 or 99 and all won with KO's

Russian who beat Cung in the worlds in 1999 is so far undefeated in MMA in Japan...

Merryprankster
01-24-2003, 09:34 AM
It's simply AMAZING what you can do when you actually train to stay on your feet!

ShaolinTiger00
01-24-2003, 09:43 AM
when you actually train to stay on your feet

you said it!

Ford Prefect
01-24-2003, 11:00 AM
I'd like to see more San Shou folks cross-over as well. I'd like to see how their clinch work would compare to Thai trained NHB guys.

Suntzu
01-24-2003, 11:04 AM
SanDa rules has knees… but u wont see me making the switch… groundwork is just not my thing… I'll learn it … but fahgedaboutit…

fa_jing
01-24-2003, 11:33 AM
My Sifu participated in some King of the Cage matches and did quite well, so I hear.

But he was cross-training for years. Wing Chun/JKD/boxing/Tai-Chi/tan tui/some grappling etc. I don't even know the source of all of his techniques. He didn't study BJJ though.

His most impressive win was over some Muy-Thai guy that was supposedly built like Jean -Claude Van Damme.

ShaolinTiger00
01-24-2003, 11:42 AM
Ford Perfect. Let me say that from my own experience, Sanshou and BJJ go together like yin and yang. - the other picks up where one ends.

The only reason you do not see more of it is because san da in the US is a very small community.

DragonzRage
01-24-2003, 11:43 AM
Guess i was right about the Sanda guys. I'd like to see more of them as well. Their throws are cool and would add more excitement into the MMA mix.

fa jing,

What's your teacher's name? I watch KOTC sometimes. I'll keep an eye out for his fights.

fa_jing
01-24-2003, 12:53 PM
Nah, he's 42 now and probably won't fight anymore. That was at least 5 years ago. His name is Nikita Young Johnson.

GunnedDownAtrocity
01-24-2003, 03:28 PM
i still dont think that one guy (delucia?) who fought royce in one of the early ufcs did that bad at all. he certainly didnt do any worse than any of royces other opponents.

ShaolinTiger00
01-24-2003, 03:34 PM
jason delucia later went on in mma and had a pretty good career.

GunnedDownAtrocity
01-24-2003, 05:06 PM
so why does everyone site the guy for why kf sucks in ufc?

omarthefish
01-24-2003, 05:53 PM
If the rules are really open, I think sanda has the advantage in the clinch. MT has the knees but Sanda trains for throws, it's one reason I think whoever it was on the last page who mentioned sanda and BJJ would go together, was on the money. A better match than MT and BJJ IMHO.

Less adapting would be required. The hands are already more like boxing than MT and in they are already trained to catch kicks and throw the other guy down. I just recently watched a 'propaganda piece' :rolleyes: called "Sanda vs. Karate". It was a VCD of a big invitiational where a bunch of Japanese fighters came over and competed with the Chinese fighters. I call it propaganda because, although it wasn't fixed, if the Japanese fighters did well they wouldn't have made a VCD of the tournament.

Anyways, I got to see one guy actually dive in and grab the Japanese fighter around the waist, arch over backwards (twisting at the end) and piledrive the guy head first into the ground, ending the fight. :eek: Very cool.

SevenStar
01-24-2003, 10:40 PM
today's MT has alot of boxing. There are also takedowns, though they're not used in competition. kick catching is also practiced very regularly.

The difference in the clinch is how it's used. MT uses it for elbows and knees - few takedowns, while san shou primarily uses it for throws.