what is the problem with shaolin-do?

[Golden Snake]

I came onto this forum thinking it would be a cool place and I see ton's of derogatory comments about shaolin-do. WTF is wrong with you people?:mad:

Shaolin-do is pure kung fu. Sin The has managed to preserve a lot of arts that would now probably be lost. As I understand it most kung fu in the US is modern wushu, maybe you guys could come check out a shaolin-do class before putting it down.

It is obvious that many of you are inexperienced and don't really seem to know what you are talking about.:mad:

[scotty1]

Leave it!

Even turds with too much gas sink to the bottom....

[T'ai Ji Monkey]

Grabs case of Beer and BIG supply of Pocorn.

This should be good. ;)

Sounds!

Lights!

Action!

Cue to ......!

:D

[scotty1]

I SAID LEAVE IT!

BACK AWAY FROM THE THREAD!

[T'ai Ji Monkey]

Originally posted by scotty1
I SAID LEAVE IT!

BACK AWAY FROM THE THREAD!

You are talking to the wrong person here.
;)

[quiet man]

Well, you see, Golden Snake: basically, KFO is a place where you bash my style, I bash yours, and then we all bash shaolin-do. So, if you're thinking about staying ;) ...

[scotty1]

Like flies round sh!t.:)

[Judge Pen]

Golden Snake,

Go back and read the PAGES of debate on SD. It keeps going and going. You can't take it personally if you want to post here. There some good discussions here, but you will be attacked because you do SD. If I can help you out any, then let me know.

JP

[Brad]

As I understand it most kung fu in the US is modern wushu
Well, whomever told you this is lying and/or doesn't know anything about kungfu. BTW, I'm a modern wushu person :D If you'd ever like to discuss modern wushu you can email me at bradbauman@worldnet.att.net I've been involved with the sport for at least 7 years now :)

[Merryprankster]

Actually, the Gracies preserved authentic Shaolin Kung Fu.

[Brad]

Great Supreme Grandmaster Quai Chang Gracie became head of the cho ke yu quan system after defeating all the Shaolin masters in a secret underground octagon shaped chamber under the temple :D

[Bluesman]

You list that you are from Kentucky so I will use the fans of U of K as an example of what is going on this forum.
Let's say that you want to talk about basketball and go to a basketball forum. From what you have been told, you believe that Rupp Arena is the college basketball capital of the world . You use the 7 NCAA Championships as proof. Others will point out that while Coach Rupp won the NCAA tournament in 48 ,49, 51, the team who won it in 1950 lost in the first round in the NIT tournament and got into the lesser tournament, the NCAA, and won it.
There are several good schools that play very well. Even the school that UofK fans calls its little brother spanked UofK last year :D . And every school has its idiot fans, so does each school on here does, ours included :eek: ( ok, I'm talking mostly about me now ).
Nothing anything you will say would ever get a Duke fan to like or say anything nice about a Cat fan. Once you come to relize that it makes coming here easier to do. Take what you read with a grain of salt. Pass over posts made from trolls ( ok, thats me again) and you will find that there are a few good folks on here. Just don't bring up the 7 Championships.

[MasterKiller]

Actually, it's more like UK fans saying that basketball was invented in Kentucky, and that only UK players know the real true basketball while everyone else in America learns modified whiffle-ball. Then, the coach from UK writes a book about the history of basketball, except he changes all the facts around to accomodate his made-up version of history, proclaims himself the true source of all basketball knowledge, and then refuses to allow his UK players to compete outside UK for fear of others learning his super-secret Gold C ock-a-Roach free throw techniques.


As I understand it most kung fu in the US is modern wushu, maybe you guys could come check out a shaolin-do class before putting it down.You ever been to a Kung Fu School outside SD?


Shaolin-do is pure kung fu.Maybe. Did you get a chance to attent the Sin The' Annual Karate Tournament this year?

[Bluesman]

http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=26158

[Meat Shake]

lol....
This happens like once a month at least. Now this thread is gonna go till another starts... bahahaha...
:rolleyes:

Viva La MeatShake!

[shaolinarab]

Originally posted by Meat Shake
lol....
This happens like once a month at least. Now this thread is gonna go till another starts... bahahaha...
:rolleyes:

Viva La MeatShake!

except last month it was a new non-SD guy who started bashing SD.

which means that this debate is inevitable no matter what! :D

[Meat Shake]

pretty much.

So Ill just stop into this thread to make my post count bigger.
:eek:

[Tak]

Originally posted by MasterKiller
Actually, it's more like UK fans saying that basketball was invented in Kentucky, and that only UK players know the real true basketball while everyone else in America learns modified whiffle-ball. I wish I could learn modified whiffleball...

[Meat Shake]

I could show you, but its too deadly.

[Vash]

hah! My Vashryu Post-te, modified for sport competition on AMWB (American Modified Wiffle-Ball) courts is much deadlier.

And it would choke Royce out.

[CaptinPickAxe]

Golden Snake

If all the debate about Shaolin-Do really bothers you that much. Maybe you should consider leaving the forum. I'm not trying to drive you away or anything, its just that there are a lot of people who have strong feelings about SD. Lets just say, if what you have seen bothers you then you won't be able to handle the real heated discussion your asking for with this thread.
www.mullins-shaolin.com would probably be more suitable for you.


Good Day,
The Captin

[Tak]

Originally posted by Vash
hah! My Vashryu Post-te, modified for sport competition on AMWB (American Modified Wiffle-Ball) courts is much deadlier.
And it would choke Royce out. Wow! Do I get to learn ground wiffling? Will you teach me the counter to the triangle choke wiffle? Do I get a spandex singlet for working out on the wifflemat?

[Fu-Pow]

Golden Snake reeks of a troll. I think you guys took the bait hook line and sinker.

[Vash]

Originally posted by Tak
Wow! Do I get to learn ground wiffling? Will you teach me the counter to the triangle choke wiffle? Do I get a spandex singlet for working out on the wifflemat?

Ground Wiffling:

No. Even the modified patterns used for developing your ground-wiffling skills are too deadly. In fact, the non-modified version was so dangerous, I thought about doing it, and it killed me. Then I came back. That's how I know I'm so good.

Counter to Triangle Choke Wiffle:

Actually, the correct terminology is the "Three-Point-Square Vascular Restraint." And there is NO counter to this ultra-deadly move.

Spandex Singlet Allowance:

You can borrow mine.

[kenso]

Originally posted by CaptinPickAxe
Golden Snake
www.mullins-shaolin.com
LOL, when I saw that link, I thought it said mullet-shaolin.com. Coincidence?

[trilobite]

lol

mullet.shao-lin.com

LMAO


funny stuff

But yeah, I just thought I'd point out that I didn't start this thread. I'm not stupid enough to try something like that again. I do believe my feeble attempt (as stated by the topic title) was hijacked by the drinkers of this forum. I could do nothing but close my eyes and shake my head.


still, that mullet thing is funny, I do agree

[Felipe Bido]

HI CMD!

[CaptinPickAxe]

****, If I had the money I'd buy that domain name.

Blast my broke ass!

[Liokault]

Golden Snake.


As I understand it

I think the above statment is the cause of most of your problems.


And for Masterkiller.

And do I have to point out again that we in the UK (well England) invented:

Basket Ball (we call it rounders and only let young school girls play it)

Baseball (Just a school girl game again)

Hockey (again only school girls)

American Football (Try to tell me its not rugby.....and its a more or less **** only sport in British schools (not that I have anything against ****s)).


Most of the games listed above were around before you were even a country. I think that rugby (american football) is the odd one out there but there are some really old games that are very localised (and massively violent) that look very like rugby (american football) but on a bigger scale.

[Meat Shake]

Bah.
You're just bitter cause american athletes 0wn everybody.
:eek:
;)


You guys only play manly games like cricket and tennis then, eh?
:eek:

[CaptinPickAxe]

Cricket is the most confusing game ever...what in god's name where you guys thinking?!? "Hey, lets make a game so complicated that it confuses everyone including half of the British population."

[Starchaser107]

whats so confusing about cricket?

american football is more complicated.

[CaptinPickAxe]

cricket just loses me... maybe its a cultural thing, because American Football can be summed up to this:

Every lines up where the ball was last, no one can move untill the ball is put into play or "hiked". The main controller of the ball is the QB and he cannot pass once he moves infront of the balls original postion. The rest is just running to the inzone.

[Liokault]

You guys only play manly games like cricket and tennis then, eh?


We have exactly 2 tennis players in the UK and one of them is canadian.

We decided long ago that sports brilliance was a sham best left to our colonial younger offspring and headed off on a new "third way".

[PHILBERT]

Originally posted by Golden Snake
...maybe you guys could come check out a shaolin-do class before putting it down...

Thats the only thing I agree with from his post. As far as Wushu goes, Wushu is defined as military art, fighting art, martial art, etc in Chinese. So theoretically, all Kung Fu is "Wushu", but most people think P.R.O.C. Wushu when they hear Wushu with the gymnastics and stuff.

And I'd like to see someone do a Wushu Wing Chun form. Sil Lum Tao while doing a butterfly spin. :p

[Liokault]

Meat Shake (or shaolin Do?)




You're just bitter cause american athletes 0wn everybody.

:rolleyes: This should read "You're just bitter cause African american athletes 0wn everybody".

[FatherDog]

Originally posted by Liokault
Meat Shake (or shaolin Do?)





:rolleyes: This should read "You're just bitter cause African american athletes 0wn everybody".

There's still tons of caucasian athletes in baseball and American football, and the NHL is dominated by pale northern *******s. Basketball is really the only major sport that's got a predominance of african-american athletes.

[Kristoffer]

There's not many black people in hockey. Canada has one, I think

[Meat Shake]

"You're just bitter cause African american athletes 0wn everybody"."


Eh, They are still american, no? :p
American exceeds the color of your skin. Thats what makes us american, we gots a little bit of everything!
:)


Meat Shake (or shaolin Do?)
;)

[Ikken Hisatsu]

Originally posted by FatherDog


There's still tons of caucasian athletes in baseball and American football, and the NHL is dominated by pale northern *******s. Basketball is really the only major sport that's got a predominance of african-american athletes.

well considering americas population/wealth its expected. but im confused- you say you're the best at these sports, but you're the only country that plays them (in a serious manner)

i mean, that narrows the field a little dont you think?

[Liokault]

well considering americas population/wealth its expected. but im confused- you say you're the best at these sports, but you're the only country that plays them (in a serious manner)

Grrr I was going to post that.

My girlfriend is canadian, we have regular arguments over why you (in north america) insist on refeering to thr "world series". I mean just cos cuba plays dont make it the world!

If you want to see a true world game, just watch the English rugby team (most are gay x-public school boys) crush the world at their feet.

[Tak]

Ground Wiffling:
No. Even the modified patterns used for developing your ground-wiffling skills are too deadly. In fact, the non-modified version was so dangerous, I thought about doing it, and it killed me. Then I came back. That's how I know I'm so good. Hmm. How about if I stand in wiffle-horse and practice reverse wiffle for three years first?


Counter to Triangle Choke Wiffle:
Actually, the correct terminology is the "Three-Point-Square Vascular Restraint." And there is NO counter to this ultra-deadly move. Not even biting the wiffle points?


Spandex Singlet Allowance:
You can borrow mine. Why does it smell like cheese?

[Meat Shake]

Nah, more like garlic.

"just watch the English rugby team (most are gay x-public school boys) crush the world at their feet"
"well considering americas population/wealth its expected. but im confused- you say you're the best at these sports, but you're the only country that plays them (in a serious manner)"

And consequently, what the rest of the world cares about sport wise, america doesnt, thus lack of competent athletes in more "worldly" sports. The rest of the world is trying to play basketball. look at what happens when they play america. :eek:
(yeah, i know our soccer team blows)

[Tak]

Originally posted by Liokault
Grrr I was going to post that.

My girlfriend is canadian, we have regular arguments over why you (in north america) insist on refeering to thr "world series". I mean just cos cuba plays dont make it the world!
Actually, Cuba doesn't play in our world series, unless you're counting all the Cuban players on the various teams. Canada has a few teams, but who counts Canada as a separate country?

For other sports, I seem to recall that we play basketball against the rest of the world in the Olympics, and have done fairly well. Also, I seem to remember an American women's soccer team doing fairly well in the World Cup a year or two ago. And we've taken the gold in Olympic hockey several times.

[Ray Pina]

We beat you when it counted ... happy July 4th.:)

[Meat Shake]

lol.
I wonder where we'd be if america had lost that war.... Hmm...
I guess canada would be france jr. instead of america jr.

[Liokault]

Actually, Cuba doesn't play in our world series, unless you're counting all the Cuban players on the various teams. Canada has a few teams, but who counts Canada as a separate country?

Um? Well Canadians do, so do the 3% of americans that are aware or "abroad. OH and the rest of the world.

I have just been informed (by my girl) that canada kicked americas butt (her word) in a war once.

[Meat Shake]

Maybe your girl needs to retake world history ;)
The only thing close to beating america in a war, was the french - indian war.... French Vs. American indians. Thats before america was america. :p

[MasterKiller]

Wrong, MeatShake.

Liokault's woman is referring to the War of the Ghay (1969-1974), which Canada won hands down. They still wear bell-bottoms and butterfly collars to commemorate the victory.

[Meat Shake]

lol.
What about feathery hair and tye die?

[Vash]

At one point, I respect Tony Blair. Dude was (is) intelligent and is willing to get stuff done.

Then, Bush, who is not intelligent (well, in some political circumstances, he can rise above coniving) and is willing to make stuff take a dang long while, made Blair his prison b!tch.

Politically speaking, of course.

Be perfectly honest, I love America, but the shiyt is really starting to hit the fan, and it's spraying all over us.

Course, most of the world still asks "how high" when we say "jump."

[Hermit]

The only thing close to beating america in a war, was the french - indian war.... French Vs. American indians

Hehe. I think America (or USA) has done pretty good job beating itself up in these last few wars in the Middle-East... :p

[Daredevil]

Well, there's no denying that America is the eminent military power of the planet. Of course, that fact alone doesn't make them the empire the current regime hopes it was ...

[The Willow Sword]

The French/Indian war was not the French against the Indians:rolleyes: it was the colonies and the British who were fighting the French AND the Indians( certain indian tribes like the cherokee and the hodnoshonee nations) some were allied with the british some with the french. in the end the French screwed over the indian tribes who fouhgt with them and then the colonies and the british took over that project. (know your american history guys:rolleyes: )

TWS

[Radhnoti]

I thought I remembered what Liokault's significant other was talking about. During the War of 1812, specifically in September of 1813 the U.S. DID attempt invasion of Canada...three times. I suppose you could classify them as raids...but they were either repulsed or "avenged" by the British.
We did pretty well on the water though...led by Admiral Perry.

Looking up the above info I stumbled across this website:

http://members.aol.com/XPUS/

Shocked the heck out of me, bet you non-U.S. KFMer's will just Love this one! :D

[Liokault]

Hehe. I think America (or USA) has done pretty good job beating itself up in these last few wars in the Middle-East...

Just watched a very interesting news program.

It shows a film crew (UK) being bombed by a F-15(I think it was an F-15 but it was definatly American).

They film the plane coming in, dropping a bomb then the camera stops for about 3 seconds as the bomb explodes. After this most of the film crew are dead and theres blood on the camera lens.
The plane then comes round for a second run.

This happend because the only information that the pilot was given about his target was that it was on a road near a intersection!

This is the reason that you are getting beaten up in the Middle-East and part of why the rest of the world laughts at your armed forces.

[Kristoffer]

pretty much, yeah

[Ray Pina]

We also lost Vietnamn....

Anyway, I'm not into politics at all. But after 9/11 I'd rather have a president doing too much than not enough.

All this crap over the "mission accomplished" banner. The mission was accomplished. Overthrow Saddam! We did. Now there is a new and more complicated mission: police an occupied land. Two different things.

As far as journalist being killed, or enemy purposely breaks the rules of war by storing troops and weapons in civilian areas. Our troops were taking fire from a hotel and JAG's gave the go ahead return fire. Journalists putting themselves in harms way to get the scoop do so willingly. This is a war and all the ugly aspects of it will turn up time and time again.

For those of you not in NY, go find some footage of planes crashing into two large civilian buildings, people jumping out to avoid burning to death. I used to be a pacifict. Now I want to see more heads.

I also suspect the folks -- who have gone to West Point, have been trained -- are making informed decisions with more information than you and I have.

This thing in Iraq is actually ingenious. We have forced our enemy to come fight us on their land. I'd rather Alqeda move from Afganastan to Iran to fight soldiers than to NYC. If anything, we're being too cool. That's our biggest fault.

My biggest fear: Americans who have forgotten 9/11 (even after all the NEVER FORGETS) who demand we back off. Hell, I think we are just getting started. There is a lot of a$$ that still needs to be kicked.

[Salacious Crumb]

Originally posted by Fu-Pow
Golden Snake reeks of a troll. I think you guys took the bait hook line and sinker. Golden Snake has completed the SD Holy Trinity by becoming himself, CrazyMadDrunk, and YinYangDagger all at the same time. Perhaps his next incarnation will be even better. For someone so proud to be an SD practicioner, he sure does hide behind screen names a lot.

[Water Dragon]

Hi shaolin do. Next time, change up your writing style a bit.

[Vash]

It's not Shaolin-Do, it's Meat Shake!

:eek:

[Salacious Crumb]

Hi shaolin do.
Hi KKM!

[Water Dragon]

*kicks Salacious Crumb in the kegel*

*runs*

[Liokault]

EvolutionFist

You talk such rubbish.


Anyway, I'm not into politics at all. But after 9/11 I'd rather have a president doing too much than not enough.

What he is doing to much of is creating new anti USA suicide pilots!


All this crap over the "mission accomplished" banner. The mission was accomplished. Overthrow Saddam! We did. Now there is a new and more complicated mission: police an occupied land. Two different things.

So where is he? and when you pull out why will things be differant?


As far as journalist being killed, or enemy purposely breaks the rules of war by storing troops and weapons in civilian areas. Our troops were taking fire from a hotel and JAG's gave the go ahead return fire. Journalists putting themselves in harms way to get the scoop do so willingly. This is a war and all the ugly aspects of it will turn up time and time again.


Two things here, 1/ There is plenty of evidance that all non embedded journalists were targeted.

2/ The journalists I was refering to were just driving down a road, not putting them selfs in harms way.


This thing in Iraq is actually ingenious. We have forced our enemy to come fight us on their land. I'd rather Alqeda move from Afganastan to Iran to fight soldiers than to NYC. If anything, we're being too cool. That's our biggest fault.

You missunderstand the nature of terorrists but I agree that it is ingenious, Osama couldnt have come up with a better plan for killing Americans and creating more anti USA fanatics.


My biggest fear: Americans who have forgotten 9/11 (even after all the NEVER FORGETS) who demand we back off. Hell, I think we are just getting started. There is a lot of a$$ that still needs to be kicked.

But how much oil does one country need?

[Judge Pen]

I love how the SD threads keep getting hijacked.

[Liokault]

Its not SD threads that get hijacked, its threads in general.

Ok back on topic.

The problem with SD is?

[Chang Style Novice]

Originally posted by EvolutionFist
iMy biggest fear: Americans who have forgotten 9/11 (even after all the NEVER FORGETS) who demand we back off. Hell, I think we are just getting started. There is a lot of a$$ that still needs to be kicked.

So, enlist yet?

[MC Taiji Hips]

I'm the only person in my family who isn't active. I guess if the draft is ever reinstated I'm in the clear. (knock on wood)

[Chang Style Novice]

That's great, but I wasn't asking you. I'm asking the E-fist if he's putting his ass where his mouth is.

[MC Taiji Hips]

Wow, kindness is just pouring from you. I was adding my 2 cents and didn't really aim that comment at you. You took it upon yourself to answer it.

[Meat Shake]

Our boys over there have all of my best wishes and support. Bush can chew on my taint, after I go for a looong jog on a hot day. I hate our government. Get bush out of the white house. Re elect Gore in '04. :eek:

[Salacious Crumb]

Hi, Me!

[Chang Style Novice]

MC Taiji Hips -

Seriously, that's fine if you want to answer questions I'm directing to other people and your family has my respect for what they do. But I don't like it when some folks are willing to sacrifice other peoples' lives for their own agendas, and I'm getting a whiff of it coming around right now from E-fist. Not to mention the entire current administration.

And hey, you took it upon yourself to reply to a comment not directed at you, too, so keep in mind that saying about sauce, geese and ganders. "Wow, kindness is just pouring off you."

[MC Taiji Hips]

I think war is stupid. You can't bomb the world into peace but you can bomb the world in to pieces. I'm proud of my family serving, but honestly, I would never serve. I'm not a killer, and regardless if you Commander and Chief says it right, Its not okay to kill. these old ****s are too eager to start a war. I think we should throw them in to a Barbedwire ring with landmines strategically placed through out it and let them fight to the death. Instead of sending off my friends and family to die in vain.

[Ray Pina]

Jeez folks, just putting in my two cents.

Novice, do I have to play football to like the NY Giants (though I played a season in college)? More relevant to this board, do I need to be a good fighter to claim martial artist?

Why do I have to join the service (at 29, with two college degrees) because I don't want terrorists flying planes (that I might be on) into NYC buildings (I might be in)? Just like the NY Giant players, there are already a host of people who have FREELY chosen to make defending the country their area of expertise.

I have chosen to be a writer and a fighter ... one who surfs.

So unless you want me to write you a love poem, want to go surf 10 foot Chupo with me, then the most I could offer you as far as "putting my ass on the line" is that I am willing to cross hands with you or somebody you seem fit to stand in in the NYC area.

I was expressing my viewpoint. Last I checked we have an army of volunteers. No one's ass is anywhere they didn't sign up to be. FYI, I wanted to go into the Air Force, but my punk ass attitude and class cutting grades kept me out ... thank God. I love the life I have. I'm also dating a girl who's father saw major action in Vietnam and he has my absolute respect... all warriors do, no matter what flag they fight under. I can even respect the terrorists.

Now back on topic: I don't care about SD or what they do. Best to their training. I don't care what people say here about any of my comments. For some reason you seemed interesting in provoking me, but this is a MA board, and in this area I am most secure. I have NOTHING to prove to anyone here. I am surrounded by very talented players, and those are the ones who I judge MYSELF against.

Ray Pina

PS. Hate to short change you so here's one to choke on: I'd say SD probbaly produces better fighters than 97 percent of ALL the taiji schools in the U.S. And I'd put my money on a 3rd degree black belt over a Taiji (particularly Chang style: I'd say it died with the father) novice. Good day. God bless the US and mankind.

[Water Dragon]

Ray,
Did you jusy slam the Chang Jia arts?

[Chang Style Novice]

If you are pro-war, but unwilling to put your ass on the front lines, you are a chickenhawk hypocrite R.E.M.F., period. Nothing you have said addresses that fact, E-fist, and I doubt you'll ever even try, because you'd rather someone else take the risks for you. You aren't a 'warrior', you're a wannabe-but-tooscaredtobe. The real warriors are cleaning sand out of their rifles, or recovering from land mines blasts that blew their limbs off, or dead. And President Bush won't even attend the funerals of those who died in action because he's rightfully afraid that acknowledging the cost of this war would damage his chances at re-election. You guys are peas in a pod, and deserve each other, but the rest of the world deserves better.

As for my own fighting skills, at least I'm honest about what I am - a martial arts hobbyist without any particular talent for it. Could any number of people on this board mop the floor with me? Sure thing. So what?

- Austin Swinburn

[fa_jing]

I do not "oppose" the war in Iraq. However I am definitely unwilling to fight it myself. Thus any "advocation" I might profess for the war is definitely weak. That's why I don't talk about it. I'll die defending myself and my loved ones and some people here were definitely attacked in murderous fashion, however I think from there it gets alot more complicated.

Heck alot of people think the US should be fighting drugs in Colombia but will they go down and personally take away a farmer's sole means of supporting his family? Will they ever care about the horrible class divisions that maintain half the population in a constant survival crisis, causing the second bloodiest civil war ever in the Americas, LONG before drugs were an issue?

[Ray Pina]

I personally feel I can support a war against terrorism without joining the armed forced. You apparantly don't. I understand your argument, but feel it is a bit extreme and know you are wise enough to know better as well. Was it policy for past presidents to attend the funerals of all slain soldiers? Of this I honestly don't know. Personally, I don't care who calls the shots ... I think it makes little difference in the end.

I can't change your view of me. As I said, I'm typically against war, but this one hit close to home (the World Trade Center was a few blocks from my master's school). I know people who have lost family members in the attack.

In no way do I compare willingly fighting to being shot at and blown up. That comparison was of your own device.

However, please do not compare your pursuit of martial arts with mine. Sure, you can say 25 years+ is simply a long commitment to a hobby, but for me it is something else. My earliest memories are of me training. I was in the dojo before pre-school. My goal is simple: to be the best!

Anything less is giving in to mediocricy, settling for your technique to be "so so". That is fine. But since this is actually a martial arts board and not Politically Incorrect, and since you pursue this passion of mine no differently than a model maker a new sale for his mini-scale boat, your words weight little.

[Water Dragon]

Ray Pina,
Did you just slam the Chang Jia arts?

[Ray Pina]

No. I slammed taiji as it is practiced by most I have seen. Though I keep hearing about Max Chen and his sister so those folks must be doing something right.

I apologize now to Chang Novice before he counters and tries to rip me a new one. I don't like making these things personal. But when attacked....

Its just that by his logic, he should leave the U.S. It seems just as hypocritical to slam a presidency you live under and pay taxes too as it does to support a war that I am not currently inlisted in to fight.

I don't even practice taiji and see that things are not black and white. Circumstance! Nonetheless I apologize.

To keep it martial: I see a lot of taiji folks with bad knee placement (over their toes). Leads to no pulling angle, over committed and ruins the knees. I see a lot of things. Stomping the feet, rediculous applications and frown upon the whole, "relax, relax, relax" mentality and then push over an unsuspecting newbie. I also think too many forgoe hitting hand in favor of pushing hand. Sticking hand, pushing hand, hitting hand. You need all three.

I see a lot of bad Hsing-I, too. Guys who know the movements but lack power, don't understand that the 5 elements are not for fighting, they are ideas, foundations in power. Drill fist is not an upper cut!

These are just my opinions. And as popular as it is here to diss Karate, I would rather train at a good karate school than a so so kung fu school. It's the school's aproach and the teacher's ability to teach/students ability and willingness to learn that matters.

These poor Shaolin Do guys. Give them a break already. They know it's not the Harvard of MA. But maybe they can be the genious at community college. That's enough. Even the stupid revese punch, roundhouse kick, front kick, back fist, hammer blow I was training in karate made me tough, taught me fighting spirit. That's 70 percent of the battle right there.

[backbreaker]

Whoa,that's mind boggling.I never thought about that drilling fists weren't uppercuts.What are they considered to be?A different hidden strike?Maybe chin na applications?But that's fighting still.What is exactly an uppercut?Can shoalin do block uppercuts?How would they?This is confusing.Learning to relax a lot is important in many styles like taiji,qigong,yoga,meditation.I don't find karate at all as interesting as kungfu,nothing against karate I don't know any.

[fa_jing]

Originally posted by Water Dragon
Ray Pina,
Did you just slam the Chang Jia arts?

You just called out Ray by his first and last names. Provide your own or step off of the plate.

[Water Dragon]

Originally posted by fa_jing


You just called out Ray by his first and last names. Provide your own or step off of the plate.

Everyone here who cares to know, knows my name is Larry. Ray posted his last name here, I did not give that info out.

It's cool E-fist, for a minute there, I was like WTF??? Did he just talk smack about Chang's stuff? No prob, you can have your flan tonight after dinner.

[CrippledAvenger]

Originally posted by Water Dragon


Everyone here who cares to know, knows my name is Larry. Ray posted his last name here, I did not give that info out.

It's cool E-fist, for a minute there, I was like WTF??? Did he just talk smack about Chang's stuff? No prob, you can have your flan tonight after dinner.

I had flan yesterday. It was delicious.

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The only known solution to this grave problem are more conversations about Latin American desserts.

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[Bluesman]

Originally posted by Meat Shake
Our boys over there have all of my best wishes and support. Bush can chew on my taint, after I go for a looong jog on a hot day. I hate our government. Get bush out of the white house. Re elect Gore in '04. :eek:

You must be smoking dope :D
I do not know what kind of mess we would be in with gore ( low case intentional)

[Bluesman]

Originally posted by MC Taiji Hips
I think war is stupid. You can't bomb the world into peace but you can bomb the world in to pieces. I'm proud of my family serving, but honestly, I would never serve. I'm not a killer, and regardless if you Commander and Chief says it right, Its not okay to kill. these old ****s are too eager to start a war. I think we should throw them in to a Barbedwire ring with landmines strategically placed through out it and let them fight to the death. Instead of sending off my friends and family to die in vain.

Remember that freedom is not free. If not for the patriots that have gone before us and are serving us now we would not enjoy the liberty that we have.Everyone needs to somehow serve their country. If not , you are taking a free ride for what others have paid for.

Oh yeah, go to this site and tell them what you said on here.
http://forums.flyingtigersavg.com/cgi-bin/ubb/Ultimate.cgi?action=intro
And this American Hero signs his letters to me, Your friend,. What a great honor it is to read that each time.
://hometown.aol.com/rlsfca/index.html

[cerebus]

Actually, though Evolution Fist said nothing about the other Chang Jia arts, he did seriously slam Chang Shih Tai Chi Chuan. Though I generally agree that a Shaolin Do black belt could probably take the average American Tai Chi practitioner, I can't agree when he says "particularly Chang style: I'd say it died with the father". Sifu John Wang (who practices Chang Tai Chi as well as Shuai Chiao) might disagree with that comment also. T.

[anton]

I don't think effectiveness is at the root of what people criticise SD for. It might be the most effective MA in the world, the allegation is that SD has nothing to do with Shaolin, and very little to do with CMA. It seems that if Grandmaster Sin admitted as much, 90% of SD's critics would shut up...

PS - I have no personal opinion on SD.

[cerebus]

Anton has stated very simply, exactly what most people who have any problem with SD have spent many more words trying to explain to the SDers on this board. Shaolin-Do is not traditional CMA. It IS Shaolin-Do (not, however, Shaolin Chuan or Chung Kuo Wu Shu [Chinese MA]). It might be effective, and it has certainly done much good for many people but it's frustrating that it is represented as something which it isn't. The SDers on this board have shown that, for them, SD is good enough to stand on it's own regardless of it's background or "history" it's just to bad that Sin The doesn't seem to know they feel this way (though by this point it's a bit late for him to come clean with the truth as it would be a tremendous loss of face to admit that maybe the background was "embellished" a bit here & there). T.

[Judge Pen]

Originally posted by cerebus
Anton has stated very simply, exactly what most people who have any problem with SD have spent many more words trying to explain to the SDers on this board. Shaolin-Do is not traditional CMA. It IS Shaolin-Do (not, however, Shaolin Chuan or Chung Kuo Wu Shu [Chinese MA]). It might be effective, and it has certainly done much good for many people but it's frustrating that it is represented as something which it isn't. The SDers on this board have shown that, for them, SD is good enough to stand on it's own regardless of it's background or "history" it's just to bad that Sin The doesn't seem to know they feel this way (though by this point it's a bit late for him to come clean with the truth as it would be a tremendous loss of face to admit that maybe the background was "embellished" a bit here & there). T.

I've been open-minded to the arguments and can concede much of what you say. SD is SD. It's lineage is embellished as are other areas of the art. It is effective. It's more traditional than you think. It is not pure shaolin, but it has roots there like many MA.


The thing that bugs me, though, is saying it's not Chinese. It is Chinese kung fu, but it has evolved (or devolved as some may argue) because it was taught in Indonesia and then to a gaggle of americans who 90% can't do it justice.

[cerebus]

Well, I didn't mean to imply that it wasn't developed from CMA to whatever degree, but rather that it's gone it's own way and done it's own thing. The types of energy & aligments used (or demonstrated as far as I have seen) in SD's versions of the various forms they teach differ greatly from these forms as demonstrated by practitioners of the complete systems from which they came (White Crane, Praying Mantis, Tiger, etc.). Which isn't to say that SD's way of doing these arts is invalid, it's just that it's not the way they are done by those practicing these systems as taught in China, Hong Kong, etc. T.

[Judge Pen]

I see your point, and although I haven't worked with a Tiger practitioner before to compare my Tiger to his, I'm curious to do so.

What you are speaking of may be a result of lazy americans learning bits and pieces of systems and not putting the time to practice each form to the point that they start to blend together and look alike. I think the curse of SD is the number of forms because very few SD people can honestly say that they devote the times to learning and practicing a form that they should. I can't say I put in the time required, although when I remind myself of that it helps to motivate me to do more.

[cerebus]

From what I've seen, there are some tiger claw (Fu Jow Pai) videos on the market by former Wai Hong student Tak Wah Eng if you're interested in comparing. Also, the video "The Warrior Within" is an old 1970s documentary has some good Fu Jow Pai with master Hui Cambrelin. T.