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northstar
06-18-2001, 04:16 PM
I've got a couple of questions for any BSL practitioner here:
- The eight form is baat bou? Does the baat mean eight? I've seen it as eight and as shuffling.
- The 10th form of sik faat, is sik the same sik that means style?

GeneChing
06-18-2001, 06:45 PM
When Chinese characters are converted to the roman alphabet there is a huge margin of error. Here's a few reasons why:
1st - no tones - the tones change everything 'chi ji ba' (eat chicken) with a slightly different tone sounds like 'eat *****' - so be veeeryy careful.
2nd - one word, even with the same tone, can have several meanings. Tuo (rising tone) can mean camel or ostrich, depending on a minor variation of a few strokes in the character.
2nd - most people do not use a standard system of romanization like pinyin, especially with Cantonese so all the styles the came through Canton/HK like bak sil lum - well, it's all fair game.

At our school, we agreed on Bot Bo & Sik Fot as the spellings based upon no system at all. It was just spelled as it sounded. Converted to Mandarin pinyin, they are properly written Ba Bu and Shi Fa, but since these terms are usually expressed in Cantonese not Mandarin, this 'proper' spelling has little meaning. The Cantonese baat for eight is different. I'm not sure what the sik for style is (I'd have to see the character or hear in in a context which indicated the character) but I doubt it is the same.

The bottom line is you absolutely have to learn to use the characters if you want to get any serious research done in CMA. This doesn't mean you need to know the language (although that helps) it just means you have to know how to count the strokes and how to use a Chinese dictionary. It's really not that hard and very educational.

Gene Ching
Asst. Publisher
Kungfu Qigong Magazine & www.KUNGFUmagazine.com (http://www.KUNGFUmagazine.com)

Shaolindynasty
06-19-2001, 06:10 AM
Hey Gene I watched the Wing Lam Kungfu video Tan Tui great stuff! If I go to a wing lam school is it possible to learn only the Tan Tui set? Or would I need to learn other things from BSL first? The reason I am asking is that there are no Wing Lam schools in Illinois and I would have to travel at least to Ohio to learn it. I was thinking of bringing some of my students and Kungfu brothers with me for like maybe a week to learn it, is this possible? (I would learn it from the video but I don't really like to do that it is hard for me also I like to have an instructor to tell me what I am doing wrong)

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northstar
06-19-2001, 05:53 PM
GeneChing, I know! I study Chinese in my spare time. But is it the "bot" meaning eight?

beiquan
06-19-2001, 10:18 PM
no, it does not mean eight. it is this "ba" (ignore the definition, it's not really applicable in the sense that it's used in the form name):

http://www.zhongwen.com/d/169/d222.gif

and the "sik" or "shi" (mandarin pronunciation) that you're thinking of can mean "style":

http://www.zhongwen.com/d/166/d161.gif

GeneChing
06-19-2001, 10:31 PM
beiquan: Nice post- thanks! Are you getting that of a website and if so, which one?
shaolindynasty: You would really have to contact the Ohio school to find out more - I have no idea what they do there. At WLE headquarters in Sunnyvale, privates can always be arranged on any material.

Gene Ching
Asst. Publisher
Kungfu Qigong Magazine & www.KUNGFUmagazine.com (http://www.KUNGFUmagazine.com)

beiquan
06-19-2001, 10:46 PM
:) thanks, i stole the images off of www.zhongwen.com (http://www.zhongwen.com)

Shaolindynasty
06-19-2001, 11:00 PM
I was just askin cause I figured all wing lam schools probally teach the same way. Actually I was planning to go to the school in Sunnyvale but if we can not afford that we would go to Ohio. Thanks for the info.

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GeneChing
06-20-2001, 07:15 PM
Sifu Lam's curriculum is not really standardized across his satellite schools. It's not even standardized within Lam Kwoon in Sunnyvale. Unlike the Mckwoons, our Big Macs taste different - each one is unique ;)

Gene Ching
Asst. Publisher
Kungfu Qigong Magazine & www.KUNGFUmagazine.com (http://www.KUNGFUmagazine.com)

Shaolindynasty
06-22-2001, 01:28 AM
Maybe I gave the wrong idea. I just meant that I figured that the schools taught pretty much the same ciriculm as far as the order the forms are taught in. I know in my school that the forms are taught in a specific order for a reason. I watched the intro to Wing Lam Kungfu and it said the same. I was just wondering if it was possible to learn it out of order I didn't mean you guys ran a Mckwoon school. Sorry if I offended you

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GeneChing
06-22-2001, 01:44 AM
No offense taken.

Wing Lam's satellite schools were the products of private lessons, neither David nor John experienced the progression like normal Lam Kwoon students.

At Lam Kwoon, our curriculam is pretty set for beginners for the first year or so, then it diverges according to individual difference. And for students already practicing, privates can come at any level, just put your money and time down.

I'll never forget when a student came in to learn 3-section staff and signed up for 2 1-hour privates. He never learned any staff so Sifu didn't want to teach him. But I did. We worked on every spin. I made him use a heavy hardwood staff until it was beaten into him that he overstepped his limitations. My Sifu laughed at first, but then gave the student a nerf 3-sect out of misplaced mercy. I knew I couldn't teach him 3-sect in 2 hours, but at least I could teach him respect, by self-inflicted rod no less. I still think it was the most compassionate thing to do. He never came back for that second lesson. Too bad, he had potential - untapped potential is a more common and heinous crime than depleted potential. At least that's my Friday afternoon perspective on it. :p

Gene Ching
Asst. Publisher
Kungfu Qigong Magazine & www.KUNGFUmagazine.com (http://www.KUNGFUmagazine.com)

Shaolindynasty
06-22-2001, 01:58 AM
Good job! I like the way you handled that situation. I also get a little annoyed by people wnting to learn advanced material that I worked so hard for on the first day. I guess thats why they are beginners. Anyway, do you think the Tan Tui form is not good to start at Lam Kwoon with? So of my students have been training in the martial arts for between 1-2 yrs. I am pleasd with their current skill level though I think they could handle it and I know alot of styles use this form for training. Since you have experience in BSL do you think it would be better to start them off woth something simpler.

Witness the Dynasty!!!
New Site! www.shaolindynasty.cjb.net (http://www.shaolindynasty.cjb.net)