politics ruining GongFu

[ShaolinWood]

I would like to see the politics in the Gongfu schools come to an end, in South Africa we can't have a national tournament because of some bad people in charge of the fediration(no names will be given but it doesn't matter). Now the martial Arts Authority has a bad view of Chinese MA in SA and it's bad news for all of us.

Most people here think CMA are total crap and don't even want make an effort.
Why can't we all just get along and help each other benefit to be able to grow in our training?

Hope this will change!
Have a great day

[Liokault]

You have made a post that just looks bitter but does not give any real info.......would you care to expand on what you have said?

[MasterKiller]

He is probably talking about Sifu Jurgens, a disciple of Shi Yan Ming, who supposedly created an organization in South Africa, held a tournament in which he hand-picked the fighters, which he beat, then declared himseld world champion of the World Knockdown Title, or something like that.

At least, that's the what some are saying. I don't know anything else about it.

[Suntzu]

Yep… pile-of-tricks suck… fu(ks up everyones good time… all the bickering… favoritism… (sorry in advance) but can't we all just get along so we can just beat each other up in peace and harmony…

[ShaolinWood]

What I mean is, its sad how the groups of schools kind of mend together, if "this school" is coming "were" not taking part...

Has anyone been to a Tournament in SA? The last allright one was in 2001(I think- at NASREC) and that was a friendly.

When are we going to see something as big as the Karate tournaments?

[norther practitioner]

When are we going to see something as big as the Karate tournaments?

I don't know the popularity of cma down there, but I'd guess never.

The situation is only midly better here in the US, especially if you are a national level competitor (going for the US team). You almost have to take sides at times.

[GLW]

Actually, there has been a problem with politics in South Africa for a good while.

Even back in the late 1980s, there were a couple of groups vying for control.

There was then one group...they actually fielded a team to come to the US for a couple of competitions...the Team members were great folks...my wife and I are actually still in touch via mail with a couple of them....but the heads of the team....another story.

They made a big deal of having black members on their team...but the team leads still treated those members poorly. This WAS before the government change....

But, I KNOW what you mean about the politics...and the only thing that cures politics is for people to get involved and work to stop it...and that means that you have to actually deal with those that are causing the problem.

[Budokan]

Is there any martial art that hasn't been ruined by politics at one time or another...?

[Liokault]

I heard of an ugly split in the Tai Bo world.

[ShaolinWood]

yup, The team that went to USA, I know some of those, they were robbed of money and stuck in a cheap hotel, the money intended for them and their accomodation went to the pockets of the organisers...

But i agree, we have to face them, and start a clean slate. Its just going to take some time and effort to convince the critical that were not so bad!

I'm not bitter about anything, I just want the world to know about the state of the organisation here, maybe the right person will hear about it and may be able to do something...

Thanx all for joining in!
have a great day!

[ZIM]

Wushu in the Olympics!!!

heh. Any takers? Seriously, I wonder what sort of effect having wushu as an olympic sport would have on its acceptance in places like SA?
Most people here think CMA are total crap and don't even want make an effort.

[ShaolinWood]

yup, in SA that's all it's about, if the sport can bring some exposure to our little spot in Dark Africa. He he

Yes, the wushu division are quite popular,though the level of skill is not as high(I'm referring to international level)

Traditional styles suffer a bit, if it's not politics scattering everyone appart it's just bad organising and lack of interest.

I'm not a pesimist, rather a idealist... I want to see traditional styles featuring a bit, good quality gongfu!

There are quite some talent here, very good masters aswell, but getting to international tournaments is so expensive even unaffordable!

Maybe some attention will come with the Wheel of life show coming in September(I heard) I would love to see that!

[GLW]

Was that the events done by Jeff Bolt?

If they got put up a a cheap hotel that REALLY sucks.

I KNOW for a fact that Jeff had negotiated a very good room rate with the hotel / convention center where the event was held. They did NOT mind people sharing rooms...and I KNOW that there were some competitors that had 4 to a room...making it around $25 a night WITH tax...I think the room rate we got was $89 a night...and that is a VERY nice hotel GW Marriott or such...where the normal room rate is around $189 a night...and the competition was in the same hotel...they had a HUGE convention center.

So if the SA team was put in a crappy hotel, that was definitely the Team leader's doing.

About the only event I have been to where I thought the accomodations were bad was the ones done by Anthony Goh in Baltimore. I mean, why would I want to PAY to stay in a cheap college dorm room....and pay a VERY high price for that as well.... those rooms did not have any lighting, no lamps...impossible to read in the room. They had not amenities...the TV downstairs was broken. The bathroom was shared between two rooms and it was impossible to really lock your room when you left...talk about lack of security for your things...and NO safe deposit. The dorm WAS known for having theft problems.

I did that ONE year...the next year, I found my own hotel and paid about $7 - $10 a night more...and had TV, privacy, quiet, and air conditioning that WORKED.

[yenhoi]

What on earth do politics and such wishwash have to do with your training?

Unless you make the choice to get involved or let it bother your hands, I dont understand what other peoples garbage has to do with your skill...

:eek:

[carly]

Do you really think tournaments and what other (uninformed or deluded) people think of your kung fu matters or has any importance. Do kung fu for yourself, not for others or for recognition.

[ShaolinWood]

it doesn't interfere with my training, but it's not a good thing. One of the best ways to test your skill is to push against someone else, and tournaments are avery good place for this. If you only train with your Gongfu brothers and sisters you tend to get used to one another.

Then in that way it does influence my training, a little, but still yes.

Its just a little sad when you only have 2 tournaments a year and you end up pushing with your own class mates... And it would be nice to be part of a team and to go participate in another country, regardless if it "influence my training".

That's a valid point isn't it?

Enjoy!

[norther practitioner]

Politics suck when you'd like to do tournies and the like.....
That being said, it shouldn't have an effect on your training, and should hopefuly at some point be overlooked when looking at tournies to be entered into.

[carly]

you can always hook up with another school and spar with them, or with friends from other schools - you don't need a formal tournament to do so. The informal, friendly route actually builds more bridges.

[ShaolinWood]

No I totally agree, I don't really do tournaments, mostly done forms though, for fun.

It's still fun.

My argument isn't about its effect on ones skll though, it's about politics (bad politics) and that is not cool, and it can never be cool, even if it causes a cure for cancer(which it won't) it will still be uncool, sorta like mayonaise gone bad... wait, what was I saying... anyway, I just don't like hostile attitudes amongst people who should be like brothers to you because of all the people in society, Martial artists should relate best. And there is no need to create an uncomfortable environment for one another...

[carly]

Just socialize with reasonable, like-minded martial artists and ignore the annoying ones.

[ShaolinWood]

Thanx for the advise.
Enjoy!:D

[yenhoi]

Maybe you get this ****ty feeling about the whole bad politics randomness because politics have no place in your training............ which they dont...

:D

[GLW]

What CAN organizations do:

host competitions
promote the art to the general public
help preserve arts before they die
help offer things like training seminars
bring little known styles or masters to light
help with team events such as if Wushu were to make it to the Olympics
foster a comraderie among the people of the art.
get people to talk, compare, improve, share methods
attract talented people to the arts - that will be the next generation of talent
by exposing what is good, help to remove or reduce the number of frauds and charlatans in the arts.

This has all happened in the US to a great degree since the inception of things like the USCMAC, USCKF, USWU, and even the USAWKF...

What they can ALSO do is

put the art in a bad light
run good people off
cause people to pull in and be "me first"


This does NOT have anything to do with your personal training unless you wish to compete

However, it DOES have to do with expanding the sphere of influence of the arts and the people in them. It can look to the future and preserve...

Without such things...well, think about the amount of talented masters that knew a lot...and took it to the grave with them...not out of desire...but out of lack of finding someone to pass it on to...

And politics and lack of ethics screws it ALL up.

[ShaolinWood]

That's my point. And it isn't cool!
I'm not some bitter depressed Prozak eater, I just don't like people thinking CMA is so bad, cause it's not, I would like everyone to atleast try it once, just think how the level of the arts can improve once people get interested!

GLW knows what it's about, and training is the most important, but the future of the Art is the bigger picture.

Hope this will better, I'm sure it will, things are starting to turn here in SA, it's slow, but I have good feelings about the new president( Dean Jones) He seems like a really good person, and I know he knows his stuff (Wing Chun Shifu).

Thanx for listening(reading)

Enjoy!!

[Leimeng]

~ As long as you study hard and practice hard, then politics cant ruin your gung fu. Gung fu is an inside job.
~ Politics can ruin an open exchange of ideas though.

Peace

Sin Loi

Yi Beng, Kan Xue