Purpose of MA training.

[T'ai Ji Monkey]

What is the original purpose of MA training?

Spritual cultivation
Teaching fighting skills
Self Defense
Improving chances of getting a women
others.

Pls, vote and if possible give a short description as to your choice and why you think it is the correct one.

And finally one question is modern MA training still in line with the original purpose?

[SevenStar]

That's too general, IMO... different arts were created with different purposes.

jujutsu was created with combat in mind

TKD was created for sport

Some styles will tell you that it was created solely for combat. Others will also emphasize the spiritual / philiosophical aspects.

Perhaps a better question is, "What was the style you train in developed for?"

[T'ai Ji Monkey]

7*.

Considering that people can only talk for the styles/systems that they learned I assumed it was a given.

OTOH, different cultures, time-periods and regions tend to develop MA for very similar purposes.
;)

[MasterKiller]

What is the original purpose of MA training? To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women....

[yenhoi]

What is Martial Art and when do you become a Martial Artist.

:confused:

[MasterKiller]

When does a T-R-E-E cease to become a signifer for that big brown thing outside your window? When it falls on your head?

[yenhoi]

Well, you certainly have never answered.

**** off.

:eek:

[David Jamieson]

There is no purpose in an external mechanism or vehicle.

Purpose is found within the self.

Therefore, in and of itself, martial arts does not have purpose, but the martial artist finds purpose through this vehicle.

cheers

[MasterKiller]

Well, you certainly have never answered. You can fall back on your Jeet-Kune-Do-isms all you want, and claim that the world is "fomeless like wataa"; however, once you get hit in the noggin, all those abstract expressions you hate, like "martial art" and "style" will come distinctly into focus.

The answer is that the tree is real, and the fact that you call it a T-R-E-E, using letters to create a word which only represents the thing in of itself, does not in any way prevent it from crushing your head when it falls down, no matter how abstract a concept you think it should be.

[lkfmdc]

- To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women....

SOMEONE BEAT ME TO IT!!!!!! :(

[norther practitioner]

All the times I've answered this I've always said for health. Be it mental, physical, spiritual (yes spiritual, you start talking to god a lot more when someones pounding your noggin'). I have a lot of fun doing forms, and they are a great workout. Two man drills can really show you what you need to work on, then sparring, at all levels gets me amped.

It gets me amped to pound the f#$% out of someone when they **** me off...:D ;)

Seriously, I do it to stay in shape, get a little bit of this, a little bit of that, and to keep my wimmins safe from ninjas. Oh and fighting skills come to mind.

[Tak]

MK wins best answer in this category, and gets my vote for most likely to eat a loaded chimichanga in April 2006.

The original purpose of martial arts was probably to keep other people from causing the lamentations of your women.

[FatherDog]

Well, the current purpose of martial arts can be any and/or all of the above.

Anyone who argues that the original purpose of systems that teach you to punch, kick, throw, lock, slash, beat, and/or stab people is anything other than "fighting" are idiots.

[Vash]

Crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their wimmins.

By Crom, my line is stolen!

[Becca]

The original purpose? I have no clue. They developed many ways and in many different cultures. Some are very, very old while some are less then a decade old. This question has no valid answer. Sorry.:( :)

But I practice martial arts:
A) for fittness
B) comrodery
C) beats sitting infront of the couch watching "reality" shows.

[T'ai Ji Monkey]

I am with Fatherdog that the original purpose was to create fighters.

Back in the days, there were not many career choices open and few people changed careers once they started.
If you couldn't afford to learn to read or write your choices were farmer, artisan or figher.(simplified I know)

SD, spiritual development and so on are/were side-effects for MA.

Personally, I am against this new trends of "Learn MA to get Self-Defense skills, or become "street efficient", MA for health purpose, etc.

IMO, all this type of thinking and goal orientated studies are leading the student towards diminished skill and further away from mastery.

So maybe traditional MA training took 3-5 yrs to make someone a profficient fighter so that he could earn his bread using his skills. 5~10yrs to become a good MA and 10~20yrs to become a "master" at their profession.

I know many other skills/professions that take a similar route and timeframe for someone to be considered a "Master" in it.

Anyhuh, started ranting.

P.S.: I know that many don't share this view.

[CrippledAvenger]

Am I one of the few left in the world who thinks learning to throw a man on his head is a worthwhile skill?

[T'ai Ji Monkey]

Originally posted by CrippledAvenger
Am I one of the few left in the world who thinks learning to throw a man on his head is a worthwhile skill?

Depends on why you want to do it?

Any skill used with the right timing, situation and place is worthwhile.
;)

The question is of course:
Is having the skill worthwhile the investment it takes to get it in the first place?

[T'ai Ji Monkey]

Originally posted by T'ai Ji Monkey


Depends on why you want to do it?

Any skill used with the right timing, situation and place is worthwhile.
;)

The question is of course:
Is having the skill worthwhile the investment it takes to get it in the first place?

Example:
I worked with programmers that pushed out 30.000~40.000 lines of Assembler and C code a month for a living, that is debugged and working code.

Compared to them I just dabble in programming, and there are even more people out there that dabble even less and call themselves pros.
:D

[CaptinPickAxe]

I take MA so that I can smash my friends faces when they look at my girl:D

This is the conversation:
ME: Where you lookin' at my woman?
(this is where the conversation branches)
HIM:Yes.(My hand smashes his face)
or
HIM:No.
ME:Why Not!?! (My hand smashes his face)

its a dead end and I always win.

Mwhahahahahah:D

[Vash]

What the fudge is the difference? I've often heard: Fighting is mutual, self-defense is unexpected!

Indeed. And, as stated at some point in Newsweek, birds go "tweet."

Martial is of war. A war is a fight. Fight initiation breeds need for self defense.

Oh, well.

I stick with the great Conan the Governer, (paraphrased)

" . . . to crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their wimmins."

Wreckonize, hatas.

[T'ai Ji Monkey]

Originally posted by Vash
What the fudge is the difference? I've often heard: Fighting is mutual, self-defense is unexpected!

What's the difference.

Last time I checked any Military/Police/similar force claimed to train fighters, nothing said or even mentioned about SD Skills.

Learning to engage the enemy in combat on a battle field in my eyes does not translate well into Self Defense Skills.
Defending villages, arresting people and similar also do not translate well into Self Defense skills.

Too many people still think that fighting in a bar-room brawl, outside a 7-11 or similar = Self Defense. :rolleyes:

Also many still believe that MA training will enable them to fight multiple Opponents, defend against guns, knifes and similar.
Criminals are NOT stupid and they learn soon and share information what works and what doesn't, they are also unlikely to give you a chance to pull your gun or similar unless they are novices of course.

How many SD-courses & MA styles tach you to defend against situation where the first thing you know about the attack is the gun against your neck and the voice behind saying: "Hand it over."

IMHO, when it comes down to getting physical 95% of your SD skills have already failed you.

Reality is that most people got NO SD skills and get themselves into situations(ego, pride, etc) that they cannot handle.

Anyhuh, just my Opinion.

[T'ai Ji Monkey]

Self Defense as per the Dictionary:

One entry found for self-defense.
Main Entry: self-de·fense
Pronunciation: "self-di-'fen(t)s
Function: noun
Date: 1651
1 : a plea of justification for the use of force or for homicide
2 : the act of defending oneself, one's property, or a close relative

bold addition is mine.

Point 1 to me is very interesting as I have seen it often that people got into trouble or even started it and than later on claimed that they only "defended themselves".

In any case, IMO, they are looking for an excuse or justification for their behaviours and actions.

Which leads me to the topic of "HONESTY in MA", which I think I better start another thread on.

[apoweyn]

The original purpose of martial arts training? As a blanket concept (as opposed to the purpose of individual martial arts), I'd agree that it's combat.

If we lived in a world in which combat hadn't been necessary, it's unlikely that combat would have become the vehicle of things like self improvement, excercise, etc.

I think the chain of events goes something like this: demonstrable need for adept fighters --> train fighters --> experience of combat teaches fighters values that were considered valuable at the time (e.g., diligence, humility, respect, etc.) --> combative technology improved but human qualities were still valued --> primary purpose of martial arts shifts from effectiveness on the battlefield to various other purposes. At that point, those purposes become more diverse and more personalized. Today, the military isn't instructed extensively in what we would call "martial arts." They're simply not state of the art anymore. So since the majority of martial artists aren't soldiers anymore, they have the freedom to train according to their own priorities. Competition, meditation, exercise, whatever.

As for me personally, I think I've gone through various different purposes. Everything from self actualization to the pressing need to defeat twenty well-armed ninja in a pinch.


Stuart B.

[Vash]

I do it cuz I don't see any reason not too. Just a part of me.

As for the aboriginal intent, I agree with apoweyn (how in God's name do you pronounce that, by the way?), and everyone else who said "fuk that b!tch up pho 'e fux me up."

[apoweyn]

I agree with apoweyn (how in God's name do you pronounce that, by the way?)

ap . owen

it's welsh. 'ap' means 'of' in the same way that 'mac' or 'o' would in scottish or irish. and 'owen' is pronounced precisely as you would do normally (e.g., owen wilson).

:)