What kind of fighting do you guy's do?

[fat momma]

I was wondering what kind of fighting you guys do?

I don't mean to offend anyone,I just thought
that reality fighting is out off place at a kung fu form.I know anyone training in kung fu,should not try to us it other than in a controlled environment.

I thought kung fu was for something eles,I guess I was wrong.

Anyways,I'm here to exchange useful information, and if I can ,I'll answer any of your Question about REALITY FIGHTING.I'd love to also hear about your style.

[Martial Joe]

I have been street fighting lately.Id like to go in some compotions.Maybe NHB.Who cares if I am a KF guy.I like to fight.

[fat momma]

Martial joe I didn't mean to offend you or the art you study.I do think you should enter some competitions.

I have been studing the martial arts scene for years now.What I found is students with 3-4years or 432-576 hours(thats 18 days for 3years and 24 day for 4 years)of experience lack any real fighting ability.All these black belts and red shashes,can and would be defeated with ease, with the overlooked BUT dangers art of INTIMIDATION!

let me give you an example:

Let's just say that I was a martial arts Master with 20 years or 2880 hours(thats 120 days or 4 months)of experience.and with maybe 1or2 fights in the middle of my life long martial arts training ,under my belt or sash.(there is a reason they say under my belt!)

I,the Martial arts expert decided to take you under my wing and teach you the secrets of martial arts,The only thing I ask, is that once I finished training you, you must get into a fight,and two, you must train 9 hours a day 5days a week.

After the 13 week training session.(thats equeal to 4 years and 9 hours at a normal MA.school)I give you a nice Black belt or Red sash, you chose.

Now you must take this and go get into a fight!
QUESTION
Tell me,with all your trainig do you feel confident enough, to put your self in a potentaility life threaten situation?

Don't let the rank blind you to how little you really know?

As for competiton with a other black belt or red sash from an established martial arts school,would you still fell confident to fight him in a controled enviroment?

Sounds ridiculous- thats why most good martial arts teachers or master don't condone real fighting,no matter how many years the student has put in.Its no where near enough to help in a real fight.The weapons you were taught might get you out of a fight,by giving you the confidence to hopfully find a better way out than to fight,there by protecting the student and the art from harms way.Everything a responsible martial arts teacher should do ,FOR HIS ART AND STUDENTS.

anyways I would love to hear about your com. fights

If you have any question feel free to ask!!!

P.S. Martial joe I just don't want to see anyone enter battle ill prepared.I know a lot of people are going to be upset with what I'm saying.don't be I'm just saying rely on your self.

[joedoe]

I disagree. I think there are a lot of kung fu practitioners out there who can fight. Masters do not discourage fighting because they think their students are not prepared - that would be admitting that they are bad teachers. They teach the peaceful path because that is the aim of kung fu - to reduce violence, and to learn to defend yourself against attack.

I would have to say that in most cases, having some martial arts knowledge is better than having none at all. Thinking you are better than you really are is where it is dangerous.

Guns don't kill people, I kill people

[fat momma]

checking to see if this works

[fat momma]

Abandit sorry but my replys keep getting cut off
I've cheacked my conection and it's not it
I"M going to respond in parts

[fat momma]

1.you said it's better to know some martial arts than none at all.I totally agree with you.

most people don't spend a lot of time thinking about fighting.If they spent any time on the subject, they would see that in a confrontation they would not know what to do.naturally this would lead to fear.

one of two things would happen to this person 1-they would avoid such situation at all cost or 2-they would look for peace from the thoughts they where having.Not hard to do in this day and age where there is a martial arts school on every second block sell peace of mind for a low monthly cost

[fat momma]

2.let's get to the part that you THINK there are a lot of good kung fu practitioners out there.

This is broad,but I'll take a guess on what kind of fighter you were talking about, com. fighter or real fighter.

A.I know there are a great many competition kung fu fighters in the world, but their place is a place with rules and refs.

B.AS for real fighters and kung fu there is not a one.
One thing with the martial arts world is that any victory ,any win ,or anything for that matter,is documented and displayed for the whole world to see.Do you really think that there is a martial arts school out there with a real fighter just hideing him,or would they hold a tournament open to all challengers and styles?

[fat momma]

so many people are consumed by the mult-million dollar question--who is practicing the best art

[fat momma]

not in order sorry
3.about masters teaching the peaceful way because that is the aim of kung fu.
In the first post that I put up.I was implying thats what I thought kung fu was about,and I thought reality fighting was out of place in a kung fu forum.
I have the same respect for kung fu as the rest of you guys.

[fat momma]

4. In a martial arts class students are always reminded that there is a chance ,I mean small chance;that the possiblity of a fight on the street can happen.If ever cornered hopfully the student dose not panic.There is a good chance the attacker is counting on this reaction from the student.
I don't know of to many people that will start a fight with someone who would do serius harm to them.(unless their jugdement is inpaired)

Martial arts can sometimes handle this type of attack.

[fat momma]

the most common type of attack

[fat momma]

Im sorry to any one that reads this,my first draft to Abandit was some how deleted?????
I've been up all night with the first draft--but you know how that went.

I at least tried to do the respect of answering Abandit,so I salvaged what I could from memorey and thats what you guys see..I'm really really sorry but It's been a long long night.

I'll look it over tommorow or I mean later today and fill in the gaps and.

[fat momma]

I'm sorry for the order,and for the point answers!

P.S.please let's not turn this into a debating post so please leave your I DIAGREE'S-OR I AGREE'S at the door.let's exchange experinces and stories.We not POLITICIANS.debates are so unproductive

If you have any questions feel free to ask.

this keyboard and screen have kicked my a*s

[joedoe]

Hmmmm, OK. I only know that there are a lot of good fighters in my school. My sigung and my sifu spring to mind, but many other senior students were also considered good fighters.

The reason I say this is because a) my sigung fought in China against the Japanese and is known to have killed several in sword duels. b) my sifu has proven his fighting ability on the street as well as in the ring.

Having said all that, I firmly believe that no matter what fighting system you practice, if you are a natural fighter then you will be a good fighter. If you do not have the fighter's instinct (which most people don't) then you will still suck.

Guns don't kill people, I kill people

[gazza99]

Most arts I have seen do not teach you how to fight..they give you tools, ie timing, techniques, strength, speed,ect...but the closest alot of arts get is sparring, which I believe to be mal-training. In sparring there is no sense of REAL danger, and in reality after one or two hits, the person would not be alert enough to use some fancy techniques. You need to MAKE your own art into a fighting one..learning how to react subconsciously..ie.someone comes at you, and instead of flinching, you explode with some random very violent chain of strikes until there is no one left standing. There are methods to go about getting this "suddon violence" and learning to not think, but to simply react with the correct thing(s). If anyone is interested..please email me as I am not going to type on..and on,

and so endeth the sermon...amen
Gary

[fat momma]

Gary could you answer me one question-on your profile it says occ.---USAF?

is that US AIR FORCE?

please
One of The kung fu schools I'm looKing into has a web site. if you would like to talk in a forum with less traffic go to www.chingwu.org (http://www.chingwu.org) maybe you guy's could as comment on it. Thanks

ABandit we could go like this for ever.I'M sure your school has vary good fighters.LETS MOVE ON.maybe Abandit you could comment one one of the choices of schools I have picked.www.chingwu.org

The other one is in chinatown and has not let me in YET.IT's not the walk in and pay type school.But I go every day and wait for them to answer.evntally they'll let me in!

P.S.if you any QUESTIONS on reality fighting contact me at www.chingwu.org (http://www.chingwu.org)
my user name is fat momma --they made a mistake here
thanks

[gazza99]

Yes Far..
I am in the US air force..in fact I also teach dim-mak/taijiquan/baguazhang on base here in oklahoma city....
Gary

[fat momma]

Gary I send you an email
I would love to hear about your training method for what you called "sudden attack"

thank you vary much

[joedoe]

Obviously I am completely missing what you said in your first post. You stated that reality fighting was out of place on a kung fu forum. I simply disagreed. Please explain how I have missed the point of the thread. I am genuine, I would like to discuss this properly but I seem to be missing the point of your initial post.

Guns don't kill people, I kill people

[Internal Boxer]

I do not mean to show any disrespect but boxing is a sport, a fairly good grappler can defeat a boxer. Reality fighting is not about boxing your oponent, on the street you cannot predict what your attacker will do as there are no rules. The last street fight I was in I stuck the whole of my thumb in the guys eye socket, I doubt he will be able to see again, so I try to end the fight as soon as I can with minimum damage to myself. As biting can be very effective. Take what Tyson did, I personally thought biting ears yeah no problem that is how you should react. People get hung up on thinking that competions is about real fighting, sadly they are not. They are about building up your ego and not about survival. Sure there are some pretty hard characters who compete and are good when it comes to the street, but if they met a real street fighter who will employ anything to serious harm them, then I would put money on the street fighter, cause he is not bound by rules. As the competition fighter, would have a difficult time as his subconscious mind has been conditioned into fighting certain kind of oponents, The Ultimate Fighting Championship showed this to be so when Gracie took on Art Jimmerson a heavy weight boxer that was ranked 8th.

[Kristoffer]

uhmmm, u talk to much
i think u are a troll :p :p

~K~
the super-duper supreme

[fat momma]

Hello ABandit,have you checked www.chingwu.org (http://www.chingwu.org)
I would love to hear your comment.I to am willing to discuss it properly,but let's do it at a forum with less traffic.I don't think everyone wants to hear us.

Internal boxer,I'm wondering if you read my thread,let's not turn this into a debating post.

Anyways I would have really liked to hear more on the fight you had with the guy.

I'm sorry Internal boxer,But I'm going to turn your well thought out tread into a Question.It's for the other reads.Sorry, but there is not to many questions here.Please forgive me.

One of the Questions was that,if boxing had any thing to do with reality fighting

Well let me start by telling you a little bit about me and boxing.I'm 25 years old-I started training when I was around 11.

You see boxing is the underground martial art of today!

In boxing you are thought to fight period.NO fancy move's,NO history lessions,nothing that is not useful to fighting.Becuase there is to much on the line.(I'll explain later)and this is only for sport.

By the sound of it Internal boxer(just using your name inter.box.forgive me!)you do not know what its like to train for a boxing match-even just for a ring match.and have not been in any real fights.

If some of you have read my tread on the martial arts expert who takes a student under his wing,and has to fight after his 13 week training.Well in martial arts that may be ridculious.

But thats exactly what a student boxer must do.And if he wants to fight again--he must constantly train just as hard,or when the opportunity presants its self to fight again,he would not be able to fight.

And if there was someone else in his weight div.that has worked harder,than he would be given the opportunity to fight.

What happens if the fighters are equals?
Than they must fight each other.It's not just clubs.All boxing to the pros is done like this.that's why there are ranks.they all want a chance to fight the best.

What this dose to a student is condition him for war,in the ring or out.It's up to you to want it(fights)not chasing an untested Black belt or sash--but the fight!you will do anything to get into a fight.

Dangerous w the only philosphy being:Fight any challengers and win.You might only have one chance to prove your self.

This is the way to weed out nonfighter.and protect them from harm.These paying boxers can't pay if they are hurt in any way(ego or body).Real fighters never pay!

Have you noticed how the best boxers have close to no defeates?

This is no mistake!With a boxers philosphy,every loss no matter how small,is not taken well by the boxer--trainer-club,or the people watching.Boxers may not be fighting with swords,but there is not one proboxer or any boxer that is not putting his training,reputation as a warroir,and life on the line every time he fights.


would finish but have to take my son to the emergancy!!!!!

[joedoe]

Fat Momma,

Went to the site you gave me and couldn't really do much on it. May have to update my browser.

BTW I agree with you about boxers - they are martial artists and they are VERY effective fighters.

Guns don't kill people, I kill people

[fat momma]

hello Abnadit.if it's o.k. I'll finish where I left of and then get back to you.


here go:

....and life on the line every time he fights.In or out of the ring.A real fighter dosen't go to class 3 times a week,for an hour each time.

He trains all the time.How many good fighters do you know with a steady job?There is no such thing.fighting is the only thing he has to do.

It's sad,but not that many fighters can make a living at what they do.But REAL FIGHTERS still keep fighting.

Internal boxer you made a comment that a fairly good grappler would beat a boxer.Let me tell you the time that is spent before a fight,that is part of a boxers training .Studing his opponeant.This is a master at fighting,studing another master of fighting.Do you really think a boxer would not study the grappler?

Do you really think if a boxer need help in the disection of grappling,there by going to a grappling school.That the master there would turn him away--or charged him for lessions?The answer is no.

You see the boxer can learn all the grappler would ever have to offer in a fight with hours spent in a school.

Do you think if a grappler went to a boxing gym and learn how to punch that he would have the advantage?No, becuase boxing is not about punches and technique.

But fighting.And that can not be learnd or taught by someone else!But must be done by one self!You can only learn to fight by fighting.

You talk about age of an art.You see martial arts is vary old,but do not be fooled A martial art can, to age and get weak,and die!These are arts that us to be for combat,In thier prime they must of been A thing of beauty,and a thing to fear!

you see the Grappling Masters of the world are just starting to come out and fight.

No matter how old the arts are, they only have a vary few fight experinces between all of them to draw on .for guideance in a real fight situation!
real fighting technices to use.

boxing is only and I'm guessing(this is not taught in a boxing school)around 150-200 years old.But what I do know is it has been two hundred years of fighting!Not hundreds and hundreds of years of technices!A boxer has thousands and thousands of fights to to go to at his own time and consault the warroirs and battles for guidance!

Maybe one day I'm sure boxing, to will to grow old like the rest of the arts.But boxing at its core and at any level is fighting.The other arts where combat arts.there is no need for fighting like that any more.

But boxing is watched by the people,and with time boxing just gets better and better.As long as we as humans like to see fighting.Boxing will be around.Maybe the martial arts warroirs of yester year thought this was a good way to fight forever.

FIGHTER ARE NOT MADE THEY ARE BORN

fat momma

P.S. internal boxer about your example of the ufc and the 8th ranked fighter.THe boxing community has never heard of the bum.THe grappling community lost ower respect with that one!trying to pass him of as a boxer.That show fooled the people and MARTIAL arts community,but not the fighting community

[Internal Boxer]

I hope your son is ok. I have a daughter and I know how precious they are.

I realise you are dedicated to your fighting art but you are wrong. Boxing is a sport governed by rules, and therefore not reality fighting cause there are rules. I used to be a Thai boxer and have battled in the ring, it was a hard sport, but I have had plenty of street fights with more than one guy and I wonder if I would be here today if i had not attacked them with techniques that are outlawed in every comp fight. In every match you only have to fight one Oponent, not 3 or four attacking you all at once with bottles And chairs. So please do not say I have never been in a real fight cause you do not know the half of it. If the original essence of Gung-fu (or internal boxing)is taught then it contains standing grappling techiques, to close a boxer down, and grab the delicate tendons at the front and the rear of the neck, as well as ripping ears of and gouging eyes out. If you read your history you will find boxing has its roots in greek games at olympia. Where oponents used to wear animal hides around their fists. The greeks were very keen on documenting every aspect of their life. The brutal Greek wrestlers also used to compete but in the unprejudiced greek writing you can discover for yourself that the boxers were scared of the grapplers cause they used to get their arses kicked, regularly loosing eyes and ears, lips, noses, through no rules fighting. I suppose we will just have to beg to differ on this one. For you think I am wrong and I think you are wrong.

[fat momma]

I thank you Internal Boxer,for your concern.My son is just fine!

Well ,let's get to it:

The Mongoose and Cobra Question

You are pretty sure that I am wrong as to the grappler and boxer issue.Considering you draw this conclusion from ,something that you have watched on television.But not through experience.

You have not studied grappling or boxing.

As to the rules in boxing,Well those rules are there for the public.Not for the boxer.You have mentioned that you have fought in the ring,you of all people should know that those rules get in the way when you are fighting!

All anyone has to do is go to a boxing gym,not once are the rules mentioned.But what can be done to break them. But how to get away with things in the ring.You should know that once in the ring,that the two fighters want to kill each other.And the rules are in place to prevent this.a good example is the one you gave with mike tyson!

That's why at the club and street level boxing events there are no weight div.or NO RULES!Head butts,throwing,Take downs,elbows....anything.

Where do you think the pro boxers you see came from!

Some of you should join a boxing gym,If you prove your self as a good fighter,you won't believe what kind of fights you will be offered!

Right now I make My living as a street level boxer.No rules no refs,and no Gloves!I have real fighting experience with all sorts of matrial arts and with grapplers.Not one has been anything two fear.

Well ever since this grappler craze has happened a few have tryed to try it.Thinking they wear going to dominate.One guy was all most killed.He was shooting his mouth off,and when he was knocked out. a bunch of other fighters continued to to kick the poor guy.I was not there for that one!If I was I would of fought for him!

You see at the street events if you bring your own fighter,you get a 1000 dollar bonues.An extra 500 if Its another style.This way if something happens to him it falls on you.Good motive to not kill someone.If you do its your as*!

What most Street Boxers do is go to other martial arts schools,looking for people to bring to a fight.A lot of you are untested and only to eagar to see what you got.

[fat momma]

Right now, AS some of you have read that I am trying to get in a Kung fu school in chinatown,they have not answered the door but they will.

This is my big Chance, if I can put this deal together;I won't have to fight again for a living!I know they like to gamble, and They have an endless resoure of fighters.and they know how to keep things a secret.

if I or when I get in I will pick the best fighters and make an offer.

Two things are a big kink in this plan,1.is laugage and culture and2.fighting style.

what I'm asking from you guy's is help.anything

not a debate.

I'm sorry if this sounds disrespectful,but this post is heading to nothing but opinions.

If you have any Questions about reality fighting please feel to ask!Let change information!

Fat momma

P.S.Internal Boxer I'd love to hear about your life saving technic's.As for your History lession,forgive my ignorance,My schooling is not one from a systematic education.

[Internal Boxer]

To be honest, I know you have studied boxing but you are a street fighter not a boxer, the purpose of rules in boxing is not for the viewers but for the fighters, cause if there were no rules, bouts would be over pretty quick, and it would be likely to be the end of one of the fighters career without rules. the street brawls I have had, I have tried to end it as quickly as possible, with nothing fancy. Our training emphasises accessing the subconscious. Training what is called the Reptile brain, which is the oldest part of our brain, and creates the reflex arc, so all responses to attacks are instinctively a reflex response, I am sure you guys have the same ability. I used to like fighting but know I feel it is wrong to harm someone for money or your ego. The following is just personal to me as what I have found to be effective. I have found palm strkes to the face to be effective, with stretched concave fingers for two reasons. A) I can deliver more power with my palm, as my fist tends to get swollen with continued punches without gloves. B) the fingers of the palm often find there way into the oponents eyes, so after a couple of good hits, they tend to have severly impare vision. I also like head locks, with a strangle, or eye gouge with my thumb. Or in a headlock with an ear rip, neck squeezes either the throat or around the back of the neck also works. There are two arteries either side of the throat that if pressed or struck hard can cause ko or death. That is why I only use this stuff when someone attacks me to try and cause me serious harm. I do not know why you fight for money, cause if you are what you claim to be as a street fighter then you know yourself, the injuries you accumulate from each fight with you for life. There are easier ways of earning money my friend without screwing your body up for the sake of a few bucks.
My advice to you is give it up and be a good father to your son.

[fat momma]

Thank you Internal Boxer the exchange of your fighting experience,and for your advice!

That's exactly what I'm tring to do.But I love what I do.If I could I would keep doing it.I've been fighting in and out of the ring,since I was 14 years old.At the age of 16 I started to fight for money.That's ten years as a street Boxer.Its hard to try to explain to a nonfighter,why someone would do this.

I have two children and a wife that mean the world to me ,that I have to think of now,and as you have said my body just can't take much more.My body and emotional condition have taken to much.But this dose not make me love fighting any less.If I can't fight anymore,I will do something to do with fighting.If Anything, if that means building my own stable,than that's what I'm going to do.

I would love to open a school one day.I have to much valueble experience to not pass it on.I have reach the point in my fighting that I get the same feeling to teach as I do to fight,sometimes I think more!


I didn't want to say anything about what I do for a Living,I knew a lot of you would say and think I was not a boxer.But this is what boxing is about.The fight is all that matters,not where you fight,or how long you spent in the gym training.But if you fight and win,period!

Your example of the rules there for the fighters,so the fight would last longer, and that the career of the loser would be over if there was no rules.

Let me tell you that any Boxer is always looking, trying for the quick knockout, in the Ring or out!Even with the rules in place,If the boxer loses in the fight than there is a good chance that his fighting career in the ring is about to be over!

P.S. thank you Internal boxer and the rest of you readers

this is FAT MOMMA

out

[fat momma]

brought old post:Why is it that many black belt have no skills--easier to bring post here and answer ,than to rewrite WHY IS IT, THAT MANY BLACK BELTS HAVE NO SKILLS

fat momma

[fat momma]

thanks readers for everything-and thanks kung fu mag.

Hopefully what I wrote will help someone, one day,but they will have to go looking for it.To bad posts did not have a shelf life as long as the martial arts.looks like the post is on it's way down.

To the person who reads this later on -if I was able to show you anything,maybe you could even just put your name here,give new life to the post,for new readers to see.

thanks guys,it was intresting reading what you guy's wrote!

Remember rely on your selves-in a fight it's only you who will get your self out.

Fighting is just as intimate as sex.The fear,The adrenalin,The pleasure or pain,The relief when its over.With experience all these elements will be controlled by you.You will decide who feels the pain or pleasure,who feels the adrenalin,who feels the relief when its over.And if the fight go's on!

If something happens make sure the B*tch remembers you for life!you be the giver not the reciver.

Chances are you will remember all your fights.With preperation,when thinking about all your fights.They will put a smile on your face.

What I have seen from some posts.Is that you guy's are missing the beginning of a fight.See the fight is nothing but a drinking contest.mucho bullsh*t.

The beginning of the fight is just the other guy force feeding you your own adrenalin.with fear mixed in, it's just a matter of time before you fall,and he'll be there to finish you off.He's using you to defeat you.

What I do, is see it for what it is-I will take the shot of adrenlin he has offered me and take one for my self, from my self.I picture the worst possible thing that could happen to me.He dosen't really know what scares you.Chances are he will come no where near what you envision!

With experience all you will feel is a hot burning going down your chest,thats all.Just like hard alcohol!I think this is why so many a**holes get brave when they are drinking.

Make sure that you are always matching the adrenlin he's giving you with your own.What this will do is give you that strenght you will need if something happens,you will not feel any pain.The more he gives you, the worst he is making it.

A few guys touched the multi opponeants question.You have to see a real fighter deal with multi opp.No fancy moves--Its primal--like a dog!Go's right for the neck--go's for the few assh*les that are keeping the whole group as one.See in multi opp.they are all acting as one! nothing fancy just a big dumb animal.You talk about staying away from a big guy,so he dosen't get a hold of you.the same thing here,except this big beast gets more dangerous if it smells blood or fear!A real fighter will keep moving-and he can with each shot put one of them down for good!

Every time you get that adrenlin rush-control it,feel it.envision that you've just taken a shot and THAT"S ALL IT IS!After awhile every time you get the adrenlin rush-fear will not follow-you will only get the burning-You will feel the burn as good things to come-not something to fear-but a celebration.Like alcohol!

anyways I wish I had more time to explain--you martail arts guys are always thinking,you guy's will get there.

FAT MOMMA

out