View Full Version : Is there more than one version of Northern Shaolin Long fist?

11-06-2000, 10:38 PM
Some schools claim that this style has no animal forms in it. Some claim that thre are some animal forms in the most advanced sets. Still others claim that the style gets heavily into the five animals. Some claim that Tan Tui is the most basic form of the style. Others claim that it is an advanced form. So which is the true version of the art?

11-06-2000, 11:04 PM
Northern Shaolin is like toothpaste, you have many brands with many different ingredients, but they are all still toothpaste.


Peace /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

11-06-2000, 11:45 PM
THanks, Illusionfist. But how do you know which onwe will work best for you?

11-07-2000, 12:07 AM
There are as many "versions" of Northern Shaolin longfist as there are Northern Shaolin longfist students.

That's because they're supposed to be making their own adjustments to the form and inventing their own uses for the moves.

Besides, no two people are alike.

11-07-2000, 06:34 AM
Are you confused about Northern Shaolin Style or the system? Most schools are really part of the larger Shaolin system. They share a common root and can can be said that they are really cousin styles. In general, for example, Praying Mantis can be called cousin style of Northern Shaolin because many, but not all, of their techniques were taken from some Norhern shaolin styles. Then there are the schools that contain the flavor or the essense of the Shaolin method. These schools can be traced in some form or fashion directly back to the Shaolin temple. They may or may not be the original forms or sets but they do contain the flavor of the Northern styles taught in the Shaolin temple. Still others can call themselves Northern Shaolin because they are able to somehow establish very strong proof (?) or supporting facts that their sets were actually taught in the temple.

But the main point is that they all share similar techniques in their applications and in their form. Some technques may expressed differently but the theory in applications is the same. Experience Martial artists can see similarities in different northern shaolin styles and when they trace their historical background, there is, in most cases, a common link.

Animals are expressed in all Shaolin sets. Some styles express the animals more than others while others will specialize in one or two animals. In either case, if the sets contain the shaolin flavor then it belongs to the Shaolin system.

In the case of the style of Tam Tui, this style is a northern style that was taught in the shaolin temple and is regarded as a separate style that can stand by itself. What this means is that in the past, many martial artist had the opportunity to learn only this single set and were able to apply its techinques effectively in combat. Since the end of the 1800's many Northern Shaoloin schools teach Tam Tui as a prerequisite to their style because it teaches a beginner good basics such as movement between horse stances while learning some basic hand and leg techniques. One Northern Style, Ch'a Style, started this teaching practice in the early 1800's by using other northern style's sets for teaching the basics before teaching their style. This method of teaching actually help perserve many older styles that were not as popular during their times, and thus prevented them from fading away. Tam Tui was one of these styles that was use as such. In the public eye, Tam Tui disappeared at the late 1700's but the style managed to survive in the remote areas of Northerneastern part of China. Tam Tui did not re-surface until Ching Wu Physical Associations invited some Chinese Muslins to teach their martial arts (Ch'a Style) at their schools in the early 1915's. One of the styles that they taught was Tam Tui. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Ben Gash
11-07-2000, 02:20 PM
Umm, Northern Shaolin, Tan Tui is a part of Zhaquan/Cha Chuan. It was created by Zha Shang Ma /Cha Shang Mir as a basic training programme for Zhaquan/Cha Chuan in the 16th century. Originally there are said to have been 28 tan tui , but they were later rationalised into 10. Tan Tui was never taught at the temple prior to it's "revitalisation" in the 1980s. It is taught in the Ku yuo Cheong lineage of northern shaolin, as he learned it from his uncle, and another Zhaquan master. It is also found in the repetoire of schools that come from the Nanjing Central Institute and the Chin Woo association. It is included in the modern shaolin syllabus in the same way that Si Lu Zhaquan, San Lu Paoquan and Xingyi are included.
At some stage some people did start developing Tan Tui as a specialty, and it has also subsequently been incorporated into styles such as Wah Lum Mantis.

"Weapons are the embodiments of fear,
the wise use them only when they have no choice"
Lao Tzu

11-07-2000, 04:54 PM
From its origins, Tan Tui actually has little connection to Shaolin.

The original Zha quan version develoed by the Moslem Hui minority in China has 10 lines. There are some variations depending upon who you learn from. For example, one branch advocates all the kicks being below the waist. The branch from Wang Ziping advocates more middle level kicking but stresses that you should practice the techniques with low, middle, and high kicks as well as with modifying the punches for the three levels and three types of punches. This gives a large number of varieties from a single source.

There is another branch that emphasizes all kicks being high to train fast kicking from the beginning.

The 10 line Tan Tui migrated to other parts of China and other ethnic groups. In particular, the Tam Tui version where the character for Spring was modified and associated with a location gave rise to the 12 line version. although proponents of this version often claim to be the original, most sources indicate that the 12 line is based upon the 10 line and the connection was denied out of Han maority pride and the Han not wanting to acknowledge the contribution of the Hui people. Of course, some sources deny this... Given that 90% of the Chinese population is Han and that history and truth are often written by the majority, the Hui root of the 12 line is highly likely.