the differences between weight lifting and resistance training

[ryuujin]

I see a lot of people get upset because someone tells them they cant lift weights and still be fluid. This is true because in weight lifting you are in a locked position with a confined range of motion. This does not exclude all resistance training though. For dozens of generations martial artist have been using weighted clothing and the such. Just and addition to their own body weight in areas.
so incase some people were wondering it is possible to do some resistance or added weight training but not text book weight lifting

[IronFist]

Welcome to KFO. These questions are generally better asked in the Training Forum.

But since you want an answer:

I see a lot of people get upset because someone tells them they cant lift weights and still be fluid.

Whoever says you can't still be fluid is wrong.

This is true because in weight lifting you are in a locked position with a confined range of motion.

It's not true. If you're lifting weights properly, you are working through an entire range of motion, so you're not confined to anything. For example, if you're doing barbell squats, you are supposed to go all the way down (although most people don't). If you go all the way down, and all the way back up, you're working your quads through their entire range of motion and it's not "confining" anything. In otherwords, there is no possible range of motion that you could put your quads in that was not being worked in that exercise.

If you want to talk about "locked positions," go yell at the kung fu guys who sit in a horse stance for 30 minutes a day. :D

This does not exclude all resistance training though.

Weight is weight. Your body doesn't know the difference between a 5lb shirt and a 5lb dumbell.

For dozens of generations martial artist have been using weighted clothing and the such. Just and addition to their own body weight in areas.

Think about that for a second. If you throw a punch with a weighted shirt on, all you're doing is adding more weight for gravity to pull down. You're not punching against resistance, you're just making your arm heavier and more work for your shoulder to hold up.

so incase some people were wondering it is possible to do some resistance or added weight training but not text book weight lifting

There's nothing wrong with adding weight training to martial arts.

The fact that weight lifting hinders martial arts is a myth.

IronFist

[ryuujin]

Ive just been adhearing to the old method and little movement is good no movement is better when dealing with weight. As for actually weight lifting I was state recognized as a powerlifter through highschool. Yes deadlifting will make your physically stronger then weighted shirts, but its working slow twitch muscles, while having the shirt on you are going through the normal patterns of movement, this trains your muscle to move faster not just with pulling more.

[Suntzu]

*raises hand* I'll admit it with weight on my shoulders… I cant go all the way down… I can with BW tho… I'm still workin on it tho…

[Daredevil]

If you want to talk about "locked positions," go yell at the kung fu guys who sit in a horse stance for 30 minutes a day. :D



Though it was said with jest, I feel like I have to comment. Standing in horse stance for 30 minutes is not primarily done for the same reason as weight training. It is not for building muscle (except perhaps secondarily, to reach a level of muscular development facilitating the act of stance training).

Otherwise I'm definately not disagreeing and think people who want strongly muscled legs should squat instead of sit in their horse stances. Or at least do both. :)

[Former castleva]

High intensity resistance training=Weightlifting.
Known to have been practiced by ancient Greeks.

These days people do NOT have to beat trees and toss stones around.
Let´s turn it this way,weight training is highly recommended for development.

It does not occur to me directly how this myth has evolved,but let´s just say that if the ancient master you (general "you") admire so much happened to be a good martial artist and additionally small,on a bad diet consisting of rice and fish,it does not necessarily mean that you (general "you") is meant to follow this path to the extreme.
Where cigars are sometimes just cigars,benefits are just great benefits.

[Robinf]

Aha, functional weight training--training through the full range of motion using motions in daily (or kung fu use).

This weight training is weight training. You do moves similar to those you would do in your kung fu.

A squat is going into and coming out of a horse stance. Try holding that horse stance with the weight on your shoulders. Squat also works the muscles responsible for some kicks.

Chest fly is the motion to inside blocks and strikes. Reverse (or delt) fly is the motion to outside blocks and strikes. Bench press works some muscles responsible for forward strikes. Etc.

Each motion in "traditional" weight training is part of any kung fu movement. Gee, you think the human body only makes certain moves?

So, how can you not be fluid because you're weight trainging? I'm sure we've all seen the guys who are over built and can't raise their arms up to their heads. That would be from improper weight training--not weight training itself.

[IronFist]

Originally posted by Daredevil


Though it was said with jest, I feel like I have to comment. Standing in horse stance for 30 minutes is not primarily done for the same reason as weight training. It is not for building muscle (except perhaps secondarily, to reach a level of muscular development facilitating the act of stance training).



What's it for, then?

IronFist

[IronFist]

bump

IronFist

[Robinf]

Endurance--particularly in a horse stance.

[fa_jing]

Endurance, power from a horse stance.

Strengthen and stretch tendons and ligaments.

Warmup muscles

improve standing structure, make more automatic

Put into your brain the instinct to sink somewhat during fighting.

[fa_jing]

Actually, just think of the horse stance as a 1-rep squat. Then you'll want to practice it for power.

:D

[Stryder]

What about doing forms or techniques with iron rings on? We do this occasionally in class and it forces you into better stances and proper placement of hands.