Sparring question...

[sakko]

Hello... I have a question about sparring...

I'm very new to kung fu. A month and a half so far. Sifu always pairs the new students up with experienced students, they have more control and are able to teach me stuff other than just pummel me into the wall.

Rules for our sparring matches are no face, no groin, and light contact. We wear sparring gloves and mouth guard thingies.

Lately I've been sparring people other than high belts, they aren't available all the time, and I don't want to spar with someone holding back all the time. A couple people in the class have a tactic in which they constantly attack. As a result they don't defend too much, but it's very hard to counter, cause I'm constantly trying to block every attack.

What can I do to defeat someone who is constantly attacking?

They seem to have unlimited stamina for throwing punches, and I am already winded from blocking so much. A few people have told me I should try to grab an arm and throw some punches in, but advice is badly needed :(

I'm a pretty big guy, 6' 232 lbs. I was very out of shape before kung fu but am noticing a difference after a month and a half. I need more stamina to fight longer, I know it will come, but some advice in improving that would we very welcome too...

[Suntzu]

you're a big dude..... grab 'em and throw them down......

[ninthdrunk]

Side step! Dont get in the habit of standing there and blocking! That is the worst thing you could do in that situation.

The other thing you should work on is just being more aggressive. You are a big guy, and for the most part, if it comes down to trading shots you should be able to dish it out pretty good. Plunk them a couple of good times and they will slow down!

Ben

ps. read my sig....

[Kristoffer]

hmmm..
You should try be the more offencive one and not only resort to defence. Every attack has a counter attack, you need to think while sparring not just flail away. Try analyzing the way your friends move, how does he throw that kick, how does he advance etc. Look to see if he drops his guard when punching etc..

Sparring will become more fun and easier the more you do it.
good luck

[SevenStar]

attack them back. you may get hit, but on the same token, you may also hit them. Keep your head moving, and your guard up and attack back.

use your footwork. you can't constantly just retreat - they can adavnce faster than you can retreat. step off the line (sidestep) and attack.

[sakko]

Good advice... how can I improve my offensive capabilities though? I find myself planning a punch and executing it then thinking "Ok, now what?" Does speed and knowing what to do next come naturally?

Do I need to learn combinations or something? I know I don't know what to do now, but I know I plan to eventually, and I need to know the steps I need to take to get there..

[SevenStar]

use your size - crowd them - make them have to sidestep or retreat. Once you are in on them, throw them.

Like Kristoffer pointed out, sparring will get easier over time. When you first start, you may have a tendency to get tunnel vision, and can see nothing more than strikes coming at you. eventually, you will notice holes in their defense, become more aware of your own footwork, etc. just keep it up and you'll get there.

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by sakko
Good advice... how can I improve my offensive capabilities though? I find myself planning a punch and executing it then thinking "Ok, now what?" Does speed and knowing what to do next come naturally?

Do I need to learn combinations or something? I know I don't know what to do now, but I know I plan to eventually, and I need to know the steps I need to take to get there..

don't plan...just be aware. notice the timing of his strikes, notice when he drops his guard, notice which side he's weakest on... you adjust your attacks based on the info you take in while you're fighting him.

Definitely work combinations. over time, you'll learn to spontaneously alter them

[BentMonk]

Sakko - As ND said, side-step. Suntzu is right about using your size to your advantage as well. Check with your sifu and make sure grappling is allowed. With the availability of proper protection, and the eventuality of it happening in the street, I am surprised groin strikes are prohibited. Eye, throat, and knee strikes are the only things not allowed in our sparring. This is done purely for safety reasons. IMHO to further limit what is allowed in sparring is to limit the knowledge gained by sparring. I sparred a guy three times my size Mon. night. I got creamed, but it was good experience. He was polite and did not grab me and throw me across the room, but he definitely kept me living in the real world so to speak. :)

[norther practitioner]

Um yeah, let me reiterate something, side-step. If these people are flailing away, don't be too scared of stepping in either. Use your attributes for you, because a smart opponent will use them against you. You're a bid dude, use that.

[apoweyn]

Again, you're a big guy. Try crowding them. Nothing fancy. Put your hands up to protect your face and then put your shoulder (force optional) right into their sternum. That should get 'em on the defensive a bit. Or at least bugger up their attack.


Good advice... how can I improve my offensive capabilities though? I find myself planning a punch and executing it then thinking "Ok, now what?" Does speed and knowing what to do next come naturally?

My advice for the "now what?" problem: Don't plan on a punch. Plan on backing the guy into the corner or knocking him down. The mental focus required will be the same. But when he's on his arse or pinned in the corner, you'll feel a whole lot better about the "now what?"


Stuart B.

[FatherDog]

Lateral movement.

[Becca]

Side-step with an outside block. This will either set you up with a great kidny shot or give you exit to get the heck out or his/her strike range. As you get better, you will be able to turn the outside block into an arm bar... Then you will own them.:cool:

[Serpent]

Also, lose the mentality that you

Block

then

Attack

or

Block

then

Counter

Make your blocks offensive. When he attacks, strike in with a block and attack him with it and drive through. Strike his weapons (arms and legs) as you move in.

Oh yeah, in case you haven't got it yet, use your size and sidestep. ;)

[Taijiquan ninja]

okay your size doesnt matter except for intimidation. im 6'2" 145 lbs. all height does for you is intimidation in my opinion that and long limbs for reach wich you should also consider as a way to stay outside of their attacks. im not sure how fast you are but me im slow so im working on training to increase my speed both for blocking and attacking. the catching an arm idea is a good one. if you have a strong upperbody and arent afraid to do so you could grab their arm and flip them over your back. if this isnt to your taste then when they hit high you block and try to hit low before they get their next attack out if that works then mix it up and if they block low hit high a chain of well practiced moves in a sequence of six (ex. high,low,low,high,low,high) should throw most opponets off and make it easier for you.

[MonkeySlap Too]

Tajiquan Ninja said:
okay your size doesnt matter except for intimidation.


This is the second biggest lie in martial arts. If size and strength did not matter, there would be flyweights as heavyweight champions of the world. The only time size does not matter is when you are slow, stupid, and unsophisticated.

A trained big man will almost always beat a smaller man of equal or lesser skill - because he has the superior mass to compensate for errors.

Forget about blocking. Think about overwhelming your opponents thought process with multiple levels of attack. CMA is very good for this. Develop your timing - if you do this, your attacks become your defense and vice versa.

[Serpent]

Originally posted by Taijiquan ninja
okay your size doesnt matter except for intimidation. im 6'2" 145 lbs.

Man, you must be one skinny dude!

MonkeySlap Too - great post.

[Serpent]

Originally posted by MonkeySlap Too
Tajiquan Ninja said:
okay your size doesnt matter except for intimidation.

This is the second biggest lie in martial arts.

What's the first?

[Black Jack]

Serpent,

Do you cry yourself to sleep at night knowing that the best things to ever come out of the land of oz were the band Men at Work?

Huh....huh....huh?????

That is a skinny dude. I am starting to get either water weight or am putting on mass somewhere that I am not directly seeing. Just yesterday at the gym I found the scale touching 190lbs. 190lbs at a wide neck 5'7. I normally am a stocky 175-180.

Weird?

[Shaolin-Do]

Im stuck at 165-170. Bah. Goin for 190. Im 6' and a half inch.
;)

[Serpent]

Originally posted by Black Jack
Serpent,

Do you cry yourself to sleep at night knowing that the best things to ever come out of the land of oz were the band Men at Work?

Huh....huh....huh?????

That is a skinny dude. I am starting to get either water weight or am putting on mass somewhere that I am not directly seeing. Just yesterday at the gym I found the scale touching 190lbs. 190lbs at a wide neck 5'7. I normally am a stocky 175-180.

Weird?

What about Crocodile Dundee?

Yahoo Serious?

errr..... OK, Maybe Men At Work were the best thing! :eek:

Actually, I'm pulling your leg. You seem to be forgetting the rockinest blues monsters that ever hit the planet. How can you think Men At Work are it when there's AC/DC in the world?

To the corner with a dunce hat , you dullard!

Sorry, you FAT dullard! ;)

I'm about 180lbs at 6'1" and I thought I was skinny!

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by Taijiquan ninja
okay your size doesnt matter except for intimidation.

Sorry, but that's pure BS.

if this isnt to your taste then when they hit high you block and try to hit low before they get their next attack out if that works then mix it up and if they block low hit high a chain of well practiced moves in a sequence of six (ex. high,low,low,high,low,high) should throw most opponets off and make it easier for you.

How do you know what will throw MOST opponents off? Have you sparred most of them? Why a sequence of six?

[UK MONK]

hi

In my class we sparr semy contact with boxing gloves but every one goes full contact. All my kung fu brothers are 6 foot or taller and i am only 5,11' and they are all adults and i am only 16 so they have bigger muscles than i do. And when we sparr they always punch full contact to the head and run forwards so all I can do is go backwareds and blocking at the same time. So what i do is when they hit to my face and as im blocking and walking backwards i side step and kick there front foot as hard as i can and they fall down and hit the matt very hard. If that dosnt work i give them a front push kick to there stomack and they fall over and they are scared to hit back. ;)

good luck with the sparring ;)

[Ikken Hisatsu]

been said before but i will say it again- COMBINATIONS. If you follow K-1 watch people like McDonald, he obviously works those combinations which is why hes one of the best. also, don't go above your means. no point throwing a spinning back kick if the other guy is a metre away when you finally get round. mix it up- a favourite of mine (in light sparring especially) is a quick roundhouse to the leg followed by one to the head off the same leg, all in one move. dont expect your first punch in a sequence to land, use it to distract your opponents guard and then hit elsewhere. look at the opponent at around their chest height so you can see all their arms and legs and what they're doing with them. go sideways instead of backwards if possible- going back just moves the fight a bit, going to the side opens them up.

your combinations dont have to be fancy 6 hit chains. develop some quick ones that do the job and just work them until you have it down pat, then introduce new ones. like someone else said- when you block, block like you mean it. if you hurt their arm they are going to be a LOT more cautious and give you more opportunities to attack them.

one last thing- dont try to block kicks. a good solid kick will hurt whether you block or not, instead try and get out of the way, or for leg kicks raise your front leg and ride it out if they are too quick for you to dodge.

[apoweyn]

Taijiquan ninja,

Size definitely matters. Even if it only dictates the types of tactics available to you. Sakko is big. You're tall. There's a profound difference.

I'm 6'1", 220 lbs.; used to be the same height at 150 lbs. Trust me. The difference matters. My tactics as a beanpole were very different from my tactics now. They were much closer to what you describe. But Sakko could be a freaking bulldozer if he chose to. And that possibility shouldn't be overlooked.


Stuart B.

[Ray Pina]

The problem with many MA is that they block side to side or up and down. This is like a windshield wiper. The window still gets wet. Also, you keep reacting to the other guy, dancing to his beat.

Instead, why not cover up, elbows down, hands doubled up in front of your face. When they attack, come in with this shield and jam them! Let them get one shot, two the most. This is like sticking a stick in a bike's spoke. If they throw wide, keep your hands in the center and pick up your elbows.

It's a matter of mindset. Don't spar or box the guy. Come in and jam up the works right away. Either he takes you out or you take him out ... this is fighting.

You train the other way you'll run into problems later. The last thing you want to do is spend 2 to 3 minutes dancing around with one guy outside a bar ... friends, police, room for slipping, bad luck, ect.

[Water Dragon]

Originally posted by EvolutionFist


Instead, why not cover up, elbows down, hands doubled up in front of your face. When they attack, come in with this shield and jam them! Let them get one shot, two the most. This is like sticking a stick in a bike's spoke. If they throw wide, keep your hands in the center and pick up your elbows.
.

Wow! Just like Boxing!

[Ray Pina]

If it has two eyes, two ears, a nose and a mouth is it a man or is it a dog?

Lots of things look the same. And over the internet, to keep it simple, are described the same. I play with boxers and what they do is similiar but .... actually, I give up.

Everybody do what the hell they want to do. Good luck.

[Becca]

Originally posted by MonkeySlap Too
Forget about blocking. Think about overwhelming your opponents thought process with multiple levels of attack. CMA is very good for this. Develop your timing - if you do this, your attacks become your defense and vice versa.
Agree with everything but the part about not blocking... Very hard to hit what you's aiming at if your eyes are watering from a strike to the nose. Just be pickier what you block. In other words, just block the vitals like face, groin, ribs, and abdomin. I never knee block- it hurts more than just taking the d@mn kick! And work your blocks so that they become offensive.


the catching an arm idea is a good one. if you have a strong upperbody and arent afraid to do so you could grab their arm and flip them over your back.
Why make it hard?!? Done right, an outside block automaticlly traps the offending arm. Then do an exchange block, making sure to palm strike the side of their head. Slip behind them pulling their arm with, and vuala! an arm bar.:D

[Taijiquan ninja]

sweet baby jesus do you all have to critisize what i say... okay here it goes.. yeah i am a tall skinny dude.

Do you cry yourself to sleep at night knowing that the best things to ever come out of the land of oz were the band Men at Work?

i belive that was someones comment...men at work was a great eightys band i liked the song who can it be now..

next topic bigger opponet=bigger target.

next one no i havent spared against most people its just the ones i have its worked most of the time so i figured it would apply the average person as well.

why a sequence of six because i like the number six the way i do it is sequence of six(1) block or counter some of their moves sequence of six(2)

i meant by size not mattering that most big guys unless they train for speed are sluggish i know for a fact that i am. just the other day at school there was a fight. one guy 6'1" 250 lbs the other 5'6" about 160. the big guy lost and badly unless you can effectivly through your weight around to counteract an opponets speed then your size is worth nothing but....intimidation. example being if you had no idea who Jackie Chan or Shaquille O'Neil where you just saw them in the middle of the street preparing to throw down one day on your way to the store who you put your money on?

[SevenStar]

I'm short - 5'9, but I'm big - around 230

http://www.geocities.com/kalistawarrior/sevenstar.jpg

Don't fall into the misconception that big guys are sluggish. And even if they are, they can make up for it in other ways, like power and pain tolerance. In my longfist days, I was one of the most flexible kickers, and was doing things such as tornado kicks with ease.

Yes, Men at Work was a decent band.

bigger opponent = bigger target... true. Let's not forget:

bigger opponent = more weight to deal with if you go to the ground

bigger opponent = more mass to pound on you with

bigger opponent = more size to crowd you with

[SevenStar]

And, I wouldn't get caught up in the six thing. Yes, combinations are the rule, but you may use 2, 3 or 10... depends on the situation, your opportunities and what you are trying to accomplish.

[Serpent]

Yeah, but don't you get a Super Combo Bonus Point if you more than five at a time?

Or am I thinking of Mortal Kombat?

[Ikken Hisatsu]

Originally posted by Taijiquan ninja

next one no i havent spared against most people its just the ones i have its worked most of the time so i figured it would apply the average person as well.



assumption is the mother of all f*ck ups. Do not EVER assume that because someone is big they are also slow. in a fight you should never assume anything about the other person unless you are looking for a hiding. as for combinations, I think six is excessive, especially when you've only been doing it a little while. I have one 4 hit combo that I train regularly and all my others are either 2 or 3 hit. fights dont happen like they do in tekken, if you go into a flurry of blows then they are just gonna step out of the way until you finish and wear yourself out. keep it short and sweet. try to concentrate on countering as well- sometimes in sparring I wont attack at all, I wait for them to commit then jam it and counter.

[Shadowboxer]

I assume that if you are 6'2" you have long limbs. Use them to keep your opponents away from you. Put a foot in their stomach as they come in. Try a controlled side kick to the knee as they come in. Try to control the distance this way. Maybe they won't be so eager to advance, then you can use your reach advantage to attack. Front kick (either leg) to the chest and a 1-2 combo. And, sidestepping is always a good option--changing the angle of attack, make them adjust to your counterattack.

[No_Know]

Punch over/under their even numbered strikes(arms). They'll pull their first attack to bait you into blocking weak attempts~.

You might punch their attacks. It keeps them from hitting you as often (at first) and might wear-out their arms some.

[sakko]

guys this is some great advice thanks... I'm having trouble with following up attacks with more attacks much less learning combos, though I plan to concentrate on that alot while sparring and try to get a system down.

I'm gonna try alot of sidestepping too, a guy in class gave me some good examples of that, some kinda advanced but some simple.

Also I read alot in this thread about fast guys and slow guys... the last thing I want to be is a big slow guy... how do I train speed? How do I insure I can move quickly?

[Becca]

I'm having trouble with following up attacks with more attacks much less learning combos, though I plan to concentrate on that alot while sparring and try to get a system down.
'Course you are, you just started. Don't "practice" your combos while sparring, practice them on your own or slow speed with a partner or training dummy. You should already be comortable with them before trying to utilize them in a match or fight. Sparring is when you experinemt with the technique to get the timming down.

[omarthefish]

Originally posted by Taijiquan ninja
example being if you had no idea who Jackie Chan or Shaquille O'Neil where you just saw them in the middle of the street preparing to throw down one day on your way to the store who you put your money on? [/B]

I'm puttin my money on Shaq! That dude is huge AND an athelete. What makes you think he can't fight. He looks meanier than Sapp to me and Jackie Chan is an acrobat first and a fighter second. Get real.

Back on topic...

DEFENSE! Defense DEFENSE!

What kind of nutty defense have you got going on? Defense should take a lot less energy than offense. My experience AND my coaching (isn't it great when the two line up together?) is that the best way to deal with an over aggressive opponent is to let him just tire himeself out. .. . unless your defense sucks.

Not that you can't get off line and use your footwork and all that but really now...part of your complaint was that your partners are tiring you out. It should be the reverse. I tend to expend much more energy against larger guys. It's just more weight to throw around. OTOH, if you are patient, that doesn't have to be true. You don't have to force openings. You are probably overblocking and more than enything else....STOP HOLDING YOUR BREATH!!!

If you get winded easily sparring 99% of the time it is a breathing problem. Most schools basic drills are way more aerobically demanding than sparring. The thing is, when you spar there is a big tendency to tense up, hold your breath and generally overextend. Take your time. Play a defensive game and smile! The best thing I ever learned to increase my endurance sparring was to grin. It's super important to keep your teeth together though or you cna get hurt from a shot to the jaw WAY to easy. Make it more playful.

[Daredevil]

I don't know which universe the guys who are saying size doesn't matter live in. Who the hell is saying that, though? I am myself constantly reminded by how hard things can be against a larger and more powerful opponent, since most folks are larger than me.

I think the key thing to keep right is ATTITUDE. A smaller guy has to be 100% there and if the bigger guy happens to let down his concentration, then the fight can be taken. Also, being smaller, you don't have the luxury of allowing the other guy to play his game on you. Get in with convinction, break his attempts before they get realized and smack him down, then stomp on his remains. That'd ought to do the trick.

[Toby]

Originally posted by sakko
Also I read alot in this thread about fast guys and slow guys... the last thing I want to be is a big slow guy... how do I train speed? How do I insure I can move quickly?

I'd rather be big and slow than small and slow :D

Anyway, I'm big and slow, 6'3", 215lbs. I'm a slow twitch muscle guy. Nothing I can do about it. However, I can maximise the potential of what fast twitch fibers I have. So I do powerlifting and sprinting. Other good things? Plyometrics, olympic lifting, skipping. I'm sure there are others, but that's enough for me.