Bagua

[hairywhiteguy]

I study Gao bagua from Allen Pittman and enjoy it a great deal.
I just wanted to ask who any of you guys would recommend to study any style of bagua with? Location doesn't matter.:D

[count]

What do you mean, "location doesn't matter"? And who would I be recommending this teacher to? Questions make a difference.;) For you I might recommend a couple of teachers hear in LA. Su Dong Cheng or maybe Tim Cartmell. Especially since they learned from your avitar. ;)

[Skummer]

Hairy,

I live in Atlanta myself and was curious about the bagua training methods of your school. That is, do you guys do a type of push hands? Free sparring? Isolation sparring? Full contact? Jing training?

I'm a student at the altanta judo academy myself, but I have a keen interest in bagua and tai chi.

[hairywhiteguy]

count-What do you mean, "location doesn't matter"? And who would I be recommending this teacher to? Questions make a difference.

Location, I don't care where this teacher resides.
Me, studied with 'meltdawn' in florida for a year and a half, now in ATL with Allen running in circles.:p
Anything else you wanna know?
O, and the reason I ask, well, really I'm looking for other interpertations of Bagua, I've seen some interesting video and such online, ect, ect so...since I'm not tied down w/ "life" I though I'd try and travel a bit

count, are you offended by my question?

Skummer- We do a lot of two man application, meaning we work through the form slow and fast learning each detail with various body types, learning all the differences in aproach. Class is a restricted period of time, each student has his own rutine out of class, each student also has different goals. Some to inherit the system and teach, some for health, some to fight, ect....

[count]

Not offended, just confused. A little clarification makes a big difference. A detail like "interperations" tells me you may be interested in a different style of bagua. A detail like "you" tells me something about previous experience. Even though I doubt you'll find the same "interpretation" from any two even if they did have the same teacher. Maybe you were interested in a Yin style teacher or Cheng or something else. Do you speak Chinese? Maybe you want to get closer to the source. Care to travel to Hebei, Beijing, Taipai? Distance may become a factor. I know some great bagua teachers who charge 100 dollars per hour and only take private students. Is cost a factor? Do you like big cities or small towns? New York perhaps? Maybe your into TCM and want someone qualified to teach both martial and health aspects of bagua? Do you want to fight? Competitions? Live in a dangerous part of the world? Personally I have only done workshops with several of the teachers I am thinking of in this post alone. Should I still recommend them to you? Or teachers I have spent more than say one year with or ten? Or maybe this is a troll question to see if people with fight over lineage or who has the goods? How should I answer your question? I was wrong the first time. Or was I?

[hairywhiteguy]

hate to be rude, but...you over analize. You are filled with great intentions but this was my origional post with slite modifactions...


"I just wanted to ask who any of you guys would recommend to study ANY STYLE of BAGUA (not gao bagua) with? Location doesn't matter"

Mr. Count I realize and apoligize for my not comunicating that nothing matters except....a good teacher. Free range, give me some one who if you had all the time/money in the world you would study bagua with...who would it be (I don't have all the money but what thats what work is for.

Please no flame war I am just a simple man looking under every rock and I thought it would be a good idea to bring our collective ideas together on what teachers, from any linage, country, whatever.

I apreciate your time, time is valuable, no hard feelings please.

thank you.

[count]

LMAO:D

Mr. Whiteguy, I apologize if my line of questioning was misunderstood. I would wholeheartedly concur with Mr. Dude's suggestions. Also, I would love to go to New York and spend some time with Mr. Taoist and his teacher Chen Xiao Ping who is teaching currently. Given unlimited funds I might also go to Hebei and Shandong in autumn 2004 for some hands on at the source. If I could spend a couple of years there I might stop in Taiwan and study from He Jing Han. You might be interested that Su Dong Cheng has begun teaching here in LA and can give you a unique interpretation of bagua from a vast experience level unmatched by many. If you are interested in spending time in Chicago, Wai Lun Choi is there. If I think of any others I can honestly recommend I'll let you know. Sorry for any misunderstanding.

Just,
count (not Mr. count, if you please)

PS, Mr. Dude, it is not Master Tsou's responsibility to teach me any manners I may have forgotten. But thanks anyway.

[hairywhiteguy]

Thanks guys. Thanks for the leads, I'll check around.

Wow, one misunderstanding and now my manners are being insulted, I wish computers carried more than words since speaking is made up far more. I appreciate all your suggustion and one or two may be taken up. I hope my online manners appear better next time.

Wujidude-I don't know who your insulting, me or him, but maybe you ought to toughen up a bit about this....it was a misunderstanding, thats it....he thought I could be a troll or a beginner looking for the local karate class, I'm not, so.... Re-read it before you insult my mom on how she raised me. Cause only mama teaches mannas'!

O, and another thing, I'm still fairly new to posting and I have no idea what 'LMAO', means.


Skummer- did you have any other questions? Send me a email at orderofmasses@hotmail.com

I'll answer more questions that way..

[Walter Joyce]

LMAO = laughing my a$$ off

[hairywhiteguy]

OOOOO! thats cool! LMAO!!!

thanks again.

[EternalSpring]

Hey everyone,

Long story short, I've been looking into learning bagua sometime in the future but it's something I def want to research thoroughly before I make any decisions on where to learn. My primary arts are Ving Tsun and Tai Chi and I'll still be training them but my sifu always encouraged learning new things to strengthen what I already know. With that said, I'll go into the things i was really curious about. For the record, some of the things I say in regards to Bagua may not be true, if so, please feel free to correct me, I'd def appreciate it.

I've been told that Bagua originally didn't have as many forms as it does now and that like in many arts, other forms evolved to hone specifics skills or after incorporating newer knowledge. One person even went as far as saying that there really is only one form in bagua. To any Bagua practitioners here, what would you say is the most "minimalistic" set of Bagua forms, and if you feel really nice, techniques/drills that are not within the forms (because i know not everything is always in form alone).

If that question is weird or not many can answer that one, what is the first form which is learned in Bagua?

hopefully someone can help me out on this, thanks in advance everyone!

[Yoshiyahu]

Interesting...I have dabbled with Bagua a little...But not seriously...just tried eight palms a few times with my sifu...but i stick to Wing Chun he taught me and tai chi. But its definitiely interesting....


By question is what you got interested in learning Baquazhang?



Hey everyone,

Long story short, I've been looking into learning bagua sometime in the future but it's something I def want to research thoroughly before I make any decisions on where to learn. My primary arts are Ving Tsun and Tai Chi and I'll still be training them but my sifu always encouraged learning new things to strengthen what I already know. With that said, I'll go into the things i was really curious about. For the record, some of the things I say in regards to Bagua may not be true, if so, please feel free to correct me, I'd def appreciate it.

I've been told that Bagua originally didn't have as many forms as it does now and that like in many arts, other forms evolved to hone specifics skills or after incorporating newer knowledge. One person even went as far as saying that there really is only one form in bagua. To any Bagua practitioners here, what would you say is the most "minimalistic" set of Bagua forms, and if you feel really nice, techniques/drills that are not within the forms (because i know not everything is always in form alone).

If that question is weird or not many can answer that one, what is the first form which is learned in Bagua?

hopefully someone can help me out on this, thanks in advance everyone!

[EternalSpring]

Interesting...I have dabbled with Bagua a little...But not seriously...just tried eight palms a few times with my sifu...but i stick to Wing Chun he taught me and tai chi. But its definitiely interesting....


By question is what you got interested in learning Baquazhang?

I guess it's based on my personal experiences. My Sifu taught me that while we may train many styles (or whatever you want to call them), it all goes back into our primary art. Ving Tsun and Tai Chi are the main arts I've learned from my Sifu and those were the main arts he learned from my sigong. Recently I saw videos of my sifu with my sigong and si suk gong in China and watching my Si Suk Gong demonstrating his Ving Tsun to his "kung fu nephews and nieces" was incredible. From what I understand, while my Sigong chose to focus most on Ving Tsun and Tai Chi, my Si Suk Gong chose to focus on Ving Tsun and Bagua. The way his body positioning was coordinated with his sensitivity was different from what I'd normally seen and I thought it was really cool and it looked very effective. In the words of my own sisook, my si suk gong got past him as if he were made out of water.

I love Ving Tsun and Tai Chi, but I'm really interested in eventually training some bagua because it's movement seems so unique and powerful. Since I'm pretty much a nobody I guess it's safe to say my future hopes for my kung fu, but in regards to the things I add to my kung fu from my own experiences, I'd hope to have learn Bagua and Xingyi, but in regards to Xingyi I'm really just interested in understanding the stance and learning the 5 element fist and training that consistently lol. I feel like there's a lot more to say about this but hopefully this makes it a bit clearer without making me sound like a greedy ******* lol

[Yoshiyahu]

If you dont mind me asking how old r u?


I personally think Bagua is harder than XingYi...But that may because XingYi is closer to Wing Chun than Bagua is....If you decide to learn Bagua do it first...Then come back to xingyiquan.


Focus on one at a time so you wont mix the two with out know what is separate....I will say Bagua is a good technique against a defensive fighter. It will make him a sitting duck waiting to get hit. But someone who is extremely aggressive watch out! Bagua will leave you vunerable!




I guess it's based on my personal experiences. My Sifu taught me that while we may train many styles (or whatever you want to call them), it all goes back into our primary art. Ving Tsun and Tai Chi are the main arts I've learned from my Sifu and those were the main arts he learned from my sigong. Recently I saw videos of my sifu with my sigong and si suk gong in China and watching my Si Suk Gong demonstrating his Ving Tsun to his "kung fu nephews and nieces" was incredible. From what I understand, while my Sigong chose to focus most on Ving Tsun and Tai Chi, my Si Suk Gong chose to focus on Ving Tsun and Bagua. The way his body positioning was coordinated with his sensitivity was different from what I'd normally seen and I thought it was really cool and it looked very effective. In the words of my own sisook, my si suk gong got past him as if he were made out of water.

I love Ving Tsun and Tai Chi, but I'm really interested in eventually training some bagua because it's movement seems so unique and powerful. Since I'm pretty much a nobody I guess it's safe to say my future hopes for my kung fu, but in regards to the things I add to my kung fu from my own experiences, I'd hope to have learn Bagua and Xingyi, but in regards to Xingyi I'm really just interested in understanding the stance and learning the 5 element fist and training that consistently lol. I feel like there's a lot more to say about this but hopefully this makes it a bit clearer without making me sound like a greedy ******* lol

[EternalSpring]

If you dont mind me asking how old r u?


I personally think Bagua is harder than XingYi...But that may because XingYi is closer to Wing Chun than Bagua is....If you decide to learn Bagua do it first...Then come back to xingyiquan.


Focus on one at a time so you wont mix the two with out know what is separate....I will say Bagua is a good technique against a defensive fighter. It will make him a sitting duck waiting to get hit. But someone who is extremely aggressive watch out! Bagua will leave you vunerable!

dont mind at all, I'm 25

I dont know from experience which one is harder but I do know that out of the people I've seen that teach the big three of Xingyi, Bagua, and Tai Chi, they always recommend starting w/ Xingyi.

[Yoshiyahu]

dont mind at all, I'm 25

I dont know from experience which one is harder but I do know that out of the people I've seen that teach the big three of Xingyi, Bagua, and Tai Chi, they always recommend starting w/ Xingyi.

ooh 25 well you got enough time to learn both...if you like Bagua more learn it first...if your half way through xingyi curriculum pick up Bagua later...I know a guy at age fifty who started doing Bagua...internal styles are great for learning later on in life...i was wondering how old you were because if your already forty i dont see much point in trying to learn both...lol...

[EternalSpring]

ooh 25 well you got enough time to learn both...if you like Bagua more learn it first...if your half way through xingyi curriculum pick up Bagua later...I know a guy at age fifty who started doing Bagua...internal styles are great for learning later on in life...i was wondering how old you were because if your already forty i dont see much point in trying to learn both...lol...

Tbh, the real reason i want to learn some Xingyi is because of the incredible resemblance it bears to the Ving Tsun i was taught. I often hear people say that the similarities are just in superficial appearance, but a lot of what I hear in terms of "technique description" from the same Xingyi practitioners online leads me to believe otherwise. Not to say that Xingyi isn't an amazing style on it's own, but this is why I really just want to learn the San Ti Shi and 5 element fist and just work on that.

In regards to bagua, that is a system I'm interested in as a whole, at least in terms of empty hand combat. That's why I'm trying to do as much research as possible about the curriculum. So far I dont know where Bagua practitioners start (besides circle walking) in their training and what the different phases are, and it's something i'd really like to know because looking for a bagua teacher means looking for a person who can teach it, and that means looking for a teacher who's not a "hustler." Sorry if my precautions seem idiotic, i may perhaps be too paranoid lol, but I've seen what happens with some teachers and Ving Tsun, so I can't help but be a bit cautious. I feel like the questions I'm asking make it seem like I'm in a hurry to learn, but I dont mind however long it takes as long as I'm not being hustled lol. I'm hoping some people here understand my concern, because if not, I probably sound stupid lol.

[windwalker]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TL9Z5Q_CAo

Met Adam Hsu, long ago when he was teaching out in golden gate park, an area called the pan handle.
He mentions that "everyone should have their own bagua zhang" found this quite interesting as
my teacher in teaching me taiji said the same thing...