PDA

View Full Version : hidden weapons that can be used on the street?



Kristoffer
04-09-2000, 07:06 PM
ok don't get me wrong, Im not going to walk around with weapons but Im just curious. Wich martial art-related weapons do you think would fit for a street fight? Nunchackas or what?

Kristoffer
04-09-2000, 07:10 PM
Scenario:

"Old man is attacked on the subway by two knife welding punks. Old man pulls out a Wakishasi sword of his sleeves. (he got big sleeves)."

Scenario over.
post what you think....

Robinf
04-09-2000, 11:41 PM
Hey Kriz,

I like that scenario. It's very true. "I speak softly, but I carry a big stick." I like Theo Roosevelt's thinking.

In reality, there is a weapon that Century has just put out--it's a small stick made of aluminum that folds in on itself and extracts very quickly. Seems like it would be easy enough and light enough to hide anywhere. Personally, I prefer blunt objects to sharp ones. That way, I can't cut myself /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif.

04-10-2000, 03:35 AM
robin i think i know the weapon you're talking about, but i'm not sure. one of my friends has this weapon that is a retractable thin metal rod (kinda like an antenna). it's made of this really strong kinda steel alloy or something, and when he flicks it it extends out. the thing is REALLY strong too, he broke some 2 by 4's with it. as for weapons that you can use in the street, i use keys, or pens. who'd see that coming?

clint

------------------
"Where choice is set between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence...... I prefer to use arms in defense of honor rather than remain the vile witness of dishonor"

Mohandas Gandhi

JWTAYLOR
04-10-2000, 08:18 PM
In Texas, as well as many other states, the weapon you are talking about would be considered a club, and therefore an illegal weapon.
Even if you used it in a self defense situtation you would be charged, and possibly convicted of assault and battery.
Texas Penal Code Title 2, Subchapter C section 9.31, subsection 24

According to this you don't even have to use the weapon. You must simply be in possession of it.
So if a guy tries to mug you and you have this extendable batton in your pocket, but decide to kick out his knee and punch him instead, just because you had the weapon on you, you could be found guilty of assault and battery.
There are VERY few weapons that are legal. With a permit, you can carry a handgun. Without a permit, you are limited to mace, stun guns, some chains and pocket knives. I prefer the pocket knife or the chain.


Check out the post "Hey JWT" from Ignorant Mantis on the Kung Fu forum. The Texas law is similar to many other states.

------------------
If you pr!ck us, do we not bleed? If you poison us, do we not die? And if you wrong us, shall we not revenge? If we are like you in the rest, we will resemble you in that the villany you teach me, I will execute, and it shall go hard but I will better the instruction. MOV

Robinf
04-10-2000, 08:36 PM
Thanks for the reminder about laws, JWT.

In Massachusetts, even mace is illegal. Don't know about the club, though. I'll have to check. Maybe if you carry The Club (the one you put in your car), that wouldn't be illegal /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif.

JWTAYLOR
04-10-2000, 09:06 PM
My fiance has one of those on her car. More than once I've thought, "Hell yeah" when picking it up.
I used to do alot of street racing for some pretty serious money. After a night of racing I have a few hundred bucks in your pocket. When people realized that I had allot of their money, sometimes they wanted it back. I always brought a friend along with me, so did everyone else. Sometimes people would try to scare you with baseball bats and stuff but my friend topped them all.
He kept an 8 cylinder camshaft sitting in an oil pan behind the seat. (For those of you non mechanically inclined, a camshaft is a 3 foot solid long metal rod with oblong lobes running at all angles along it's length, with a gear at the end of it.) If any trouble started he whip that thing out from behind the seat, that end gear spinning and dripping with oil. It was the meanest looking thing I've ever seen. It was instant intimidation. Ever since those days I've thought of the camshaft as one of the few legal, highly effective street weapons.
JWT

------------------
If you pr!ck us, do we not bleed? If you poison us, do we not die? And if you wrong us, shall we not revenge? If we are like you in the rest, we will resemble you in that the villany you teach me, I will execute, and it shall go hard but I will better the instruction. MOV

stickfighter
04-10-2000, 10:08 PM
I'm reminded of a guy that's on "The Warrior Within" documentary, he's a Fu Jow Pai stylist. He talks about how he once used chop sticks to defend himself against an attacker after leaving a Chinese food restaurant. This stuck with me. What better hidden weapons could there be? If you're stopped by the police then you could just say that you use them to eat with. I've even seen reference to the use of chop sticks as weapons in old China. Unless I'm mistaken doesn't Pa Kua have a weapon called "iron chop sticks"? http://www.kungfuonline.com/forum/roundtable/cool.gif

------------------
Stickfighter

HappyPuppy
04-13-2000, 09:04 AM
Steeled-toe boots.
Man, try getting k i c k e d in the cojales with those (OK, so I have something for that word)
My best friend also has a pretty interesting w e a p o n. He took some fingerless biking gloves, and sowed in some pieces of metal.
There you have it, brass (Well, steel) Knuckles.
For me, I sometimes carry those expandable b a t o n s. I carried those practicly every day for a few weeks after the Taber
S h o o t i n g s (For you people who don't know what the h e l l I'm talking about, it was another school shooting that took place a few days after Columbine. My school got nearly 3 threats of shootings and ings, so I was kinda antsy) Anyways, back to the
baton, those things are pretty cool, and useful.

IronBuddha
04-13-2000, 08:23 PM
weapons for a street fight...try your keys.
put a key in your hand like you're going to unlock a door. now use it to unlock your attackers face, eyes, neck, groin.
don't pack a keychain into your fist with a key sticking out between your knuckles. too easy to damage your hand.

procker
04-14-2000, 09:48 PM
A tightly rolled up magazine provides you with both a defensive and offensive weapon

HappyPuppy
04-14-2000, 09:52 PM
Um, Procker, how?
Getting s m a c k e d by a rolled-up doesn't hurt very badly, niether does getting poked in the end by a rolled-up .

04-15-2000, 12:28 AM
happypuppy you don't think getting stabbed in the face with a rolled up magazine hurts? it can certainly break a person's nose if done right, and at the very least will distract the person long enough to for you to continue attacking.

Clint

------------------
"Where choice is set between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence...... I prefer to use arms in defense of honor rather than remain the vile witness of dishonor"

Mohandas Gandhi

procker
04-15-2000, 12:59 AM
Loosely rolled up and its as effective as whupping someone with a wet noodle, but tightly rolled up (with the spine on the outside) and you're talking a serious weapon. One good poke to the throat area and you better walk away quick cause that sucker is gonna be gasping for breath, and like klint said,its distracting enough to put you back in control, or dislodge whatever weapon your attacker might have. As with all weapons, training and practice are what make it effective

Kristoffer
04-16-2000, 05:25 PM
Uhh, chop sticks? We ARE talking about the things chinese people eat with right? How the hell do you fight with that? And why would you carry that on you anyway? : )

Metal Fist
04-16-2000, 06:49 PM
A walking cane, hickory, nice hooked handle.
Vety effective.

------------------
"Do whatever it takes to be the last man standing!"

procker
04-16-2000, 07:46 PM
Why not chopsticks? Yeah, you probably won't be carrying around a spare set of them in the unlikely event that you go to a Chinese rest. and they are out of chopsticks, but...I think the jist of the conversation was what kind of weapons can you use in a pinch, on the street, that are hidden, and that are implicitly legal or otherwise not immediately recognizable by johnny law as illegal - that's why the camshaft sounds so great, if only a little messy. So, should you be in a chinese rest. and you get the sense that out in the parking lot, or down the street, or wherever, some sh!t might go down, before you leave you slip a set of chopsticks in your jacket, and 99 out of 100 times nothing happens and you chuck em when you get home. But the one time you do use them, you're garden variety thug won't ever see the chopsticks as you poke them in the eyes/ears/throat.

[This message has been edited by procker (edited 04-17-2000).]

Jaguar Wong
04-17-2000, 12:33 AM
Speaking of Steel toed boots (from earlier in this thread), I've been kicked square in the ear with them (roundhouse kick). I blocked the kick, but the momentum carried the leg through and the foot connected anyways. It was sort of a desparation block, since I didn't have time to move to the side with the block.

I was sparring with a friend, and we were just wearing regular street clothes. It didn't connect very hard, but the "ping" noise kinda let me know that he had steel toes. Man I was dazed for a while, back peddaling while using some kicks to keep him back. I tell you though, if he pressed his attack, he could have easily taken advantage of that situation.

As for good weapons to carry. I've heard of some tough and ruthless (or maybe rough and toothless /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif) biker types carrying the chain from a motorcycle (I don't know what they're called, but its the chain that goes to the gears on the engine and wheel). One guy had his as a belt with a clip on the end that he could quickly unsnap and use. I guess he saw JWT in action with his pewter frog belt buckle /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I also heard that a blackjack/sap (those bags filled with powdered lead) were pretty mean too. or some sap gloves (powdered lead in the knuckles).

------------------
Jaguar Wong
www.superaction.com (http://www.superaction.com)

stickfighter
04-17-2000, 04:39 AM
A chain as a belt, nice, but why not just use your belt. The belt can be a very effective weapon. You can use it to block and tie up the opponent's arms as he strikes. Or it can used as a whip, using the knotched end as the striking surface, or as a meteor hammer with the belt buckle as the striking area. It has alot of uses. And it can be used to hold up your pants!!!!!! /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

------------------
Stickfighter

stickfighter
04-17-2000, 04:49 AM
Kungfu KR!ztOffeR: you asked how would you use chop sticks? The cheap wooden ones that you would get at most restaurants would be to breakable, but the strong plastic ones that you can get are great. You could use them to strike soft tissue areas such as the throat, eyes, inside joints(inner elbow, armpit), they can used to control the opponent by sticking them up his nose(make sure you really wash them before eating with them again..lol), or you can even strike the groin with them. You can use them both in one hand, or one in each hand in a variety of grips. Their uses are unlimited. http://www.kungfuonline.com/forum/roundtable/cool.gif

------------------
Stickfighter

Kristoffer
04-17-2000, 03:20 PM
ha ha ok, I stand correctded.. By the way.. In a Jackie Chan movie his co actress fought with chop sticks. Cant really remember in what movie thought....

Kristoffer
04-18-2000, 01:35 AM
Wich movie?

HappyPuppy
04-19-2000, 04:16 AM
The problem with the belt is that, unless you practiced with it a lot, it would take too long to get off. Your p a n t s could also fall down.
Oh, and I agree with chopsticks. I never thought of them as w e a p o n s.
Now, what about a nice, heavy textbook.
I got my friend real a n g r y at me, and he w h i p p e d the thing at me. The thing slipped out of his hands, and S M A C K!!! H i t me right in shoulder. I had a HUGE b r u i s e for weeks after that, and my shoulder was f***ing s o r e after that.
Oh, and one of those nice, h a r d, heavy baseballs also h u r t like he!!. You could just say it was your special lucky-charm to the c o p s.


------------------
GRRRRRRRRRRRRR
WOOFWOOFWOOFWOOF

Tiny Dragon
04-20-2000, 12:13 PM
Hopefully by training, it is possible to handle oneself without a weapon... but if you have the choice, and want to risk getting in trouble with the law over the definition of a weapon, I'd have to choose a small keychain that I saw in a martial arts mag. It is basically a stick with two prongs. Stick the prongs between the knuckles, and you can do some evil damage.

HuangKaiVun
04-20-2000, 05:45 PM
I have a heavy black plastic hardshell Samsonite briefcase inherited from my grandmother that I carry around with me to work at the hospital.

It's pretty **** sturdy, and it packs a wallop. It also is strong enough to resist a knife attack.

Chopsticks are nice, but what about pens? They're just as sturdy and even more camouflagable.

Umbrellas can be OK, though I believe they're more effective closed than they are open.

wicked joker
04-20-2000, 11:20 PM
what do you think about fighting fans. AWMA carries them in aluminum frames. do you think those would be effective on the street, and it seems like you couldnt get in trouble with a fan.

maybe mini nunchucks, like 8" long sticks could be easy to carry around instead of the 12" ones. although in some states they would be illegal but in my state i think it would be alright to carry around

i've come across a site that sells self defense products - www.selfdefenseproducts.com. (http://www.selfdefenseproducts.com.) i ordered a blowgun from them just for fun. take a look around and tell us if you see anything that catches your eye.

joker

[This message has been edited by wicked joker (edited 04-21-2000).]

JKDVIGILANTE
05-05-2000, 04:23 PM
I carry my knife almost everywhere. It is what I call my 'GUT-HOOK'. It has a 3.5" down-curved serrated blade--very sharp,and, very legal. I have also modified it to open quicker. Have never had to use it on anybody, hope I never have to---- it would be messsssssyyyyy!

------------------

J.L.B.

Kristoffer
05-07-2000, 11:55 AM
Whoa... uhh well I have always liked the idea of walking around with a sword on the sub-way/underground so... but never tried thought.
By tha way I totally agree with Robinf, non-sharp objects make better weapons.

JKDVIGILANTE
05-07-2000, 01:42 PM
Kriz, don't get me wrong, I love my 'chucks; but if you miss me with your blount-weapon---I CAN DISEMBOWEL YOU THROUGH A THICK, WINTER COAT IN ONE QUICK SLASH------GAME OVER. It's for this scenerio alone that I disagree with blount weapons being 'better' than sharp ones. I'm not pickin' on ya dude, just telling you what you would be up against, or could be up against.

------------------

J.L.B.

Highlander
05-07-2000, 08:53 PM
JKDVIGILANTE ...... Sometimes less is more. There are two parts to the argument that blunt is better than sharp.

The first part is the legality and degree of injury. Generally speaking blunt weapons are viewed as less lethal than sharp and may reduce the legal hassle after an encounter. Also, with a sharp weapon the level of injury is usually severe and therefore limits your options to severely injure or not use at it all, whereas a blunt weapon may offer a greater range of options. (this is also why a gun is a poor choice of self defense weapon, even though it is effective, too many people are unwilling to use it when neccesary)

The second part is the level of effectiveness. I read an article a while back that questioned whether a knife injury would immediately stop an assailant. The point of the article was that you can be cut very severely and not realize it. A few years ago I sliced a finger to the bone with a swiss army knife while working on a project. I wouldn't have even know I was cut if it hadn't been for all the blood gussing all over. It took a few seconds to realize what had happened and to find where I was cut. Twenty minutes later it hurt like hell and it took 5 stitches to sew it up, but at the time it was completely numb.

Did someone mention a sword on a subway? I like it, that's my kind of thinking.

xingyiman
05-07-2000, 09:13 PM
What about pen knives? Easily concealable. Can keys really be used effectively for self defense?

Highlander
05-07-2000, 10:09 PM
Yes, key can be effective in self defense.

1) Get out your keys
2) Unlock the car door
3) Get in the car
4) Use the key to start the car
5) Get the Hell out of there

------------------
composed (kom-pozd') adj. The ability to keep ones head when everyone arround them is loosing theirs.

JKDVIGILANTE
05-07-2000, 11:39 PM
Highlander, I'm not one to talk about something I don't know about, I speak from experience only, not guess-work. I'll give you a brief run-down on JKDVIGILANTE: you might find this interesting: I'm 34, I have been shot in the hip, stabbed in the thigh(same leg), mugged at gunpoint. All but 2 of my friends are already dead, I witnessed my own mothers death,was standing next to a guy who was shot through the mouth with a .357magnum, watched his brains float down the gutter in a small river of blood---have seen worse--I have truly been there. oh, did I mention the guy was killed for being black--NO OTHER F-CKIN' REASON-JUST BECAUSE HE WAS BLACK! you just don't know sh-t unless you're unlucky enough to witness a hrrible tragedy like that. you have to live this hell to know where I'm coming from. Society can be evil beyond your worst nightmares. I want to help people live, not die.

------------------

J.L.B.

Highlander
05-08-2000, 02:55 AM
JKDVIGILANTE ....... Excellent point. This is reminicent of a thread we had going quite sometime ago. It was about training for our own realities. Your world is quite different from mine. I can't even imagine myself in the situations you mentioned, so my training and perspecive is going to be quite different. In my world, the use of lethal force would be an extreme response in most cases. In the world you describe, the use of lethal force would be the preferred response. Therefore my training incorporates non lethal options whereas yours may not. Maybe we should start that thread up again and find out what dangers others envision and what situations they train for. It could give some clarity in their other posts, ie, a person in law enforcement will train different than a person training for barroom brawl.

------------------
composed (kom-pozd') adj. The ability to keep ones head when everyone arround them is loosing theirs.

Braden
05-08-2000, 05:46 AM
Stickfighter -

Pa Kua does indeed have a weapon very similar to chop sticks. They're a pair of shortish steel rods, thin and blunt on the end. Mounted with a ring most of the way down that acts as a swivel point. They can be swung down to run along the forearms for concealment and parrying, and then quickly swung out to "pierce" with the blunt ends.

wisdom mind
05-08-2000, 08:43 AM
one's mind is the best concealed weapon

JKDVIGILANTE
05-08-2000, 11:57 AM
Higlander, I appreciate your last entry, your open-mindedness is encouraging. You want to know the strangest thing about my story^? I was born and raised upper-middle class, have always lived in private neighborhoods, gone to private schools(except high school--public yikes). What does this have to do with anything? It's real simple-----NONE of us here are exempt from the worst society has to offer, it may and most likely WILL happen to all of you here, at least once in your lives. If you want to live, you are going to have to learn the brutal stuff. You also need to know when to keep your mouth shut, because when somebody has a gun to your head---any kung-fu attempt will surely result in death--YOURS! I learned my best techniques from street-fighters with zero M.A.'s training. Never under-estimate a 'dirty' fighter. He's the one that can beat you---unless you know how to play it his way. As far as street-weapons, I actually prefer my 'chucks above all else. The problem is that they are bulky and noisy(noisy because I prefer a long chain--20 links).Also, I think 'chucks are illegal here(when concealed). The knife is legal though--even with my modifications. I have to follow the law, that's the rule. Life can be ugly, I'm here to help. Sincerely,

------------------

J.L.B.

Kristoffer
05-08-2000, 06:00 PM
JKDVIGILANTE,

**** thats gotta be though to watch man!
My regards to your mother...


about them chucks.. Have you ever fought with them in a street fight?

Highlander
05-08-2000, 08:06 PM
JKDVIGILANTE ....... I follow your point and I won't even pretend that I can relate, but you have just painted a scenerio that I am having a hard time grasping. There are areas that violence is expected and I try to avoid them. I also recognize that violence is not limited to those areas and can creap into my life at anytime and I prepare for this, but I really don't expect it to happen and would consider it a freak thing if it does. But it sounds like you have encountered a huge amount of extreme situations even though your world is one that most people would consider relatively safe. Quite frankly from your previous posts I pictured South Central LA, not upper middle class Miami (yes, I'm stereotyping, but it gets my point accross). So if it's not too painful could you relate how these situations occurred and can they be avoided. As you said, in some situation no amount of training is going to help. So my first preference is always avoidance.

If it causes you pain, forget I asked. I will understand. Also, this forum was started because the owner of this site lost a friend in the Day Trader shootings. Also, Michael had a friend murdered because she was gay. So even though I may be a relative virgin in this world of kaos, there are people here that can relate to this senceless violence. You may want to talk to them privately through E-mail.

------------------
composed (kom-pozd') adj. The ability to keep ones head when everyone arround them is loosing theirs.

JKDVIGILANTE
05-10-2000, 01:07 PM
Highlander: I actually feel the need to talk about it(hard times). People that don't know--need to know. If you want actual stories, I'll be more than happy to oblige. The story I'm about to tell, the whole situation was entirely my fault, just for being there when I was. I was at a do-it-yourself carwash(1 mile from home, busy street,well lit, nice 'hood). it was 9:30 p.m., I was the only one there, except for the two guys waiting in the little bit of woods at the end of the driveway. I was vacuuming my car(couldn't hear a thing). Next thing I know, I look up, one of the guys is coming around my car on my left side, and has a .38 spl in his hand. I didn't know it was loaded, until he stuck it right in my face--I could clearly see the full-metal-jacket rounds now. While he got my attention with the gun, his buddy went through my pockets etc...When they went through my belongings and only found $150, they became real ****ed-off--because they also wanted jewelry(I had no jewelry). They told me I should die for wasting their time. At this time, I thought I was a dead man for sure. I believe what kept me alive that time was keeping my mouth shut and acting in a way as to let them know I wasn't going to try any 'hero' bullsh-t, and at the end, I begged for my life--literally. They finally just told me to turn around and start running--and don't look back! I did as they instructed, and lived. If I would have done any different, I would surely be dead now. If anyone 'gets-the-drop-on-you' like that, and they have a gun(and a partner), you're fuc-ed--PERIOD! Don't ever kid yourself. You are at their mercy--they hold your life in their hands. I now realize just how 'mortal' I am. I got 'lucky' that day(night). KungFuKriz: yes I have used my 'chucks on the street, but my stories will have to be limited, due to the fact that vigilante is not just a nic., I help others whenever I can. I can say though; that I've never had to hit anybody in the head with them, I prefer to break both hands with them, this stops the fight every time, and no one dies. perfect.

------------------

J.L.B.

Highlander
05-10-2000, 07:48 PM
JKDVIGILANTE ........ That story makes some very good points.

1)In a robbery just give them the money. I have always been taught that if you don't then it is like saying that $150.00 is worth more than my life.

2) As Jaguar and I had mentioned in another post. Self-defense is about serviving an encounter, not winning an encounter.

3) Going against a gun is a last resort. Only fight an armed assailant when you are convinced that they are going to use the weapon no matter what you do. The odds of success may not be good, but that's all you've got. And even if you train hard and think that puts the odds in your favor, you would be wrong.

4) Anyone can get caught unprepared. This is a point I tried to make in a post some months ago. In an encounter, the bad guy always has the initial advantage or at least they think they do. If they do not see an opportunity to get the advantage, they simply won't attack. They get to pick the who, when, and where and it will never be an equal opportunity. When you see the bad guys, the best you can hope for is that they pass on by and pick someone else 'cause you aren't allowed to take an action if they don't.

5) At the end you mentioned using non-deadly force. This is also my preference. I hate the thought that just because some low life, scum sucking piece of ..... uh, I mean under privilaged youth picks me out of the crowd to be his victem, that my life is going to be distroyed. In todays society using deadly force, or even excessive force can lead to jail time and law suits. And those things can cascade into the loss of employment, which can lead to the loss of your home, which can lead to the distruction of your family. Even if you win, the legal fees can do more damage than allowing yourself to be robbed. And that's not even getting into the mental trama from killing someone. I figure if I needed to I could use deadly force without blinking an eye, but that is not to say that the event wouldn't haunt me for a long time.

Thank you for sharing. I know others will find value in your post also.

JKDVIGILANTE
05-12-2000, 03:09 AM
Hey guys, check-out my latest topic in 'kungfu forum'. Let me know what you think.

------------------

J.L.B.

indovitello
05-14-2000, 09:26 AM
i'd have to agree with the rolled up magazine or newspaper. a friend of mine and i were sparring with one another using rolled up magazines a la arnis sticks and he caught me on the cheek with one and it was enough to make the eyes water and stun me long enough for him to get a few more quick blows in before i could recover. also, they're legal and most weapons aren't. as far as the sharp objects go, i've never been mad enough (even at my worst enemy) to want to attempt to kill someone. you have to realize that plunging a sharp object into someone's body is quite a serious commitment to make and is nothing like they make it look in the movies. of course, if my life were threatened that's one thing but a simple street fight doesn't warrant that kind of retaliation. oh yeah, pepper spray is a pretty **** good weapon. if you've ever had it sprayed in your face you know this to be true. complete lack of vision and if you're unlucky enough to inhale some, complete lack of breath. that gives you more than enough time to vacate the scene or (if you're ruthless) to seriously take advantage of your attacker and victimize him / her. okay, that's my humble opinion...

PeteB
05-14-2000, 09:11 PM
I know a police officer that also teaches fighting to the police force that he is with. We both share techniques with each other, teach women's self defense together, things like that. He told me that pepper spray will not do much against a motivated attacker. If the person really wants to kill you, that sh*t ain't gonna do nothin. Anybody ever see those self-defense keychains that you can attach your keys to? I think they're called a kobuton or something like that. Anyway, he told me that a woman was being attacked, grabbed the wood end, and smacked her attacker with the keys. The guy (that I know) told me, that the attacker's face looked like a cracked pumpkin (his exact description). The keys cut just about down to the bone. Sounds like a good weapon to me.
My greatest weapon, that I always keep with me, are my wits and intelligence. Keep those and don't get nervous and you should prevail over most of the things that life throws at you.

------------------
When man is born he is soft and weak; When man dies he becomes stiff and hard. Thus, the stiff and unyielding follow death; The soft and yielding follow life.

Reno
06-28-2000, 11:53 PM
The 'Jackie Chan' film where the female cop uses chopsticks is 'Police Story 3: Super Cop'.

The scene is Jackie Chan is playing an undercover cop working for the chinese government, so undercover that Hong Kong Police do not know whats going on, after they help a drug lord escape from a labour camp ( they want to get information from him) they get busted at a resturant. Him and another cop (the female one played by Michelle Yeoh) fight their way thought the people but Chan gets captured and escorted away. Fortunately Yeoh jumps starts another fight causing the other people to drop their weapons. Jackie breaks free and a bad guy jumps for his weapon on the floor.

KEY MOMENT
Yeoh picks up some chopsticks and chucks them like a dart at the ground (digging itself into the groun) preventing the guy from picking it up.

When another guy has a go at gettting the weapon on the ground, Chan has a go with the chopsticks but cos he's never been trained to throw chopsticks they fly in a random direction in the crowd like confetti at a wedding.

CASE CLOSED
(****** i'm bored)

TCell
07-01-2000, 05:25 AM
Take one well knitted sock.
Insert one can of coke (or soft drink of your choice).
Bosh person around the head & run away.
Remove can from sock drink & dispose of said 'blunt instrument'.

Works on so many levels...

grand master
07-05-2000, 06:50 AM
knives are far too messy , a knuckle duster is by far the best discrete weapon you could hide it anywhere.

Wyvern_Beta
07-18-2000, 10:30 AM
Well, there is always the 4D Mag-Lite. They are legal, fairly easy to carry, and are made of metal. I wonder if police officers use them on patrol?

totallyfrozen
08-08-2000, 02:45 PM
I saw a mention of nunchaku. As far as I know these are illegal in most (if not all) U.S. States.
Some states...mine included...have a system for aquiring a Conceal Carry Permit so that you can pack a handgun. You have to go through a class which teaches the laws concerning it..and you have to qualify on a gun range to prove that you can hit the broad side of the barn.

If the question is about the BEST concealed weapon that can be used in a streetfight, I don't think that I will get any argument that a gun is the best. However, it's brutal. And typically, people try to look for ways to avoid carrying one.

In my state, usually, if you use a weapon in a fight you are in a s**t load of trouble. You can get a permit to carry a gun..and would get in less trouble with the law for using that as opposed to, say, a ball bat. The reason is that you wouldn't have a permit to defend yourself with a bat, etc.
Unless you are dealing with a real idiot...just the presence of a gun changes things and might discourage your attacker (without having to shoot). If your attacker is a young punk then he will probably be all full of **** and vinegar and think that he can beat you by pulling his own gun or whatever. In that situation, you are kinda screwed, I mean, what else can you do?..you'd have to shoot the poor kid.
I understand everyone's desire to find something small but effective. Preferably non-lethal. There are alot of things out there...but even the "modified gloves", in my state, would be labeled "metal knuckles" and would then fall under the "deadly weapon" laws (I know, I just heard a case on this 2 weeks ago...Grand Jury Duty /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif ). You would be charged with assult with a deadly weapon (here Felony Assault 1).
I think that my point is...check with your state and city and find out what the law says. In my state/city, you would be better protected by the law if you carried a gun than if you carried a weapon that was "unusual" or "home made." You know? The "home made" weapons tend to imply "intent" to assault to the court. Were as, being licensed to carry a gun allows that you can be expected to carry a gun...since you are permitted to carry one...and doesn't show "intent" to do a future "bad act."
Beside all that...it's going to come down to how stuck you are on wanting to be "traditional" with your martial arts or if you are just wanting to use practical self-defense to survive in a modern society.

Think about it, if you have a CCW permit, the cops aren't going to freak out on you like they will if you have a samuri sword in the back seat of your car. After all...what kind of a violent freak carries a sword to wack off people's heads, right? Well, you know what I mean.

There are a few options other than guns (thank God) but you should check carefully to find out what you can use. I'm certain that nunchaku, swords, 3-section staff, spears, darts, blow-guns, throwing stars, etc. Are going to be on the "no way, buster" list. At least outside of the walls of your home. Here you can used pretty much anything (except explosives) to protect your home INSIDE. On the street is a different story.

My unqualified (I'm not a lawyer) 2 cents.

totallyfrozen
08-08-2000, 02:50 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by HappyPuppy:
Um, Procker, how?
Getting s m a c k e d by a rolled-up doesn't hurt very badly, niether does getting poked in the end by a rolled-up .[/quote]

No, but if you got wacked with one, you'd sure think twice before jumping up on the couch or ****ing on the carpet again. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

totallyfrozen
08-08-2000, 02:53 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by KungFu KR!zt0ffeR:
Uhh, chop sticks? We ARE talking about the things chinese people eat with right? How the hell do you fight with that? And why would you carry that on you anyway? : )[/quote]
I'd carry 3. If the first 2 didn't kill the guy, I'd save the last 1 for me. hahahahaha!!! /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

totallyfrozen
08-08-2000, 03:03 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by procker:
Why not chopsticks? Yeah, you probably won't be carrying around a spare set of them in the unlikely event that you go to a Chinese rest. and they are out of chopsticks, but...I think the jist of the conversation was what kind of weapons can you use in a pinch, on the street, that are hidden, and that are implicitly legal or otherwise not immediately recognizable by johnny law as illegal - that's why the camshaft sounds so great, if only a little messy. So, should you be in a chinese rest. and you get the sense that out in the parking lot, or down the street, or wherever, some sh!t might go down, before you leave you slip a set of chopsticks in your jacket, and 99 out of 100 times nothing happens and you chuck em when you get home. But the one time you do use them, you're garden variety thug won't ever see the chopsticks as you poke them in the eyes/ears/throat.
[/quote]

I agree. Chopstick can be very deadly. I would expect the mugger to die laughing as soon as he saw you pull 'em out!
Actually, I think they would be considered a "weapon of mass destruction" because the police officers would die laughing when they heard about it and so would everyone else in the court room.

I'm teasing you, of course. I'm all in favor of using anything you can get your hands on. Hell, why not take a doggie bag from the restaurant. You could slip it over the bad guy's head then he couldn't see you run away.

(gosh! I'm such an ass sometimes /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif )

totallyfrozen
08-08-2000, 03:25 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Highlander:
JKDVIGILANTE ...... Sometimes less is more. There are two parts to the argument that blunt is better than sharp.

The first part is the legality and degree of injury. Generally speaking blunt weapons are viewed as less lethal than sharp and may reduce the legal hassle after an encounter.

I'm not a lawyer or judge..but I've served in court quite a bit. As I understand it (in my state) the law doesn't descriminate against sharp or blunt. It has what it calls "deadly instruments" These include but are not limited to: firearms, knives, clubs, metal knuckles, and any other impliment which could be use to inflict serious bodily injury.

Also, with a sharp weapon the level of injury is usually severe and therefore limits your options to severely injure or not use at it all, whereas a blunt weapon may offer a greater range of options. (this is also why a gun is a poor choice of self defense weapon, even though it is effective, too many people are unwilling to use it when neccesary)

I disagree. combat is combat. Unfortunately, you might think you can "kinda cut" someone while you can't "kinda shoot" 'em. Well, actually, you can't kinda cut 'em either. Not according to the law.
I would say, unless you are a physican who knows everything about the guy and can control what's going on, how are you going to be able to make sure you don't hit an artery. How do you know that he doesn't have a heart problem and a minimum blood loss will kill him? It's my opinion that not only are both blunt and sharp effective, but both should be considered.

Just as the sight of a gun is a very strong deterrent so is the sight of your own blood. If you are in a fight and cut the guy and make sure he sees it (use psychology on him...tell him to look at it). He might get scared, sick, discouraged, he might faint, whatever.
Cut him and say, "hey! You're bleedin' bad now man...your dying!" It might help. My foster dad did that in a knife fight once as a kid. It worked in his fight. You can't do that with a blunt object.

The point of the article was that you can be cut very severely and not realize it.

Like I said before, MAKE him see it...tell him to look at it! Make him THINK about the pain of your attack..the blood...his life flowing out of him. It's a fight, right? Get mean!

Did someone mention a sword on a subway? I like it, that's my kind of thinking.

It is a cool idea...but to my knowledge it is illegal (in all states) to carry a sword.[/quote]

totallyfrozen
08-08-2000, 03:45 PM
WOW JKDVIGILANTE!
I thought I had a rough and violent up bringing! You certainly wear more stipes than I do.

I'm with you, brother.

This is the reason that I push my philosophy of TOTAL combat. If you have to do it, do it. All the way. Be ready to be willing to do whatever you have to do.
There's just no way for someone to know how they will act "on the spot" until they've been tested.

I have been shot at a few times(but not hit)...but I have not been robbed at gun point like that. Holy S**t! That would be scary!

You're one tough soldier. My hat's off to you.

Thanks for defending the defensless instead of serving yourself and letting the world around you suffer.

Kristoffer
08-16-2000, 03:32 PM
so my old topic is still alive eyh?
Nice to see new guys still posting...

ok about weapons,,, well i think that EVERYTHING can be used as a weapon. I didnt think so but after reading whats been posted here and in other threads i am convinced of it. I really like weapons. My girl doesnt,, ahh well...

Black Jack
08-16-2000, 09:30 PM
I have seen credit cards and solid pens used to good effect in training. You can poke, jab, slice, thrust, and even pinch with these very common items and if handled with skill and the tactic of surprise you can do a good amount of damage of the perp.