Another reason I don't post at Bullshido.

[SifuAbel]

I was curious as what drivel was spewing over there so I took a quick look and found this gem from our old buddy ballonknot.

Animal Styles Kung Foooey
http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=8419

Discuss.........

[Ikken Hisatsu]

one of the guys on there is right though, fights in the end turn into a mix of kickboxing and grappling. I have NEVER seen an animal style used effectively in a fight, except in tekken, and I dont think that counts. when I refer to animal styles im saying monkey style, tiger stance etc not things like cat stance which is used in pretty much all MA and is just putting all your weight on the back leg, and animal names for moves (although I think they are pretty ridiculous as well)

[MasterKiller]

I've seen people spar effectively using Mantis at Taiji Legacy. Of course, that was not really fighting, but they were pretty d@mn effective and it looked like Mantis.

[Golden Arms]

Throwing a fu jow to the face or a Tiger Tail kick are both just as easy as doing a straight punch or jab, and a side kick...dont see the problem..maybe if the vast majority of people that do animal styles trained enough to make it their natural reaction instead of something they 'do' it would be different for them. Regardless, it works for me just fine..if it doesnt work for others..good, they wont expect it :)

[SifuAbel]

I don't know any animal names for moves. We didn't use the old descriptives. What is the animal name of a punch?

Don't knock the monkey. The Paulie zink monkey might be goofy, but the actual monkey is brutal and powerful. Its about ground and pound. The more I read, the more its clear people only have zink and wushu in mind.

Cat stance is only stupid if you just sit there and wait in it. To me its just a transition. All stances are just transitions.

Its also clear people are only seeing the the most superficial cosmetic surface and not seeing deeper into its substance.

"They've never seen........"

Why should they ? Do they hang out with Kung fu people?

Mother: Did you do your homework?
child: Yes.
Mother: Well, I didn't see you do it.
child: Thats cause you just got home.
Mother: Thats no excuse.
child: Here.
Mother: Is this todays homework?
child: It is dated today.
Mother: Don't sass me.

[CaptinPickAxe]

did you see the fetus style? WTF is fetus style?

[Archangel]

I've used a Donkey punch before :D

[Becca]

Originally posted by CaptinPickAxe
did you see the fetus style? WTF is fetus style?
C'mon. Use your imagination, Pick.


Cat stance is only stupid if you just sit there and wait in it. To me its just a transition. All stances are just transitions.
Agreed. Suck back into cat to avoid a kick. Sets one up well to launch the counter strike.

And I like lurking at Bulshido when I'm in a bad mood. I'm garanteed to get a good lauph.:D

[CaptinPickAxe]

imagination...okay

I think Fetus style is lying on the ground in the fetal position with your eyes closed. Feeding off of your opponents digested food and lifeblood. And when the time comes for you to leave you make a dramatic exit with a slap to the butt and a whole lot of crying.

[Gangsterfist]

Obviously these guys have never sparred someone who practices animal boxing. I for one have not trained any animal style for long periods of time. I am lucky enough to know people who have and can actually use it in combat if needed. They are not masters but know enough to use it. Venemous snake style is deadly, striking vital and death areas of the body, like the throat and eyes. White crane, the crane's beak is designed for the same purpose and is very useful for plucking out people's eye balls. Tiger style, hmm any style that practices ripping the flesh off your opponet, naw thats just stupid and inaffective. I personally have met a tiger boxer, and he told me a story of fighting for his life when someone tried mugging him. He basically ripped his assailants face off. Don't know about you guys but if somoene ripped my face off, and i was still conscience, I would probably fall down the fetal position and start crying or run away. In the wild it is totally survival of the fittest. Mocking animals movements is mocking them dealing death blows to their prey. Does a tiger grapple its prey (heh thats probably really debateable)? No it mauls it, bites it, gouges it, and forces it to the ground crushing and killing it. I can totally see where this guy says animal boxing is 99% crap.

My sifu knows monkey boxing, and its really hard to fight against. For one, its not that common so you get tricked easily. Don't fully on engage a monkey boxer they will climb up whatever limb you throw at them, breaking it, striking you, biting you, gouging you, and take you to the ground.

[GeneChing]

I reported on that style in our Nov 99 issue (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=103). It was told to me by Shaolin Monk Shi Yanming, who demostrated in the photos. I asked him several times for clarification. In later research, I've come to beleive that what Yanming calls 'fetus' style is in fact what I called 'emu' style in that article. Both word sound similar in Chinese tai xing and you can see a similarity in the poses adopted by both Yanming doing 'fetus' and Wing Lam doing 'emu'. I suspect that like many things in CMA, there was a distortion in the transmission somewhere and somebody wrote down fetus instead of emu. The actual technique reminds me of the double door jam fists of Hung Gar.

[anton]

Originally posted by GeneChing
'emu' style in that article. Both word sound similar in Chinese tai xing and you can see a similarity in the poses adopted by both Yanming doing 'fetus' and Wing Lam doing 'emu'. I suspect that like many things in CMA, there was a distortion in the transmission somewhere and somebody wrote down fetus instead of emu. The actual technique reminds me of the double door jam fists of Hung Gar.

How old id this style? I thought emus were only native to australia.

[Ben Gash]

I use all 5 animals when I fight. It's a training issue more than a style thing.

[Ikken Hisatsu]

gangsterfist- you're saying these people train to pop eyes out and tear faces off? please. you're the exact reason why they have sites like bullshido.

[old jong]

There is a lot of "Clam" and "Beef" in MMA! So what do they have against animals?...:rolleyes: ;)

[Felipe Bido]

Originally posted by anton


How old id this style? I thought emus were only native to australia

Tai Xing has been translated as Phoenix, Ostrich, and Wedge-Tailed Hawk. Today is the first time that I hear the term 'Emu' applied to that form. It's good to learn something everyday.

[old jong]

Is there a "duck" style ?....:)

[Xdr4g0nx]

i don't know about the style but we do have a Mandarine Duck kick. I was told mandarine ducks always travel in twos so when we do the kick we kick with the back foot then the front in one hop. kinda hard to explain...:rolleyes: but we do have it, i study HK mantis.

[Gangsterfist]

sorry my sarcasm is really dry sometimes, and I forgot that I am not speaking to you but posting on a forum.

Animal boxing, like any style, will be effective if you train hard and use it wisely.

[GeneChing]

Seriously. There is traditional duck. Modern duck too. There are even duck razors (http://store.yahoo.com/martialartsmart/45-78.html). CMA is funny that way - very exotic. It's what makes it so fun. I've even heard tell of a flea style. Seriously.

As for the Emu, that was my own spin on Ostrich. I like the word Emu better than Ostrich, and they are the same bird, more or less, at least in martial terms. I like the word Rhea too, but the temptation to call it Dire would be too great. China did have trade with Austrailia for centuries - they've had trade with Africa fro centuries - so they might have been exposed to an actual Emu. There's another theory that postulates that the Tai Xing is entirely mythical. Who knows? In an overview piece of weird animal styles, that bit of trivia didn't seem worth pursuing.

[Felipe Bido]

Originally posted by Xdr4g0nx
i don't know about the style but we do have a Mandarine Duck kick. I was told mandarine ducks always travel in twos so when we do the kick we kick with the back foot then the front in one hop. kinda hard to explain...:rolleyes: but we do have it, i study HK mantis.


There's a family style of Xingyi (From the Shanxi branch) that has a Mandarin Duck Kicks style

[joedoe]

Originally posted by GeneChing
Seriously. There is traditional duck. Modern duck too. There are even duck razors (http://store.yahoo.com/martialartsmart/45-78.html). CMA is funny that way - very exotic. It's what makes it so fun. I've even heard tell of a flea style. Seriously.

As for the Emu, that was my own spin on Ostrich. I like the word Emu better than Ostrich, and they are the same bird, more or less, at least in martial terms. I like the word Rhea too, but the temptation to call it Dire would be too great. China did have trade with Austrailia for centuries - they've had trade with Africa fro centuries - so they might have been exposed to an actual Emu. There's another theory that postulates that the Tai Xing is entirely mythical. Who knows? In an overview piece of weird animal styles, that bit of trivia didn't seem worth pursuing.

The emu and the ostrich are actually quite different, but anyway :)

[Becca]

Originally posted by CaptinPickAxe
imagination...okay

I think Fetus style is lying on the ground in the fetal position with your eyes closed. Feeding off of your opponents digested food and lifeblood. And when the time comes for you to leave you make a dramatic exit with a slap to the butt and a whole lot of crying.

I was thinking more along the lines of rolling around holding your stomach, crying for mommy 'cause you tried that scorpion style.;) :D

[lkfmdc]

but is there a style based upon Duck Dodgers in the 21st and 3/4 century?

[old jong]

...The tough guy...."You want to duck with me?" :p

[GeneChing]

What about the Rhea?

[Former castleva]

That´s patently bizarre IMHO but they ought to come up with cassowary style by now.Not that there´s anything that you can get out of it but hey...
They would have the paleognathae covered up,pretty much. :rolleyes:


What about the Rhea?

http://www.bartleby.com/65/rh/rhea.html

[joedoe]

Originally posted by GeneChing
What about the Rhea?

I don't know much about them, but they appear to be closer to a cassowary than an emu. Emus are mostly harmless unless you **** them off, then they just peck at you. Now the cassowary is a dangerous bird - claws sharp enough to cut a man open and a huge kick to back it up.

[cho]

Originally posted by old jong
Is there a "duck" style ?....:)
yes
It's featured in a video/DVD/VCD called "This is Kung Fu". It's a documentary about CMA from Shaolin to Wudan to Emei to etc. It's got Jet Li on the cover. There's also some footage of really young Jet Li.

The film also showed a 'dog style'. The guy looks like he's break dancing. And it says the 'dog ****ing' move is a groin attack.

[SifuAbel]

How the HELL did this turn into a duck style thread.

I'm calling my lawyer.

[GeneChing]

That's one of my favorite Kung Fu moves ever. In fact, if you bother to go back to that original article I wrote on exotic animals, you'll see a pic of Shi Yanming doing that 'dog makes water' pose. He's on all fours, doggy style, with one leg lifted. And you though scorpion was funny. Duck is even funnier. It waddles. Seriously, the focus is all on leg work, this weird Chuck Berry-like strut.

Anyone got a pic of a Cassowary? I've never even heard of that one. I figured I was being clever just konwing about Rheas...

[anton]

Originally posted by GeneChing
Anyone got a pic of a Cassowary? I've never even heard of that one. I figured I was being clever just konwing about Rheas...

Its another Australian bird http://images.google.com.au/images?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=cassowary

[jun_erh]

on the "natural boxing" vcd they do a drill where he does the duck steps whilst punching. It's really hard to do and probably builds up leg strength. My 1 year old niece thinks it looks very funny and she is right.

[old jong]

Talking about strange animals...What about "pig style"?...;) I heard their favorite weapon is the "chop"!...;)

[Chinwoo-er]

~slowly and cautiously backs away from this thread~

[old jong]

I tried but I can't! :eek:

[David Jamieson]

when a person takes what is symbolic and attempts to manifest it in a literal sense, they fall victim to their own stupidity.

animal styles are "symbolic" not literal transformations of the human form.

Traits that are seen in animals are "borrowed", IE: fierceness, entraping, circling, lunging, jumping, pounding etc etc etc. as seen in the animal realm, transposed to the human form.

To think one is a tiger will aid in developing only the persons perception of what they think a tiger is. It is not a truth.

So, you see where the problem lies with religious thinking now.
lol, there are no answers that you don't already have, and you're not getting anymore until you come up with them yourself!

cheers

p.s SA- the homework story was good. :D made me larf, smart @ss kid

[SifuAbel]

:D

Blame the mother too.

[backbreaker]

Bullshido sucks without the strangler. Reading those posts was like watching Jerry Springer

[GeneChing]

OK I got one on pig. I've never heard of a pig style specifically, buuuuut, some styles fight with rake, and that rake is almost always attributed to Piggy of Journey to the West, the classic novel of the Monkey King. As you know, the monkey king fought with staff, so there's a lot of monkey staff forms in CMA. But there are also Piggy rakes. These are usually nine-pointed, since Piggy's rake was nine-pointed.

I love CMA. We fight with anything. And if you know enough about it, you can find all sorts of animals. Try give me another.... :p

[MasterKiller]

Gene,
What about tick style?

[GeneChing]

... do you all remember Marc Saltzman? He wrote Iron & Silk and starred in the movie made from his book. He was a student of GM Pan Qingfu (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=109). Anyway, he married Jessica Yu, an Academy Award winner filmaker who I used to fence with. I used to arm her mom, Connie Yu, who was also a nationally-ranked fencer. So I've met Marc, when he came by the sword shop (http://www.amfence.com) that I used to work at, and he once told me that he witnessed a flea style. He described it as some old guy with really buggy glasses, and in the guys form, he hopped about like a flea. That's the closest I can get to tick at this time.

[old jong]

Is there a skunk style?...

[joedoe]

Originally posted by GeneChing
OK I got one on pig. I've never heard of a pig style specifically, buuuuut, some styles fight with rake, and that rake is almost always attributed to Piggy of Journey to the West, the classic novel of the Monkey King. As you know, the monkey king fought with staff, so there's a lot of monkey staff forms in CMA. But there are also Piggy rakes. These are usually nine-pointed, since Piggy's rake was nine-pointed.

I love CMA. We fight with anything. And if you know enough about it, you can find all sorts of animals. Try give me another.... :p

I know a rake form. Very nice weapon.

[SifuAbel]

This is why i like KFM. You can go from talking about numbskulls to talking about fleas all in the same thread.

[GeneChing]

I don't know of any skunk style per se, but I've heard some stories about fighters who use odor as a weapon. Here goes.

Probably the most relevent was from Deng Ming-Dao's Chronicles of Tao. In one of the chapters he talks about a duel his master fought with someone who ate a special diet of garlic and eggs to develop rather noxious ****s. True or not? Hard to say, but it's a hilarious read.

Another one was from some of the writings of William S. Burroughs. I used to have some book tapes of him reading his work (what a great gritty voice!) There were two stories that I remember but I can't remember what the exact citation was. One story involved someone who again ate a special diet to develop noxious breath. That was in a series of anecdotes about various exotic fighting styles. The other was about an outlaw gang in the old west being formed where the leader had his gang members roll in a rotting horse carcass so they would all "stink of death". Even though these were fiction, they were memorable and worth mention here, just to keep this thread going.

The last I can think of would be one of Japan's greatest swordsmen, Miyamoto Musashi. According to legend, he was once attacked in a bath house, after which he didn't bath regularly and maintained an unkept appearence. It was shocking for samurai of the time, but certainly added to his legend.

I can tell you from personal experience working in drug rehab that stinky people are very difficult to deal with. Plus I'm sure we've all had the experience of having to spar someone who didn't wash his uniform regularly. Tha's just plain rude.

Skunk Fu. Another style that would probably be pretty effective on the street, but not worth pursuing and should definately be discouraged.

[old jong]

What about the drunken camel style?...

[Goldenmane]

Emus are mostly harmless unless you **** them off, then they just peck at you.

Sorry joe, but I have to beg to differ. I have friends and relatives who run emu on their farms, and those bastich birds are evil. They have a liking for kicking at you, and are not averse at all to going for your eyes or soft under-parts.

Mind you, the toughest bird in the world is the willy-wagtail. :)

[Gangsterfist]

I have always wondered if there was a turtle style. I have seen some pictures here and there of martial artists who have their body hunched over and their back looks like a turtle shell. Reminds me of how the teenage mutant ninja turtles look. The only point I would see to this is the roll muscle tissue over your vitals in your front torso region, maybe???

[FatherDog]

Originally posted by GeneChing
Another one was from some of the writings of William S. Burroughs. I used to have some book tapes of him reading his work (what a great gritty voice!) There were two stories that I remember but I can't remember what the exact citation was. One story involved someone who again ate a special diet to develop noxious breath. That was in a series of anecdotes about various exotic fighting styles. The other was about an outlaw gang in the old west being formed where the leader had his gang members roll in a rotting horse carcass so they would all "stink of death". Even though these were fiction, they were memorable and worth mention here, just to keep this thread going.

Both these stories are in The Place of Dead Roads.

[GeneChing]

Thanks Father Dog! I never read it, just listened to the readings. I'll have to check it out. I love those readings. What a voice Burroughs is.

Drunken Camel is a bit too specific. However I'm at a loss to think of any camel styles. Let me think about that one for a while.

As for turtle, there's a lot of turtle references in qigong. The rounded back/hoolowed chest posture of many internal styles and qigong is often called "turtle back" gui bei . There's a nice poetry to this, since the Chinese venerate turtles and spiritual animals. I did see some footage of an alleged turtle style - lord know where - it was something from mainland China, one of those many documentary thingys. The style involved crouching in a humpbacked posture and flipping your arms and hands like turtle fins/feet for some kind of odd blocking move.

[Bluesman]

Originally posted by lkfmdc
but is there a style based upon Duck Dodgers in the 21st and 3/4 century?

I could have been some body if it was not for Looney Tunes and the rest being on everyday when I got home from school.;)
Today's kids have all the crap stuff, cow and chicken, ed edd and eddie etc....

[GeneChing]

I got the premeire collection of Looney Tunes on DVD for my kid. Really. It's for the kid. She loves the part where Daffy (as Robin Hood) tries to impress Porky (as Friar Tuck) with his quarterstaff work. Now there's some great looney tunes martial arts. :cool: Like I always say, you can learn from anything. Mostly, you can learn what NOT to do...

[Meat Shake]

Looney toons are awesome. Ed edd and eddie is fantastic. Whoever does the sound effects for that cartoon is a ****ed genious.