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Motion
12-12-2000, 11:01 PM
Ok, put the "Blood sport" stuff aside for a moment. In what way has NHB changed the way you would handle a real one on one fight?

Jaguar Wong
12-12-2000, 11:24 PM
I know that I would never rely on any one technique. I've seen too many guys eat a roundhouse kick and stay up until the decision. I've also seen guys that weren't hit full on and panic and start throwing the big guns until they gassed, because they thought they were in trouble.

I guess what I'm saying is that I always figured that you should always keep fighting until your opponent can't fight anymore, but watching NHB fights, I've realized why. I also saw that just because you can control someone's arms and legs real well on the ground or in the clinch doesn't mean something won't slip out and bite you (like headbutts, knees, and unexpected hooks). That, and don't go in half-heartedly, either bring it full on 100%, or sit in the stands and watch. Too many guys have been taken down, KO'd, and submitted because they spent too much time "feeling the opponent", and pawing at the air with feints, jabs, and fake low kicks.

Jaguar Wong
www.superaction.com (http://www.superaction.com)

Knifefighter
12-13-2000, 12:15 AM
-Back up your striking with grappling.
-Back up your grappling with striking.
-Develop powerful striking ability.
-People who have never been hit hard with a punch will panic when they get hit hard.
-Don’t force a takedown.
-The guard can save your ass if you get taken to the ground.
-Headbutts can smash your face in- especially from the guard.
-In a mixed martial arts competition, tap fast if your opponent sinks in a good leg lock. On the street pull out your knife and slash his legs up.
-It’s **** hard to knock a skilled fighter out- just reinforced something I already knew.
-Elbows from the mount can end the fight quickly.
-American wrestling can be easily modified to be an awesome martial art.
-Wrestlers who learn boxing or Muay Thai can be devastating.
-The Lion’s Den has an unorthodox and pretty effective way to survive being mounted.
-Don’t get stuck in a corner with someone in your guard.
-A skilled little guy can beat the snot out of a lesser skilled big guy.
-Don’t hold an arm bar or triangle if your opponent stands and begins to lift you up.
-Develop good counters to high-amplitude takedowns.

Water Dragon
12-13-2000, 12:44 AM
1. Professional NHB is about as realistic as a good Kung Fu movie.
2. Amateur NHB is a totally different thing than professional.
3. About 60 % of fights appear to end on the ground.
4. About 40 % of fights end standing up.
5. About 85 % go to the ground at some point.
6. About 40 % that go to the ground make it back up.
7. A skilled practitioner of any style versus a brawler equals a short, vicious fight.
8. It is easy to see the difference between a McDojo fighter and a skilled practitioner.
9. Despite the hype, there are BJJ McDojos.
10. The two fighters I would least like to fight are boxers and wrestlers.
11. A wrestler who knows BJJ is dangerous
12. Fighting a boxer is like fighting a ghost with a baseball bat.
13. Kung Fu does work in NHB, if you pay attention to and prepare for the above.

Although there are many styles, they all depend on the strong beating the weak and the slow falling to the quick. These are not related to the power that must be learned -- Taiji Classics

Knifefighter
12-13-2000, 12:51 AM
"1. Professional NHB is about as realistic as a good Kung Fu movie.
2. Amateur NHB is a totally different thing than professional." -Water Dragon.

Do you consider them both to be equally unrealistic?


"9. Despite the hype, there are BJJ McDojos."

Which ones are these?

Water Dragon
12-13-2000, 01:00 AM
No, I consider Amateur NHB much more realistic for a few reasons.

1. It shows a better cross section of the local population. You get not only skilled grapplers but also good amateur boxers, brawlers, state high school wrestlers and people from the various local martial arts schools.
2. Professional NHB is much more a grapplers game because of the lack of talent that appears from other arts. Of course you’re not going to get Mike Tyson in UFC. But I have personally fought a Pro-amateur boxer who trains in the same gym as World Champ Angel Manfreddy.
3. The talent range is much more realistic. Professional grapplers vs. hobbyists does not make for a realistic show. An amateur grappler vs. an amateur striker does.

Now, don’t misinterpret what I’m saying as BJJ sucks, because it doesn’t. I have nothing but respect for the art and train in it myself. What I’m saying is that between the BJJ hype and the Kung Fu fantasies there is an observable truth that exists.

Although there are many styles, they all depend on the strong beating the weak and the slow falling to the quick. These are not related to the power that must be learned -- Taiji Classics

Water Dragon
12-13-2000, 01:03 AM
The BJJ McDojos are usually the ones where two bums buy all the Gracie tapes, practice on each other and open a "Gracie Jujutsu" academy. All without ever studying with a legit teacher.

Although there are many styles, they all depend on the strong beating the weak and the slow falling to the quick. These are not related to the power that must be learned -- Taiji Classics

Monkey
12-13-2000, 01:13 AM
I wrestled in High School, the one thing I learned from the NHB is while on the ground with an opponent on top of you, never face the ground, always face your opponent. Otherwise you'll easily get choked out.

Tigerstyle
12-13-2000, 01:19 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Don’t hold an arm bar or triangle if your opponent stands and begins to lift you up.[/quote]
If you mean because the big slam is coming, I definitely agree. I have seen, in the case of the armbar at least, attempting to lift the person locking your arm can be a serious tactical error, though. Most likely lifting a person in that manner focuses on your bicep which would be like doing a 160 lb+ bicep curl with one hand. Holding up that kind of weight means it would be very difficult to keep the arm bent for long. Lifting with two arms would help, but it still seems like a tremendous effort to do. Also, many people that try to pull up from an armbar end up straightening their arm, helping the opponent lock on a more secure armbar. Finally in a few matches, I have seen when the guy holding the lock is lifted, he arches his back to sort of flop onto his stomach which usually brings the lifter down (onto his stomach meaning the lock is on even tighter now).

Either way, it's pretty high risk for both sides to be involved in that situation. Personally, I wouldn't look forward to being dumped on concrete, though. He can have his arm back :) .

Knifefighter
12-13-2000, 03:20 AM
Tigerstyle:
Rotating to your stomach is one way to counter the guy who starts to stand. It also works when he goes to stack you. Another counter is to grab the leg, so he cannot lift you up. Usually the guy who stands with an armbar on will hold the wrist of the trapped arm with his other hand and keep the arms bent while lifting. I do train with a couple of guys who can actually lift you with one arm, but they are monsters.
H

yamato_damashii
12-13-2000, 06:07 AM
I learned to always bring a mat and referee to my fights, because that means the other guy won't have a gun and twelve buddies.

Jason C. Diederich

Co-Founder, Yiu Dai S'uun Ancient Martial Arts
10,316th generation Dai Soke in an unbroken line of NHB Shaolin Ninja Marine successors
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