QingDao Guo-Shu Guan Curriculum ?

[buddhapalm]

Does anyone know (or have access to resources regarding) the curriculum of the QingDao GuoShu Guan during its peak, during the Nationalist period of China ?

Listings of Styles taught
Listings of Forms taught
Listings of Teachers enlisted

I am sure there is something recorded about this in Taiwan (wink wink TainanMantis ;-)


Also it would be most interesting, insightful and helpful if we can dig up the pre-1950 curriculum of all Central Guo Shu Guan's in Nanjing, Canton etc as well as of all Chin Woo Associations.

It would be most interesting to know what exactly was taught in these academies. With breakdowns per location.

If anyone has any listings of these, please let me know.

Many of these organisations have had a profound effect on most of our respective systems.

Many of the old dragons are leaving us (as r. said), we must ask whichever survivors of this great martial period are left, as to the history of their hey-days. Legends, curriculum, lineages etc.

I never asked my Sifu anything about history. Ten years after he passed away I regret it.

Skill, Culture and History, isn't this the essence ?

Warmest Regards

Buddhapalm

[buddhapalm]

I have an older book printed in Taiwan related to Six Harmony Pole. It states that it comes from Qing Dao Guo Shu Quan and lists other forms in the book.

The list is in Chinese and I cannot read much of it. But it lists a few forms with Six Harmony in the name. Not Six Harmony Mantis.

Does anyone know anything about the branch of Six Harmony Kung Fu that was practiced in the Qing Dao Guo Shu Quan in Shandong ?

Cheers

Buddhapalm

[NorthernShaolin]

Buddhapalm,

I'm only guessing but during this time the most popular master of Six Harmony Fist or otherwise known as Six Combination Fist was Wan Li Sheng who was one of the Five Tigers who went South.

What is interesting known fact is that he did not like to teach but was appointed by the government as one of the leading Chairpersons to guide the other four Tigers on what curriculum to teach at their induvidual assigned schools.

Now exactly what curriculum was taught at the various Kuo Shu (National Arts) schools depended on what loaction the assignments of the masters. What they did was that they copied what the Jing Mo schools did to their schools. Establish a standard basic curriculum which consist of sets that taught large groups of people quickly and contained easy applications. Later if the student was still around to learn more, the headmaster would assigned the masters at his particular school teach their speciality.

One of the major requirements that went beyond the Jing Mo schools' vision was that every master who taught in the National Arts school must document their arts in books and distribute their knowledge throughout the different National Arts schools. As a result, many books were written by these masters.

However, unfortunately the invasion (Pre-WW II) came.

Tracing the history of these National Arts school may be difficult since the invasion of the Japanese army had standing orders to seek, destroy and kill anything related to the National Arts school. Many of the schools closed and what was left were later burned by the Japanese.

Whatever knowledge, books, or masters who survived the invasion, escaped to Taiwan. When PRC took over China, whatever few books remaining, may have been burned by them. Remember, they performed a house to house search, looking for specific martial art manuals which in their eyes represented the old China's past, and had them all burned in a huge flame. :(

(Perhaps the only records that may be in China is the library where a few martial art manuals have been saved as you mention to me last year. But this is really very doubtful that they exist there.) :(

[Tainan Mantis]

buddhapalm,
To my knowledge there is no record of what was taught at the Guo Shu Guan.
It may exist, but where I don't know.
Some of the graduates became teachers at Taiwan's cultural Uni where many majored in MA.
They tyried to base it on the old Guo Shu Guan of China.
One thing I noticed is that not all of the curriculum is standard.
It probably was that way in China.

I have heard of forms that originate there, several that I know, but I don't think that helps much.

[buddhapalm]

Thanks NorthernShaolin,
I purchased last year a few books from e-bay. They were books from Taiwan and appeared to be curriculum from the Nationalist Guo Shu Association. At least some of the title was translated to me as curriculum of the Taiwan Guo Shu Association. I dont know if the two schools are related. I forgot the names of the forms in the books, but one book I have is called Six Harmony Pole. This pole is a double ended eyebrow height pole.

The beginning translates as a two-ended stick method coming from Sifu's (in Cantonese dialect) Mo Jui Lum and Go Do San from QingDao National Guo Shu Guan. It mentioned that the pole methods emphasize the style of Northern Shaolin. It then goes into details of the Six Harmony theory...and that was when my translators patience was wearing thin..it was time for him to clock out of work. But he summarized the hands co-ordinate with eyes etc.

Anyway, my interest lies in the fact that this pole set is like a sister set to my Eight Gate Pole. Same opening style, same type of movements in the form. All in all it seems to come from the same system. Thus my interest in it and its help in pointing to where the root of my set lies.

I think if we can find the exact curriculum of the Guo Shu and Jing Mo Guan's, then a lot of lineage questions can be resolved for many people in the modern martial art world.

Perhaps Tainan Mantis has connections in taiwan to trace the old curriculums of the Nationalist Guo Shu Guans ?

Cheers

Buddhapalm

[buddhapalm]

Tainan Mantis,
You replied to my question as I was writing it :-))))

Was your Six Harmony Pole forms from the curriculum of Guo Shu Guan ?

Where is the Taiwan's cultural University ?

Do you know which teachers taught there ?

There has to be some kind of record somewhere in Taiwan. I wonder where it could be.

Remember that link to Kung Fu Loung (Prof Jou) I had sent. He stated his teacher came from QingDao. Do you know much more about him, or at least his Six Harmony, Mizong and Shaolin curriculum ? His site lists many forms of Six Harmony, Mizong and Shaolin.

Cheers

Buddhapalm

[Tainan Mantis]

Buddhapalm,
I don't know if my 6 Harmony pole was taught at Guo Shu Guan.
I do know that my Pan Long Pole was taught at Ching Dao Guo Shu Guan. It is the same method of fighting.

The Cultural Uni is in Taipei.
My Shrfu taught there for some years as well as his kung fu brother.
Other names I am not sure of.

I'll get back to you on Prof Jou.
I believe the Shrfu he names is Wang Songting(My Shrye's Shrfu), but I want to make certain.

[Tainan Mantis]

I forgot to mention that I do have more info on the Guo Shu curriculum of old China.
In 1930 the book Guidelines for Skillful Attacking was published.
It was written by Hsue Gongchu.

At the end of the book are 11 manuscripts of very well known forms as well as something about the masters who taught these forms.
Sad to say that 11 forms is an incomplete list, but it is a start.

Mantis108 has just made a translation of the mantis section on his forum.

[buddhapalm]

Thank you Tainan Mantis,
I will look for the translations at Mantis 108's site. I have not been there lately since my computer died. A few months now.

I look forward to your thoughts on Sifu Jou, his curriculum and his Sifu Wang Songting. I would really like to know how much his curriculum reflects the QingDao Guo Shu Guans syllabus.

I have seen your Six Harmony Pole, but have I seen your Pan Long Pole ?

Cheers

Buddhapalm

[buddhapalm]

Hi Tainan Mantis,
I could not find anything on Mantis108's forum related to the translation of Hsue Gongchu's book. Can you point me to the section its in ? Thanks.

Cheers

Buddhapalm

[r.(shaolin)]

Tainan Mantis are talking about
Pan Long Gun

[Tainan Mantis]

R,
This is the set I am talking about.
My shrfu Shr Zhengzhong learned this set from more than one one master I believe.
But we do the version from Wang Juezhen of Tien Shan Pai.
It is very well known and popular in Taiwan.
Also part of the curriculum of the Cultaral University Martial Arts department.

I know this must be from Shaolin as it is similar to my 6 Harmony pole.
It is the same method of fighting.

6H pole is one of the few weapons forms that follows the meaning of six harmony as set out in Ming dynasty manuscripts on spear fighting.
That includes from Shaolin temple as well as General Chi Jiguang.
That is to say it has six segments of two man forms.

This stick form, 6H, was taught in Taiwan by Wu Shaolin(different characters from the temple name).