"Western" MA

[Former castleva]

To put it briefly and save my time,I´d like to know of your experiences%preferences concerning western MA.
(The trend seems to go that about any MA that does not originate from Asia is at times considered Western :) you can take that into account)

[chen zhen]

very broad term..;)

[Former castleva]

You are allowed to post on Far-East European (or Danish) arts. :o

[chen zhen]

OK, there's "glima", which is supposed to be a "resurrected" nordic wrestling style, but in reality it's just judo without groundgrappling, and practised in very large leatherboots and belts:D

[chen zhen]

Ok, then there's Savate, a very good style, here's a website:
www.savateaustralia.com

[Former castleva]

I´m more than familiar with savate.


Never heard of that ...glima. :D

[bodhitree]

Western Boxing, a great sport for training instinct and hand controll, however nothing but hand striking. other than that don't know anything about WMA.

[chen zhen]

good for you, FC!;)
maybe I can find a glima link, hold on..

[bodhitree]

Bruce Lee liked Savate a great deal.

[Former castleva]

Never knew that Bodhi.

[chen zhen]

http://ejmas.com/jwma/articles/2000/jwmaart_kautz_0100.htm

[chen zhen]

I made a thread about BL's savate-connection (french-connection;)) on the JKD forum

[bodhitree]

FC

There is a large section in the Tao of Jeet Kune Do about Savate kicks (if you werent being sarcastic).

CZ
That was a very interesting link!

[Former castleva]

Glima seems to be sort of a national sport art,not bad.

Nope,was not being sarcastic. :)

Thank you both.

[chen zhen]

Not the glima one, I hope, BT!:D

the savate site is great, tonnes of articles, photo's, pics of it in action.. that site is very good.

[shaolin kungfu]

I did a little bit of boxing. Also spent about 4 or 5 months with sport fencing. Good stuff.:)

[chen zhen]

football is the national sport of Denmark (if not officially, then it oughta be!)
I don't know about Iceland, though. maybe Glima is practised there:p

[shaolin kungfu]

Western football or everyone else's football (aka soccer)?

[Former castleva]

Woo-hoo at my seeming woo-woo comment.
I did not mean that glima is the OFFICIAL :p sport but as far as martial ones go...

Along with hammer throw and women´s tennis,football should be the official sport of every country.

[Former castleva]

Is there Eastern football? Kidding.

Yes,we´re talking about soccer.

I just feel more comfortable saying "football" because what I´d call "American football" is virtually non-existent and not appreciated.

[chen zhen]

Americans always talk about "world-series in football"- but in reality it's just americans who play it.

And yes, football (soccer, to not confuse people:rolleyes: ) is everyone else's football:o

[shaolin kungfu]

Is there really a world series of football? I've never heard of it. Then again, I don't follow american football.

[Former castleva]

World cup is every fourth year.

[chen zhen]

What I mean is, that popular american sports are often called "world cups", but only american teams play it. but maybe that's more baseball.

FC, how is the finnish team going? never heard of it. Our team beat france:cool:

ok, enough with the football, let's go on-topic again

[Former castleva]

"FC, how is the finnish team going? never heard of it. "

They were just trying to get to EU cup.I do not know how it turned/turns out.

BTW,Has Denmark been to world cup?
We certainly have not. :(

For those interested in such a discussion,go to "brink of death". ;)

[chen zhen]

As I said, Denmark won over France last year:cool:

I don't know how they're doing now.

Maybe we should move the football discussion to the "brink of.." thread, we should not spoil this one

[Former castleva]

Yeah,you said.I just was not sure you meant that.

Let´s move it then,and pray that there´ll be followers.

[chen zhen]

OK, western MA it is again.. there's all the known grappling styles , like wrestling, (greco-roman, free, catch, etc.), BJJ; Sombo (is'nt it russian..?). And then there's JKD of course. that's what i can think of now.

[Former castleva]

There was a list on another forum back in the days,I might look it up for tomorrow.

[Former castleva]

List;
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2423

[chen zhen]

Not all of the countries listed could be called "western", and it was incomplete. there's more styles in france, America, etc.
but the african/middle-eastern ones was interesting to see. I'll look them up.:)

[Former castleva]

I did comment on geographical fallacy at "brink".

Certainly there are many more styles,including extinct ones.

[chen zhen]

Russia was not mentioned..!

[Former castleva]

Neither Finland.

Russia should have been an easy one,with infamous Systema´s and all.

[chen zhen]

Is'nt Sambo/Sombo russian?

[Former castleva]

It is.

[Christopher M]

There's a wide field of historical western bladed arts (http://www.martinez-destreza.com).

[chen zhen]

I heard once the Samurai could'nt defend against the portuguese invaders, because of difference in fencing style. The samurai was'nt used to straight, dotting swordstrokes

[Former castleva]

Some put it that samurai´s technique was unscientific,and also I think it´s been said that plenty of,errr Philippine etc. knife/weapon work originates from Spain.

[Christopher M]

Originally posted by Former castleva
I think it´s been said that plenty of,errr Philippine etc. knife/weapon work originates from Spain.

http://www.swordhistory.com/excerpts/eskrima.html

[Former castleva]

Thanks.

I was not quite patient enough to read the whole article,might get back to it a bit later.
Anyway,what I said derives from what I remember one particular blade expert to have said (referring to a modern combat applications source,can´t remember where)
Basically he said that,if I remember right,that Philippines etc. get a lot of respect for their stuff,when their western counterparts (and "ancestral" forms of some manner?) do not,that much.

[bodhitree]

There are also MA from Africa. I saw something on the discovery channel about it. They had competitive staff fights with all the men of the villages going against each other. looked like excellent tecnique, I'd like to know more about their training.

[Former castleva]

Yeah.
They´ve got loads of arts.

I don´t know how distributed or sophisticated.

[bodhitree]

The staff work looked very sophisticated.

[chen zhen]

There's this new pirate-movie with Johnny Depp coming out soon, it's got lotsa western bladework in it, I think. Portuguese/Spanish.

.. or whatever, Just trying to start this thread up again..:rolleyes:

[neit]

i find that people who practice western martial arts can be just as annoying as those who practice eastern ones.

[chen zhen]

Annoyance is a universal thing.

what's your point?

[Judge Pen]

Originally posted by chen zhen
Americans always talk about "world-series in football"- but in reality it's just americans who play it.

And yes, football (soccer, to not confuse people:rolleyes: ) is everyone else's football:o

Sorry, I understand that I'm an arrogant american and no one beut arrogant americans appreciate American Football. Having said that, Baseball plays the World Series. American Football has the Superbowl. Technically, American Football is not including the rest of the world as silent participants.

BTW, football (american) is an excellent sport. The offensive and defensive line play is a study in leverage and technique that many martial artists would appreciate if they ever give it a try.

I'm off my soapbox now.:)

[chen zhen]

I guess there is some things like pushing & running into people that is done in american football can have some application. Also some training-tools. But else I don't know...

[ZIM]

I haven't followed this topic at all. :) But here's a link (http://danjohn.org/discusthrowing.html) that has some interesting body linkage info.

[chen zhen]

I guess..:o

thanks for the link:)

[Judge Pen]

Originally posted by chen zhen
I guess there is some things like pushing & running into people that is done in american football can have some application. Also some training-tools. But else I don't know...

Training tools aside, stances and footwork are essetnial to an offensive lineman's technique. Weight distribution is also essential. For a defensive lineman, leverage and footwork are the key. Very judo like in finding the best way to off-balance the person so that you may get by them in the most effiecinet manner possible. Tackling is also a little more involved than just 'running into people.' Technique, leverage, and accuracy must all come together in a split second. Much like a good takedown or throw.

I was a better american football player because of my martial arts background. Several professional players cross-train in MA to improve their technique and performance on the field.

[Former castleva]

"stop and smell the FLOWER" I conclude.

[Starchaser107]

this thread should be ressurected, every now and then.
is there any record of aztek or mayan martial art?
not that tainos martial arts were effective against spanish rifles and such delights, but then again whose martial art is?

also , any info on Kaliparayiit (sp) I came across some sites back in the day but nothing spectacular.

[Stacey]

Savate French?

Around the same time the French were making Savate there was considerable Chinese/Asian influence. The first acupuncturists were apearing in France. Now there are French energetics which is a simplification of the 5 element theory. The French have been asiaphiles for some time.

That said, savate sucks. Bad TKD at best.

[Ikken Hisatsu]

well considering the origins of modern day savate- i.e, french sailors- I somehow doubt that the chinese had much to do with it. but since you see TKD as being "crap" as well, it just shows how narrow minded you are, so of course you wouldn't have any idea.

[Former castleva]

Those native American arts sure sound compelling but I suspect they went extinct with the tribes,unfortunately.

Greek art,pankration?