How do you kick?

[Surferdude]

No you dont have to tell me I know already.....

I want to know if in a roundhouse you kick with the top of your foot, or the ball of your foot...i have seen both used, but I want to know how many of you kick with the top or ball of the foot when doing a roundhouse.

[truewrestler]

How in the h377 does someone throw a roundhouse and connect with the ball of the foot?

[FatherDog]

Poorly.

[Starchaser107]

both

[Water Dragon]

Lower part of the shin. You must condition the shin on a heavy bag. If you thought stance training was fun, you'll love this.

[Xdr4g0nx]

i have seen some karate or tkd guys do a roundhouse with the ball. it could be very devastating, if it hits :rolleyes:

[neit]

yes, in tkd i was told that the ball of the foot was the more traditional way to do a roundhouse. but that the instep had been adopted sparring since it was easier to land and made for a fast kick. anyway, i'd buy a beer for any guy who could pull of a roudhouse with the ball of his foot without breaking a toe. it is really quite difficult. if you thought the front "snap-kick" was prone to toe breaking, the ball-of-toe roundhouse is your worst nightmare.

[chen zhen]

A ball-of-the-foot roundhouse is for easier hitting the groin, and for hitting the stomach-pit. Not a power-kick though.
toe-kick only when shoes on (but when do u not have that?:rolleyes: )

[Oso]

these are two different weapons and will be used for different targets.

top of foot is faster, I think the act of pulling the top of the foot back slows the leg down a lot.

top of the foot is good for knee, peronial/t-band, sweeps, neck.

ball of foot is good for kidney, jaw, ribs, solar plexus, groin and hooking type sweeps or leg pics.

[yu shan]

we roundhouse kick using the shin area of leg i.e. MT

[tanglang]

with the foot usually- into the balls sometimes..:D

[Judge Pen]

Originally posted by yu shan
we roundhouse kick using the shin area of leg i.e. MT

If you use the top of your foot, then the shin area remains a viable striking point also. Depends on the distance.

I usually kick with the top of my foot because I usually train in shoes and if I do spar barefoot I want to play a bit nicer than kicking with the ball (which I was taught was more powerful but slower; the same as Oso). I've broken boards with a roundhouse kick and I wouldn't think of kicking a board any other way but with the ball of the foot. The top is pretty sensitive and vulnerable to an elbow also.

[yu shan]

Judge Pen

Do you guys ever knock around with the Wah Lum school there in Knoxville?

[Judge Pen]

Originally posted by yu shan
Judge Pen

Do you guys ever knock around with the Wah Lum school there in Knoxville?

I've met a couple of them and seen them do a demo/Lion Dance before, but I haven't sparred them. They came to Master Mullins' tournament a couple of years ago, but I didn't fight that year. I'm hoping that they will come this year and I can spar one of them. One guy there looks to be a real good fighter, but when I sopke to him at their demo, he seemed a bit arrogant, but hey, he looked like he could back his stuff up. There teacher also had amazing form.

You are in Nashville? I get down that way every so often. Where do you train?

[SaMantis]

JP, that's Sifu Leroy Kautz in Knoxville, has a reputation in WL as a great fighter. (Very nice guy as well)

I met a couple of his students who came to the temple to train. Good form, good fighting skills. Sifu Leroy's workouts are said to be really tough, so I wasn't surprised.

[SaMantis]

Oh, and -- top of the foot (more like lower shin-ankle-top of foot really). I don't even wanna attempt a roundhouse with the ball of the foot, I'd be the first person to break a toe doing that. :(

[Judge Pen]

Sifu Kautz' forms were excellent, but I haven't had the pleasure of watching him fight. I'm really hoping that they participate in Master Mullins' tournament. Like I said, his student was great too, but not too friendly.

[SaMantis]

Well, I can't speak for his student since I haven't met him ... although i think there's always one student in every school who is both excellent and aloof. Then again, he may have just been nervous. My reaction when jittery is to get very withdrawn, didn't notice the effect on other people until a friend pointed out that she thought I was a snob the first time she met me ... had to admit to her that I was just scared sh*tless at the time. :D

[Judge Pen]

Yeah, you're probably right. I was excited to speak with him though. I've been meaning to check out a class of theirs. My understanding is that they are primarily Northern Mantis. Is that right?

[Shaolin-Do]

Id like to touch hands with a white eyebrow practitioner...

[chen zhen]

Heel of foot should have been a voting-possibility.
Thats what I would have voted.

[Ming Yue]

If you can pull your toes back far enough the ball of foot round kick can be good. I've done breaking demos with that kick. (back in the TKD days).

IMO top of foot is better for penetrating kicks to large areas of flesh/muscle, lots of follow through. When sparring, I rarely if ever use ball of foot round kicks but when I have they're quick out and back strikes to bonier areas.

[fa_jing]

The round kick with the ball of the foot concentrates the power into a smaller point. I've switched over to shin or top of foot, because I'm no longer specifically training to pull my toes back. I did, though, in TKD. The TKD 2nd degree BB test in our organization called for 4 boards to be broken with a rear leg roundhouse. You would be needing to use the ball of your foot for that one.

[norther practitioner]

As you all have said, it depends...

front kicks... depends, if I'm being more defensive in nature, I'll usually go with the top of the foot to the groin...

If I'm being more offensive, or trying to open up space, I'll try and go with the heel.

then I also use my instep and outstep for some as well, but rarely do I try to pull that out, and if I do, it is a lucky spike of a kick or something.

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by Judge Pen


If you use the top of your foot, then the shin area remains a viable striking point also. Depends on the distance.

True enough, but if you aim to use the top of the foot, what happens when the opponent steps back? you miss. If you are kicking with the shin and he steps back, your instep may still connect.

The top is pretty sensitive and vulnerable to an elbow also.

That's why the hip should be turned over, at least, that's the way it's done in MT. In other styles, the leg just snaps out there, and a lot of times, it will snap at an upward angle... VERY susceptible to an elbow. In MT, the hip is fully turned over and the kick cuts either inward on downward, not upward.

[SaMantis]

Judge Pen,


Yeah, you're probably right. I was excited to speak with him though. I've been meaning to check out a class of theirs. My understanding is that they are primarily Northern Mantis. Is that right?

That's right ... Northern Mantis jut sow (wrestling hands) style with delicious tam tui flavor. :cool:

Please give the school a call and go see a class, questions are always welcome (well usually, I haven't been to Sifu Kautz' school but I'm sure it's the same).

[bung bo]

the pong lai teaching method is to make contact with the mid to lower part of the shin. i would only kick with the top of the foot for a groin kick. i've seen the shin do much damage on just an upper arm. just think what it can do to your ribcage. it can be very very painful to catch an elbow in the shin, though. but just condition a lot.

[yu shan]

Judge Pen

Leroy is my friend and my older KF brother in the Wah Lum style. He is one of the best MA people I`ve ever had the pleasure of knowing and training with. His student`s are of the utmost quality and down right good people. You should drop in sometime, they are always open for a good fight.

My school is in Nashville, call me at (615) 289-3509, I do another Mantis style now, had to move on.

I would like to show you our kicking/conditioning.

Jim

[Judge Pen]

Yu Shan and SaMantins: I'll do that. I'm in Nashville from time to time on buisiness. There is also a SD school there. There teacher is a good fighter (but one of those aloof types :cool: ) I'd like to see some of your kicking conditioning.

7*: You are right. We are taught to throw our round kicks with the hips"turned over." I have horrible hip flexibility and thus "cheat" with my roundhouses. :p

[rubthebuddha]

heel or shin. i don't think my legs would know how to kick with anything else anymore.

[turbo76]

:)

[No_Know]

Top of the foot.

Roundhouse, ball of the foot Certainly seems to allow toes to get hurt.