Demo of internal vs external??

[Laughing Cow]

Hi All.

Was wondering how your laoshi or sifu demoes the difference between external styles and internal styles for students?

Does he have a certain move that he uses to show both sides or similar.

Cheers.

[jon]

lol my sifu likes to occasionaly sit in a low obviously tence horse stance and execute karate style hip punches while yelling loudly.
He does this obviously just to poke fun more than anything else.

Still by and large he has a lot of respect for the external styles.

[shaolinboxer]

He does not.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

Occasionally, during Iron Palm training, when we would break blocks.. he would hold up a piece of silk cloth and and tease us to "break this".. then, he would laugh and say "be the silk".. all the Iron Palm training would not affect a piece of suspended silk.. When you can "be the silk" AND break the block, "it will be time to harvest the rice" (your training will have matured).. Time then, to cook the rice/make a meal (work on Wude, how to use the training)..

I add at this point, that finally you eat the rice.. the Concepts of internal/external (training) are absorbed and become simply a part of "who you are".. no differentiation...

Be well...

[bodhitree]

My Sifu teaches both internal and external styles and always teaches that they can be used together. His Sifu really also believes in this integration, He says our TiJi stances need to be collision ready and sometimes to make sure we have proper postures does things like put all of his weight on the top of our head and jump, if our neck is in right alignment he bounces off. I think both are very important

[miscjinx]

A simple demo/illustration I have used many times is look around and find a cup, can of pop, or something and ask them to pick it up.

Every time I've done this so far, they pick it up externally. Basically, they used primarily local muscle - the arms - to pick up the can/cup/whatever.

Then I pick it up using my whole body in a relaxed and balanced fashion, it looks obviously different and they have a better idea of the difference between external and internal (or usually the question is what is internal).

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings...

Watch someone open a door.. most bend their back, reach for the knob/handle, then use their back and arm muscles to pull it.. a few will step up to the door, grasp the handle/knob, then step back utilizing their whole bodyand not compromise their structure.. conversely, externally inclined people will lean into a push door situation and muscle it open.. internally inclined people will maintain posture and let their legs do the work and their arms act as shock absorbers.. Watch someone try to open a tight jar lid.. elbows up and out = external, elbows down and in = internal...

Just some observations, be well..

[Water Dragon]

This is easy. If we do it, it's internal. If you do it, it's external.

Bob. I don't think what you're describing is "internal". I think what you're describing is just the effect of good training.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

Perhaps you are correct.. these are just my own personal observations.. these observations are just inclinations that i have noticed in differing situations when both internal and external students were dealing with similar situations.. By no means am i suggesting that these represent "tests" for guaging ability or style.. just observations.. perhaps, differing perspectives of "efficiency" of those i have observed, unrelated to training.. Heck, i don't know.. i don't even understand half the stuff i do "know".....

Be well....

[Water Dragon]

Don't get me wrong, I agree 100 % with your observations. But I've seen the same type of thing out of Long Fist, Shuai Chiao, S. Mantis, and I'm sure people in other arts display the same. It's actually one of the things I look for when checking out different schools.

[Laughing Cow]

My Sifu uses the following method.

BTW, he is a very "hands-on" guy for demoes.

Student 1 stands in "Warriors Attenant pounds the Mortar" or a similar pose.
Student 2 grabs the forearms of the student 1.

Now student 1 has to escape from the hold by simply moving his arms as in the transition to "Hold and touch the clothes" or similar.

If you are tense and try to muscle your way out of it = external.

If you relax your arms, sink down and move with intent = internal (and the escape should be easier)

Cheers.

[Shuul Vis]

I just do the obvious thing and shoot lightning from my mouth at them. you guys are all too complicated.