Shuai Chiao guys!!!

[Merryprankster]

Ok, I know that everybody calls their throws something different, but lets start trying to build a common terminology on this thread.

How does that sound? I'll do the leg work trying to help translate it to Judo or wrestling. Probably Judo since the terminology is standard, unless the wrestling stuff makes more sense. Just post a description of the throw if you can't find a similar one on Judoinfo.com and I'll try to hunt it down. Maybe we can all start understanding each other a bit better.

What do you guys call a basic full hip throw?

In Judo it's O Goshi. From a standard lapel and underhook belt grip you step all the way through on the back step so that your hips are either parallel or slightly past the opponents and hopefully lower. Then you finish by straightening your legs and bending over a bit at the waist as you pull their sleeve across your body.

In wrestling it's just a hip throw and the throw is done either with a single underhook and wrist control or a light overhook and underhook. You finish the throw the same way.

If the terminology isn't compatible (ie, you classify throws differently) then we'll get to work on that too!

[Water Dragon]

The problem, MP, is that us SC guys don't even call the throws the same thing :p

hip throw=waist control lift=sha ba.
Generally, you will grab the upper arm right above the elbow joint as it maked the best handle. You can grab their wrist as well, but that gives a lot more slack. grabbing the elbow givers you a tighter throw.

The other arm usually grabs them behind the waist and hugs them close to you. A common variation is to snug the crook of your elbow into their armpit and use that as a lever.

Steal step=I step my right foot between your legs and then my left foot steps behind the right to enter.

Steal step, grip, drop your center. I want to "drop" so that my butt knocks you off balance <-- This is one reason we train horse stance.

Anytime I do a back kick out, like in harai goshi or uchi mata, that is a Ho Ti. I can do ho ti with a hip throw, neck surround, O Soto, etc.

[method man]

Originally posted by Merryprankster
Ok, I know that everybody calls their throws something different, but lets start trying to build a common terminology on this thread.

How does that sound? I'll do the leg work trying to help translate it to Judo or wrestling. Probably Judo since the terminology is standard, unless the wrestling stuff makes more sense. Just post a description of the throw if you can't find a similar one on Judoinfo.com and I'll try to hunt it down. Maybe we can all start understanding each other a bit better.

What do you guys call a basic full hip throw?

In Judo it's O Goshi. From a standard lapel and underhook belt grip you step all the way through on the back step so that your hips are either parallel or slightly past the opponents and hopefully lower. Then you finish by straightening your legs and bending over a bit at the waist as you pull their sleeve across your body.

In wrestling it's just a hip throw and the throw is done either with a single underhook and wrist control or a light overhook and underhook. You finish the throw the same way.

If the terminology isn't compatible (ie, you classify throws differently) then we'll get to work on that too!

no need for standar word less talk just do good hav other guy say "what da'heck was that???????????"

[yenhoi]

Do the names change in sc and wrasslin or bjj when you grab somewhere different?

Is it still a hip throw with a neck surround? Is that a mountain throw in judo?

We have "head turning throw" that has like a million variations depending on foot/leg and arm/hand sectoring or zoning or whatnot.

:eek:

[fa_jing]

Does Judo have names for catching kick throws? Like if I scoop up or catch a kick from the inside, then step through with my rear leg and straighten it so that the back of my leg is against the side of the opponent's standing leg, now my rear arm is holding the kick, and my lead hand is ready to push the opponent's lead shoulder, I sink on my now rear leg and twist away from the opponent, pushing his shoulder and pulling him over my leg.

[Water Dragon]

Originally posted by fa_jing
Does Judo have names for catching kick throws? Like if I scoop up or catch a kick from the inside, then step through with my rear leg and straighten it so that the back of my leg is against the side of the opponent's standing leg, now my rear arm is holding the kick, and my lead hand is ready to push the opponent's lead shoulder, I sink on my now rear leg and twist away from the opponent, pushing his shoulder and pulling him over my leg.

That would be called O Soto Gari

[SevenStar]

c'mon guys, do I really have to keep reiterating my ultimate grappling thread??!??! that's what it was for. Maybe I'll get chenzhen to make it sticky in ORA, and have KL to move it there.

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by yenhoi
Do the names change in sc and wrasslin or bjj when you grab somewhere different?

Is it still a hip throw with a neck surround? Is that a mountain throw in judo?

We have "head turning throw" that has like a million variations depending on foot/leg and arm/hand sectoring or zoning or whatnot.

:eek:

In judo, they sometimes will have a different name.

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by method man


no need for standar word less talk just do good hav other guy say "what da'heck was that???????????"

:rolleyes:

[SevenStar]

cannonball = morote gari

[yenhoi]

You think we are impressed with your nazi moderator connections?

:mad:

[SevenStar]

heh. Fear my nazi moderator connections.


:eek:

[Kristoffer]

:eek:

[Volcano Admim]

how to throw people "sissy style" 101

[Oso]

I have to sell out my fellow kung fu brothers and say that I feel the judo/jujitsu naming conventions aid in learning them as they are almost directions in and of themselves.

[Water Dragon]

Diagonal Cut. Diagonal Cut is the major backward throw I learned in Shuai Chiao. O SOto Gari is a variation of D. Cut called chopping.

The idea behind the Diagonal Cut is to post someones weight on a line, and then cut it. O Soto Gari is posting on the line and then cutting the line with your reap. You can also cut the line simply by driving his body over. Just grab him and throw him down with your hands. You can do a Ho Ti on him. You can walk thru him. Once you catch the idea, you can do almost anything with it.

I like this throw a lot.

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by Oso
I have to sell out my fellow kung fu brothers and say that I feel the judo/jujitsu naming conventions aid in learning them as they are almost directions in and of themselves.

agreed.

sasae tsuri lomi ashi - lifting propping pulling ankle

de ashi harai - advancing foot sweep

etc.


the names pretty much tell you what the throw is.

[Water Dragon]

Originally posted by SevenStar


the names pretty much tell you what the throw is.

Only if you speak Japanese.

[neigung]

The shuai chiao names are pretty accurate in describing the throws, if you understand the principles of what they're referring to.

[SevenStar]

or as long as you know the translation - you pick up on it.

example - you know harai goshi and you know o soto gari (ho ti and diagonal cut)


now, o soto gari = major outer reap and harai goshi = sweeping hip

from there, you see that o = major and goshi = hip

o goshi = major hip throw.


Once you learn the names of a few throws, you can begin to decipher the names of others.

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by neigung
The shuai chiao names are pretty accurate in describing the throws, if you understand the principles of what they're referring to.

IF... if you don't then it's like "shearing? wtf?"

[fa_jing]

Revs up clippers, looks around for a hairy sheep...

[SevenStar]

The names in judo also helps understand the progression. One of judo's primary principles is that of maximum efficiency with minimum effort. you use the most efficient throw you can to achieve your goal, but in the case that you can't, you can make minor adjustments to do a throw that will accomplish the same goal, only with slightly more effort.

tsuri goshi - lifting hip
tsuri komi goshi - lifting pulling hip