grandmasters

[superman859]

today this asian girl told me her asian friend did all these martial arts(list of like 10 of them..karate aikido etc..)...believable....however, she goes on to say on his license or whatever he has with a list of all the things he does, it says he is grandmaster for this stuff too...he walked into our class when we were talking about it and she called him over and i was like grandmaster??? for what? and he said all of them...Now really...am I just missing something really big here and just really confused? Cuz as far as I know ever martial arts ive ever known you cant be grandmaster of any of them until tons and tons of your training and this kid is a junior in high school....And then from waht I know, for the belt systems its 9th degree and higher I believe(shaolin-do has 10 and 9th qualifies as grandmaster, but there can only be one 10th degree grandmaster...sin kwang the')...So, am I just missing something really big here or is this korean kid as completely full of sh*t as Im thinking...He said it in a serious tone like he wasnt joking and like he really believed he was, and since I am somewhat new to it all, I was like eh...not likely but I will look around..so I did, and you would think you would find his name listed somewhere but no....all the grandmasters I find are about 5 times his age, and it would make sense considering the amount of knowledge you must know in order to become that good..and for most grandmaster is the highest ranked belt so you would have to have had it passed on to you from the previous one...Jeet Kune Do was on the list too...I mean really...somethings just a tad bit suspicious here... Missing something or full of sh*t?

[richard sloan]

Bridge for Sale. Spectacular view of Manhattan skyline. Toll potential. Needs some TLC. Serious Inquiries only.

[joedoe]

And this situation surprises you why?

[superman859]

personally I was being serious about it. Might not have sounded that way, but I am seriously wondering. I don't know as much as most of you on this forum and am still learning in how the rankings work out. So when someone who looks like he knows what he is talking about says something, it makes me wonder because I am not entirely sure on the facts myself. I am still learning. Sorry if it appeared to be a random useless question just taking up forum space..I just wish just one person would just give a short reply letting me know if I am right about how grandmasters work out and that this kid couldnt possibly be one, or if there is a chance he could. I really don't know. I think I know, but im not as sure as sure can get.

[Vash]

Doesn't mean he knows sh!t about any of the systems.

I've got photoshop, anyone wanna be a master of their style?

[superman859]

yes yes I know just because he says stuff it doesnt mean he knows it. I am just wondering, is it even possible for a 17 year old kid to be grandmaster? From what I know, thats not true so he doesnt know what he is saying or he does and he is lying..am I right?

[joedoe]

Originally posted by superman859
yes yes I know just because he says stuff it doesnt mean he knows it. I am just wondering, is it even possible for a 17 year old kid to be grandmaster? From what I know, thats not true so he doesnt know what he is saying or he does and he is lying..am I right?

Yes you are right. It is highly unlikely that a 17 year old would hold the title of grandmaster.

[Vash]

Duh, Joedoe, I am grandmaster of the obvious! But, I'm not 17 anymore . . . ;)

[Scythefall]

It is absolutely impossible for a 17 year old to be a Grandmaster of anything. A Grandmaster is a title you generally see with lineage founders and leaders. They have established schools and are known to other lineages. Don't look at it as part of any ranking system at all. Whatever you do, don't fall for a title.

[Vash]

Only in terms of legitamecy. I once had a site bookmarked which was created by a 16 year old kid.

Seems this boy had a Shodan in Japanese Gojuryu, a green sash in Lau Gar kung fu, and about five years training in escrima. Dude decided, without his father's consent (this was a big point for the dud) that he was going to start his own family of martial art. It was pretty funny.

I'll search for the site, then post if I find one that's good.

[joedoe]

Originally posted by Scythefall
It is absolutely impossible for a 17 year old to be a Grandmaster of anything. A Grandmaster is a title you generally see with lineage founders and leaders. They have established schools and are known to other lineages. Don't look at it as part of any ranking system at all. Whatever you do, don't fall for a title.

I used the word unlikely because there may be one situation where it is kinda legit - if you are the lineage holder of a family style.

[Vash]

If the title falls to a kid that young,for the sake of the art, I hope the kid's been training since age 4.

[Shaolinlueb]

Originally posted by Vash
Doesn't mean he knows sh!t about any of the systems.

I've got photoshop, anyone wanna be a master of their style?

ooh ooh. make me master of luebstyle :cool:

[Scythefall]

Originally posted by Vash
If the title falls to a kid that young,for the sake of the art, I hope the kid's been training since age 4.

Still wouldn't help and I bet the lineage would fall apart. Kids and Teens can have amazing skill, but age and experience bring wisdom and senior students know this. I can't imagine Sifus with 30 years experience acknowledging a teen as their Grandmaster. I could certainly see the Sifus taking him under wing and making sure that he ascends to Grandmaster, though. But that kid isn't going to be in public school with a Grandmaster business card..lol:)

[Okinawan_Lohan]

Indeed. It's a shame, too. I've always wanted to found my own art (or at least find it) ;)

[superman859]

Thats what im saying...its just completely crazy.. Today he brought the card in..It had date of birth(1986) and listed a long list of stuff like martial arts and pressure point training, etc...Then under status, it said "Grand Master"...yet I still refuse to acknowledge that..haha cant be...for one I looked up grand masters of other stuff and I really didnt see him at all...haha and then in our school newspaper today there was a quote for his new years resolution and it was "Win a Kumate tournament..." I dont think he would have much trouble doing that if he was truely grand master...

[Scythefall]

Originally posted by Okinawan_Lohan
Indeed. It's a shame, too. I've always wanted to found my own art (or at least find it) ;)

Really? Do you get to see masters and grandmasters in action very often? I've never felt that I was on the same level as any of the true Sifus I've seen. I've seen schools that are "practicality" based and I've felt like I could mop up the instructors and class, but really, I just stay away from them. There are people there trying to find their way and for all I know, that might be their's. They may not want to do a Shaolin form, but maybe just learn a little sport martial art that helps them get moving.

Why do you want to found a style? You that good?

[Okinawan_Lohan]

Originally posted by Scythefall
Why do you want to found a style? You that good?

No, not really. Just thought'd be funny to say.

As for working with grandmasters, not really. I've kept the bulk of my study under Sensei Advincula, who is considered to be one of the most knowledgeable practitioners of Okinawan karate, and Isshinryu in particular.

Also, as for my being that good, not really. I've some ideas which go against those of my instructors, but not something which would create a whole new style.

[stimulant]

I'm not so sure about japanese systems, but in traditional chinese systems, you can only be a master if you were first a disciple of a master, and grandmasters (a name, as far as I am aware, invented by the west) are the heir to the systems.

but at 17?? hmmmm

[Okinawan_Lohan]

For the Okinawan systems, the basic idea, as I understand it, is around 5th or 6th degree black, one is a master of the style, whereas a grandmaster is anyone who has a student attain the master level.

The Japanese Karate, Aiki, and associated arts rank around the same premise, I believe.

Should Okinawan arts taught outside of Japan contain the Japanese associations and cultures? Well, I believe that's a dead issue.

[Okami]

Punch this kid in the mouth and see if he shows you any "grandmaster" techniques.

[Shaolinlueb]

Originally posted by Okami
Punch this kid in the mouth and see if he shows you any "grandmaster" techniques.


werd. he should have seen it coming 5 seconds ago.

[superman859]

haha yea ive thought about it...but I dont really know him and he is asian. I do have a theory that all asians can beat me up. It generally comes true. Whether from training or natural talent, they all fight pretty good. So I would be scared to punch him in the mouth...haha. Maybe a little later on when I hit grandmaster myself...ha...im just aiming for black belt, then I'll think about the rest after that. My sparring is really weak. I just can do the forms and everything pretty good and learn them quickly when they teach them, but my sparring is horrible which doesnt do me a whole lot of good. I dont think quick enough or had enough practice with sparring.

But another thing that would agree with me...coming from the whole punch him in the mouth/he shouldve seen it 5 seconds ago thing...He wants to win a kumate tournament(it was written somewhere at school) this new year and really...grandmasters should do quite well in tournaments I would think...they shouldnt get the crap beat out of them at least...

[Okinawan_Lohan]

It doesn't really matter whether this child is truly a grandmaster of the arts he claims/has documentation on. His experience, or lack thereof, will more than distinguish him from the true high-level practitioners of his art.

[Brad]

personally I was being serious about it. Might not have sounded that way, but I am seriously wondering. I don't know as much as most of you on this forum and am still learning in how the rankings work out. So when someone who looks like he knows what he is talking about says something, it makes me wonder because I am not entirely sure on the facts myself. I am still learning. Sorry if it appeared to be a random useless question just taking up forum space..I just wish just one person would just give a short reply letting me know if I am right about how grandmasters work out and that this kid couldnt possibly be one, or if there is a chance he could. I really don't know. I think I know, but im not as sure as sure can get.
As far as Chinese systems go, there is no standardized ranking system. Some have adopted Japanese style ranking systems for comercial purposes(or to better keep track of what you taught whom), so belt/sash ranks are a very modern addition, esp. when it comes to Chinese styles. Grandmaster is pretty much an american term as far as I know. Usually it's used for someone who's the head of an organization/system. Like Chan Pui is grandmaster of the Wah Lum mantis system. Also it's sometimes used for comercial purposes by those who've been in martial arts for a very very long time. For example, my teacher has "Grandmaster" printed on some of his advertising material, but not being able to speak English, the words don't have much meaning to him :p We just call him laoshi, sifu, or professor(he used to teach in universities).

Anyway, if this kid likes to pretend he's a grandmaster, then he's probably got some serious self esteem problems and looking down on him probably won't do much good.

[Shaolin-Drunk]

Are you sure that card isn't one of them Pokeman cards???

[superman859]

lol I donno. I have never seen a martial arts card cuz I dont have one. His was like fat type of material..and hard. and had a list of stuff trained in and birthday and status and name and probably other stuff...lol who knows.