Realities of Self Defense!

[Laughing Cow]

Hi Guys.

Found this on another board:
Article (http://www.rgj.com/news/stories/html/2003/09/16/51848.php?sp1=rgj&sp2=News&sp3=Local+News&sp5=RGJ.com&sp6=news&sp7=local_news)

Scary stuff and something that should make all of us think about SD.

[Fred Sanford]

and what should it make us think? I think the shooting was justified. Most people on this forum seem to be anti-gun to begin with. which to me is funny.

How many antigun martial artist people are confident they could with their bare hands stop a 6'1" tall 230 lb crazy person who is busting into their house?

Shot placement is key. 2 main targets to put someone down in a hurry are the heart and the brain. Dude was using a .357 and he failed to immediately stop the guy. The guy bled out and died eventually. I've heard stories of people shot with .45's who lived to tell about it.


Three of Cryderman’s five shots hit Hetrick: in the upper torso, the thigh and in the foot. The shot to the thigh ultimately proved fatal, severing Hetrick’s femoral artery.

I just shot someone's .357 revolver yesterday. the long heavy trigger pull sucks. I could shoot it better than the guy who owned it, but I'll stick with my 9mm glock. If he doesn't practice much, it's no wonder Cryderman was all over the place with his shots, not to mention missing two times.

the guy only had 5 shots, he probably didn't think to have any speed loaders nearby. I do not like revolvers, gimme a semiauto any day.

[Laughing Cow]

and what should it make us think?

Maybe that even multiple hits might not stop an attacker.

That you NEED training and preparation to use your gun AND a backup-plan in case you run out of bullets, got a jammed gun, can't get to your gun on time, etc.

On the forum where I saw this posted most of the people that replied prefered shotguns rather than handguns for home-defense purpose, loaded with shot as not to endanger family members hiding in the house.

I read the article that he did more to slow the attacker down by hitting him with the broken shotgun.

But I guess for too many people here it will only serve as re-inforcement that guns are good things and that you need to feel like a man and that gun control is punk.

And, yes, I am a anti-gun left-wing liberal nazi. Ok, I said it for the guys that will reply later on.

[SanSoo Student]

Thats crazy, 3 shots from a .357 magnum...
My master always said, that after inflicting three strikes (ex. throat, eyes, groin) on a guy, and he seems unaffected..it would be best to run.
After something like that, I would run...

[Fred Sanford]

Thats crazy, 3 shots from a .357 magnum...

people get obsessed with caliber. what good is a .357 if you can't shoot it accurately. I bet that bullet in the foot was frickin deadly.....Shot placement, shot placement, shot placement

Just in case you did not know, a .357 will shoot .38 Special and that is what some people load them with.....

if a person habitually target-shoots .38s and then loads conventional .357 Magnum ammunition for "carrying," some experts say that the first shot fired in earnest will be quite an unaccustomed surprise to the shooter, and could lead to enough of a startle reaction to impede follow-on shooting or other defensive behavior


But I guess for too many people here it will only serve as re-inforcement that guns are good things and that you need to feel like a man and that gun control is punk.

LOL. Anytime someone successfully defends themselves from something like this it's a good thing, IMO. Whatever tools they did or did not use. If only i could figure out where the "feel like a man" comment comes from...It's funny as hell.:D

guns are good. don't know who told you otherwise. nazi.


that replied prefered shotguns rather than handguns for home-defense purpose lemme guess they preferred pump action shotguns?

screw that give me a semi-auto benelli M1

[Laughing Cow]

Originally posted by Fred Sanford
Shot placement, shot placement, shot placement

Nice theory, but how many train for it especially in a scenario like this where the door swings open and closed.
Not much time for accurate aiming, IMHO.

Like in MA training most of what the average person trained will go out the window during a real situation.

IMO, he did well and handled the situation well.



If only i could figure out where the "feel like a man" comment comes from...It's funny as hell.:D


We know that all the Americans are deep-down Jown Wayne wannabees.
No use denying it.
;)

[quote]
guns are good. don't know who told you otherwise. nazi.

Never said otherwise, but I don't see them as the ultimate that so many people claim them to be.

They are a tool used correctly it is great, used unwise or by an unskilled person ....

Seeya.

[Merryprankster]

If you are TRULY interested in self-defense you need to learn to handle firearms, melee weapons of some kind and your bare hands.

That said, a properly used, carried and maintained firearm does a tremendous job evening the score. "How do you think our fellow would have fared without the revolver?" is probably the better question.

I'm betting that weapon evened the score pretty well. Bleeding out happens fairly quickly at a major artery, and the femoral certainly counts. Figure the increased heart rate from all that activity would have increased the rate of bleed out. You saw that the defender begged the crazy guy to stop because he saw he was "running out of gas." I'm betting it took less than a minute for him to start slowing down. It sounds like the shotgun blows just rocked him a bit but didn't actually put him down.

As a side note there are commercially available target ranges where you can train for odd shots.

[method man]

Originally posted by SanSoo Student
Thats crazy, 3 shots from a .357 magnum...
My master always said, that after inflicting three strikes (ex. throat, eyes, groin) on a guy, and he seems unaffected..it would be best to run.
After something like that, I would run...

nocense u run when gun empty or before shoot ........ if u 1 bullet out then don stop until they stop or u canot go more!!!!

[Fred Sanford]

As a side note there are commercially available target ranges where you can train for odd shots.

whatchu mean by odd shots?

old boy got lucky that he hit the femoral artery I'm certain that he wasn't aiming for the guys leg. If he hadn't the story might have had a very different ending.

[Merryprankster]

Ford Prefect--

Where you train for shots with doors opening and stuff, partially concealed or covered targets, etc.

I think they call them "Carnivals" :D

I also agree he got lucky. But the Weapon still helped even the score.

[Black Jack]

I, much like I would wager a few others here, have always found it odd that certain people who term themselves martial artists, those who refer to how deadly the traditional arts are with there shadow spawned dim mak, secret poison hand, there muscle tearing and flesh ripping techniques of destruction, which when needed can be used on an attackers vital points and energy merdians with the end result being to kill, maim or cripple, talk about it like its some romantic walk in the park.

But when you get serious about self defense and mention modern technology in conjuction with one's preservation, meaning firearms, all of a sudden you are a wussy man. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Fine, I will be a wussy man, that's cool, you can be the ignorant dolt who believes in magic and fairy tales about ancient masters training harder then any of us could ever picture, about ancient masters defeating hordes of armed bandits with just there hands, about amazing jumping skills, long force projection, and body's capable of defeating steel.

This same mindset goes for those ma's who ***** about weight training and modern sport training advancements. How sparring is to deadly and so forth. How western medicine is bad and eating a tigers ***** is good.

Ahhhh....they can all go lick my hairy left nut.

Cheers

[Laughing Cow]

BJ.

Go and grow a tougher skin.

Looks like you can't even take a bit of good-natured ripping, sarcasm and tongue in cheek comments.
;)

Remember that ol Monty Python song:


Cheer up, Brian. You know what they say.
Some things in life are bad,
They can really make you mad.
Other things just make you swear and curse.
When you're chewing on life's gristle,
Don't grumble, give a whistle!
And this'll help things turn out for the best...
And...

the music fades into the song

...always look on the bright side of life!
whistle

Always look on the bright side of life...
If life seems jolly rotten,
There's something you've forgotten!
And that's to laugh and smile and dance and sing,

When you're feeling in the dumps,
Don't be silly chumps,
Just purse your lips and whistle -- that's the thing!
And... always look on the bright side of life...

whistle
Come on!

other start to join in
Always look on the bright side of life...
whistle

For life is quite absurd,
And death's the final word.
You must always face the curtain with a bow!
Forget about your sin -- give the audience a grin,
Enjoy it -- it's the last chance anyhow!

So always look on the bright side of death!
Just before you draw your terminal breath.
Life's a piece of sh*t,
When you look at it.

Life's a laugh and death's a joke, it's true,
You'll see it's all a show,
Keep 'em laughing as you go.
Just remember that the last laugh is on you!

And always look on the bright side of life...
whistle
Always look on the bright side of life
whistle

One day I need to get the FULL lyrics transcribed from my CD, that is the short one used in the movie.

Seeya.

[Black Jack]

I love sarcasm, I use it on my hotdogs with tomato, onions, relish, mustard and hot peppers.;) (chicago style)

I have never been a monty python fan, I guess my humor runs more simpsons and south park, plus I always wanted to choke out Mr. Bean and break his ankles and rub gray britney sea salt in the wounds.

Peace out. Free Fraggle Rock.

[tnwingtsun]

"Nice theory, but how many train for it especially in a scenario like this where the door swings open and closed."

I do,don't ya'll??????

[Dark Knight]

"Nice theory, but how many train for it especially in a scenario like this where the door swings open and closed."

Many training facilities do. Also I compete in IDPA (International Defensive Pistol Association)

"Defensive pistol shooting as a sport is quite simply the use of practical equipment including full charge service ammunition to solve simulated "real world" self-defense scenarios. Shooters competing in Defensive Pistol events are required to use practical handguns and holsters that are truly suitable for self-defense use. No "competition only" equipment is permitted in Defensive Pistol matches since the main goal is to test the skill and ability of an individual, not his or her equipment or gamesmanship."

From www.idpa.com

It uses barrcades, windows, shooting from all positions (Standing sitting, knees..) Check out the web page.

[Laughing Cow]

Dark knight.

I don't doubt that the training exists and is available, but what is the percentage of the average gun-owner that attends those courses? Less than 2%??

IME, the average John Doe simply wants his gun and very little besides the compulsory training & requirement.

I got 2 advanced drivers licences for both Bike and Car, I know that I am among a few percent of people that ever attended those courses. Even though they are offered freely and are not even expensive.

It is all nice and good to say that the courses are there, but they won't benefit the people that don't know about them or don't attend them.

Not trying to be funny here.