Aikido internal?

[Samurai Jack]

I started training in Aikido in January and love it so far. I sometimes have trouble breaking 10+ years conditioning in punch and kick arts though. All the time I'm feeling like I should be popping my opponent in the nose HARD, and instead I'm trying to dislocate his elbow, since it's supposedly the more "humane" thing to do!;)

Anyhow, something really interesting just happened in class last week were my Sensei pulled back on my scapula (shoulder blades) and said something to the effect of:

"You're going to have to work hard to correct this mis-alignment. Your structural integrity depends on it. Until you get it right you're going to be weak with ki extension."

The trippy thing is that George Xu once gave me similar advice at a Chen Taiji seminar. I ignored him at the time since he was sort of harsh with his critisism in general, and I thought it was "too hard". He said something like, "You're posture is bullsh1t!" :rolleyes: Yeah, and I'm sometimes sceptical of all this internal ki/chi stuff.

Anyway, later on during the class, I started really feeling like my throws were effortless. Every time I re-align my shoulders according to Sensei's directions I feel this surge of power, sort of like I'm a few inches taller, and the throws get alot easier. My partners usually ask me to ease up after awhile which is funny since to me I feel like I'm hardly doing anything!

So what do you guys think? Is this ki, or just good body mechanics? Or psychosemantic? Is this similar to "internal" style power like taiji or bagua?

[Becca]

Yes, it's very close in application and tangible results, though the theory behind the two differ. I was taught that ki is a mix of proper body mechanix, concentration, relaxasion of non-essential muscles, and mind set. That all sounds very close to the physical side of qi meditation as my Sifu teaches it.

[joedoe]

Originally posted by Becca
Yes, it's very close in application and tangible results, though the theory behind the two differ. I was taught that ki is a mix of proper body mechanix, concentration, relaxasion of non-essential muscles, and mind set. That all sounds very close to the physical side of qi meditation as my Sifu teaches it.

As I understand it ki = Japanese term for qi. There really shouldn't be any difference except in the approach to accessing and utilising it. Even then they are different roads to the same goal.

[Laughing Cow]

Ki = Qi.

But the japanese usage/meaning of the word differs from the chinese somewhat.

Cheers.

[Vapour]

You missed this thread. As you probably know Japanese martial arts don't make distinction between internal and external arts.

http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=22322

[miscjinx]

By George, I think he's getting it!

"My partners usually ask me to ease up after awhile which is funny since to me I feel like I'm hardly doing anything!"

That is just a tell-tale sign for me. I've trained with someone a long time in just internal strength (no specific art), and we've come to the conclusion the less you feel it the more correct you are probably doing it.

But you may be able to get more effortless and still get more power. Posture and body alignment is one thing, but balance is another big one. When you are out of alignment (when just standing) muscles have to kick in to keep you up or you would fall to the ground. You want to be balanced and in alignment so gravity is working for you, not against you. Doing this will require less effort to move (don't need muscles keeping you up) and you will gain more speed and sensitivity (like an old scale).

But it sounds like you're going the right direction to me.

"Is this ki, or just good body mechanics?"

Could be both.

"Is this similar to "internal" style power like taiji or bagua?"

Yes. I've studied Ki Aikido, Yang Tai Chi, Chen Tai Chi and my training partner has studied Yang Tai Chi, Ba Gua, and Hsing-i - we've both come to the conclusion it is all the same thing. Internal is internal - application may be different.

[shaolinboxer]

Ki extension is a common concept in aikido, however I think that the internal/external debate is not so rigid as in CMA.


Many advanced aikidoka with whom I've spoken agree that ultimately, dividing martial arts practice into internal vs external is detrimental to the study of the art(s).

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

As in all things.. it is both internal/external.. (hard/soft, yin/yang, balance, etc...) The difference is in what we attend to, where our awareness is focused.. As for myself, i train in both, i find the balance of a well conditioned physical body and a well trained energy system to be complimentary.. to train exclusively in one or the other is not a balanced regimen..

Be well..

[looking_up]

TCB - but you train both at the same time with taiji, right?

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

Yes, how could it be otherwise.. we cannot seperate physicallity form movement, Tai Chi is an adventure in "balance"..

Be well..