mantis7
12-08-2003, 10:48 PM
it actually boils down to this
A good Sifu should be able to understand and relay concepts, theories,formulas and need skills that cover physical development, martial stratergy and the core of the system.
It should be a mote point if he/she have 1000 forms or 365 movements. In martial arts everyone will learn a system but will interpret diffrently due to body size, skill level, and desired outcome of learning the art.
If you have the core of the systems which are concpets, theory, techniques and stratery then there should be no arguement. To many people argue about how many forms are present and who is legit and not. If you move and fight as your system dictates or develop your system to your personal flavor then that is all the proof is needed.
To many people are out their collecting forms and are not truly developing their martial skill. Martial arts are combat arts and nothing more. If a teahcer has the inclination to help to student develop into a moral being that is their decision. If they choose no to than that is also their decision. To many people apply this spiritual, holy mystisim idea to the arts.
If the teacher is a evil man does this make his Gung fu any more inferior to the man who has attained enligtenment. When someone says that martial arts teaches discipline they negelect that this discipline is of neutral origin. Yes, you will develop dicipline over the body, over mentral concentration, of speed, and all that good stuff but it will not inheritanly make you a all around good guy.
I was once told a story that will stick with me for ever. I will tell it here and If I am not mistaken they are in Hsu's Sowrd polisher or Ying ming yangs books.
A gung fu teacher had a student who had trained with him for a long time. The sifu, one day, told the student to leave the school and to practice his skills for three years and then to return. The student left and trained diligently for three year and returned to his sifu. His form was still like the one his teacher taught him and resembeled the sifu's movement. The teacher saw this and said " leave and train for another three years and come back" The student left and trained for another three years, this time he found him self forgetting how the sifu moved and was losing his sifus flavor of movement. H returned home and perfomred yet again and the sifu told him to leave for another three years. He left and trained for three more years but his form no longer looked like his sifu's. this disheartened him but he returned to his teacher. He performed for his Sifu and he felt that he was horrible because he no longer moved like his sifu. The teacher smiled and said good you training is now complete.
Well if you read this and understand the moral I am proud if not here is the moral. Your Sifu only provides the key essentials to training and it is up to you to make it your own. Gung fu is not about mimicry! Take what you learn and make it your own and only then shall the gem of gung fu be your own.
The only time you should worry about learning from someone is when what they are teaching you are forms and forms alone. That is not Martial arts. Do not dilude yourself into thinking I will get the techniques sooner or later when my understanding is present. The proper use of techniques are important in learning the art and actual usage is paramount. The forms are nothing more than linked movements of the system and once you attain the core information you can create your own.
It matters not if a Sifu is a evil man, good man, arrogant, has ten forms or 100. All that matters is if he/she knows how to apply his skill and has the ability to convey their skills so that others can learn them.
I rather learn from a Sifu who can fight and has a evil heart than a Sifu who is of good heart and no skill. A teacher who has never been in a fight or touched hands with anyone has no real experience and knows nothing but theory,tech and concept. If someone has never thrown a punch and struck a moving target how can they teach someone how it is done. They would have to understand the dynamic of timing, energy distribution and all those good things. If you are skilled and know these things then it is possible to learn from someone who is all theory and concept
but if you dont all you are learning is a complicated dance.
Like I always say you can learn all the fighting skills you want but if you cant take a strike then what good is it?
all things go hand in hand but amount of forms should not be an issue to legitmacy.
Cheers
Victor
lol sorry for all the grammar errors I was taught my writing skills from a evil teacher that did not desire to teach me the moral importance of grammar checking and spelling.
__________________
A good Sifu should be able to understand and relay concepts, theories,formulas and need skills that cover physical development, martial stratergy and the core of the system.
It should be a mote point if he/she have 1000 forms or 365 movements. In martial arts everyone will learn a system but will interpret diffrently due to body size, skill level, and desired outcome of learning the art.
If you have the core of the systems which are concpets, theory, techniques and stratery then there should be no arguement. To many people argue about how many forms are present and who is legit and not. If you move and fight as your system dictates or develop your system to your personal flavor then that is all the proof is needed.
To many people are out their collecting forms and are not truly developing their martial skill. Martial arts are combat arts and nothing more. If a teahcer has the inclination to help to student develop into a moral being that is their decision. If they choose no to than that is also their decision. To many people apply this spiritual, holy mystisim idea to the arts.
If the teacher is a evil man does this make his Gung fu any more inferior to the man who has attained enligtenment. When someone says that martial arts teaches discipline they negelect that this discipline is of neutral origin. Yes, you will develop dicipline over the body, over mentral concentration, of speed, and all that good stuff but it will not inheritanly make you a all around good guy.
I was once told a story that will stick with me for ever. I will tell it here and If I am not mistaken they are in Hsu's Sowrd polisher or Ying ming yangs books.
A gung fu teacher had a student who had trained with him for a long time. The sifu, one day, told the student to leave the school and to practice his skills for three years and then to return. The student left and trained diligently for three year and returned to his sifu. His form was still like the one his teacher taught him and resembeled the sifu's movement. The teacher saw this and said " leave and train for another three years and come back" The student left and trained for another three years, this time he found him self forgetting how the sifu moved and was losing his sifus flavor of movement. H returned home and perfomred yet again and the sifu told him to leave for another three years. He left and trained for three more years but his form no longer looked like his sifu's. this disheartened him but he returned to his teacher. He performed for his Sifu and he felt that he was horrible because he no longer moved like his sifu. The teacher smiled and said good you training is now complete.
Well if you read this and understand the moral I am proud if not here is the moral. Your Sifu only provides the key essentials to training and it is up to you to make it your own. Gung fu is not about mimicry! Take what you learn and make it your own and only then shall the gem of gung fu be your own.
The only time you should worry about learning from someone is when what they are teaching you are forms and forms alone. That is not Martial arts. Do not dilude yourself into thinking I will get the techniques sooner or later when my understanding is present. The proper use of techniques are important in learning the art and actual usage is paramount. The forms are nothing more than linked movements of the system and once you attain the core information you can create your own.
It matters not if a Sifu is a evil man, good man, arrogant, has ten forms or 100. All that matters is if he/she knows how to apply his skill and has the ability to convey their skills so that others can learn them.
I rather learn from a Sifu who can fight and has a evil heart than a Sifu who is of good heart and no skill. A teacher who has never been in a fight or touched hands with anyone has no real experience and knows nothing but theory,tech and concept. If someone has never thrown a punch and struck a moving target how can they teach someone how it is done. They would have to understand the dynamic of timing, energy distribution and all those good things. If you are skilled and know these things then it is possible to learn from someone who is all theory and concept
but if you dont all you are learning is a complicated dance.
Like I always say you can learn all the fighting skills you want but if you cant take a strike then what good is it?
all things go hand in hand but amount of forms should not be an issue to legitmacy.
Cheers
Victor
lol sorry for all the grammar errors I was taught my writing skills from a evil teacher that did not desire to teach me the moral importance of grammar checking and spelling.
__________________