Why SLT uses a"STILL" Platform?

[Phenix]

1, Why SLT uses a"STILL" Platform instead of a moving platform?

2, What is the key purpose of STILL PLatform for SLT?

3, What is the different between a Still platform based art compare with a move platform based art?


4, What is the different between the SLT and Hung Gar's Iron Wire Set?


5, Will a look a like in "shape" technic function the same in a still and moving platform art?

6, How is a Still platform art Issue energy?



7, Is the concept of Zee Mo Kiu Zhong or center line return to center is the most critical key of SLT or how many kiu sau one knows?


8, where Is the term and concept of Zee Moo Kiu Zhong of SLT from?





What do you think ? Care to share?

[anerlich]

1. My Sifu doesn't teach SLT from a "still" platform. If you mean "without footwork", it is presumably to instill basic structure and principles without adding the "confusion" of footwork in as well, making the goals of the form easier to achieve. My Sifu Doesn't each SLT without footwork either.

2. See 1.

3. One is still, the other isn't.

4. Can't help you here.

5. Depends on the particular technique and circumstnces, I think, though on balance I'd say no.

6. From Stillness, I imagine.

7. Loaded question, I think.

8. I could care less where it's from, more if it works or not.

[yylee]

be still, feel yourself (sensitivity), not so many "Nim Tau".

[Phenix]

Anerlich, YYLee,

Thank you.



I would also love to heard the answer of these questions from those who believe SLT is equavalent from other set of other style of martial art.

[Ultimatewingchun]

Phenix:

The still platform used in SLT serves many purposes, IMO. I will name some of them:

It develops a balanced, stable and rooted stance (which, amoung other things, will develop the ability to draw power from the ground)...

It gives the student the opportunity to really focus on the hand and arm movements contained in the form without the distraction of footwork...

It focuses the attention upon the centerline and the gates - such a major part of wing chun...

But most of all...it provides the opportunity for a strong concentration upon learning how to bring one's energy (chi) out to the arm, elbow, forearm, hand, fingers, etc...

by use of a certain relaxed but alert conscious "flow" of thought and visualization of the inner energy (chi) moving inside the body...as an intermediate...as a beginner the student is just being taught to relax while in motion...

and as an advanced practitioner...the "conscious" aspect of thought and visualization disappears - but the reality of inner chi movement continues.

And, as Andrew Nerlich pointed out...in TWC anyway...there is an advanced version of SLT that does contain some footwork.

I have seen a video of the HFY SLT that also contains some similar footwork.

[Gangsterfist]

I wish to add that it helps one learn to relax when practicing. One thing many westerns have a problem with is tension. We keep too much of it in our lower back and shoulders. The SLT helps develope a good posture with out using tension. Which is a real important thing if you want to have good energy flow. Tension not only telegraphs movement, is wasting energy, and slow down your movements; it also blocks blood flow and circulation making it harder for blood to work through your body. Thus blocking energy flow (or chi if want to call it that).

[Ironwind]

Maybe since the style was made by a woman, stillness come from saving and conserving energy.
I imagine you do use deflections alot and move the hips often.
You dont have to dance your butt around to kick one.

[KPM]

Hi Hendrick!

I think you may have not gotten a lot of responses because some of your questions are unclear and some people may not understand what you are asking for..


1, Why SLT uses a"STILL" Platform instead of a moving platform?

---To build the foundation. One must crawl before they walk, walk before they run. The still platform of SLT builds the infrastructure of WCK. THe addition of moving with footwork later on simply adds to what is developed thru SLT. It doesn't change it.

2, What is the key purpose of STILL PLatform for SLT?

---Isn't this the same question as #1?

3, What is the different between a Still platform based art compare with a move platform based art?

---A moving platform based art may not have a solid infrastructure as a starting point. Rather than footwork being logical variations of the foundation structure, they may have footwork patterns totally unrelated to each other and that fail to make up a cohesive whole.


4, What is the different between the SLT and Hung Gar's Iron Wire Set?

---Sorry, don't know Hung Ga's Iron Wire Set. But from what I have heard, isn't this a dynamic tension set similar to Karate's Sanchin? If so, this hard tension would be a very big difference as compared to SLT's relaxed development.

5, Will a look a like in "shape" technic function the same in a still and moving platform art?

---I don't understand this question. For WCK, techniques learned in the still platform of SLT do not change when you start moving. But perhpas you are asking if a technique from WCK compared to a very similar technique in a different art will function similarly? I think yes...if they have the same purpose/application. Will they have a different energy? I think no....they will have different "engines."

6, How is a Still platform art Issue energy?

---Through the whole body, not just the arms or not just the legs, or even just the arms and legs together. A still platform art must learn to express energy with the whole body.



7, Is the concept of Zee Mo Kiu Zhong or center line return to center is the most critical key of SLT or how many kiu sau one knows?

---I think how many kiu sau one knows is rather trivial and irrelevent.


8, where Is the term and concept of Zee Moo Kiu Zhong of SLT from?

---You tell me. You're the historian! :-)

Keith

[Phenix]

Victor, KPM,


Thanks.



I think you may have not gotten a lot of responses because some of your questions are unclear and some people may not understand what you are asking for..--------K

you could be right. And the questions might also be too subtle for some.

I hope those who believe in Weng Chun set is equavalent to SLT or have connection with wing chun also give thier view on this questions.

So, we can see how things are view and what is the result from the different training of the sets.




2, What is the key purpose of STILL PLatform for SLT?

---Isn't this the same question as #1?

There might be lots of reason but with one or more then one key purpose.






4, What is the different between the SLT and Hung Gar's Iron Wire Set?

---Sorry, don't know Hung Ga's Iron Wire Set. But from what I have heard, isn't this a dynamic tension set similar to Karate's Sanchin? If so, this hard tension would be a very big difference as compared to SLT's relaxed development.-----K


Sanchin is different to Iron Wire also. In my understanding.




You're the historian!-------K

Nope. not historian but archeologist. :D

[PaulH]

Just a blind shot in the dark. It would be a gross oversimplification to approach fighting subject by just energy and matter alone (E=MC^2). One must deal with mind and the fascinating topic of mind over matter in all living things. The still platform can be viewed as an old attempt to bring the practitioner into more awareness of his body and thus also the subtle energy that some people like Chu Chong Tin call mind force operating within itself. The result if true is something of a legend "ecce h-omo".

Regards,
PH

P.S. Okay Hendrik, I spill my "beanies". Regarding to the question of "Centerline return to center", I have a nagging suspicion it has somethings to do with "mind, body, spirit unified" in that X place marked "center". Can you spill a little of your beans on this cryptic phrase? Ha! Ha!

[Phenix]

Pual,

Top secret :D
SLT means Curiously investigate minuete details to master the natural's big picture. or the mother of creation.:D

It is no fun to seperately talk about only mind, move, time, space... linearly...... those are just a linear or vertical thinking pattern with lots of boundary limitation. Not THE natural but just linear model from some angle. Nature is much much wide then those type of thinking patern.
oftern one couldnt even make use of those small pice scatering here and there.If stick with those kind of rigid thinking pattern.


when every parts of the music put together naturally not idealisticly with non linearlity.., and become a vast symphony and one ride on top of the wave of the symphony within the silence. then, only then the beauty and life shown.

[Phenix]

Originally posted by PaulH


P.S. Okay Hendrik, I spill my "beanies". Regarding to the question of "Centerline return to center", I have a nagging suspicion it has somethings to do with "mind, body, spirit unified" in that X place marked "center". Can you spill a little of your beans on this cryptic phrase? Ha! Ha!


That is the one core concept, a top secrete. one component of the mother of creation. one of The core reason seperate Wing Chun to others Shao Lin art or CMA .
And, if this concept being reveal, all will make sense. See, this is more a Chinese concept not that much a Buddhist one.

WingChun/SLT inherit this from the White Crane Weng Chun of Fujian. Notice, this Weng Chun is not the Jee Sim Weng Chun.


BTW, it is not cryptic at all. One always need a vocabulary to communicate a different concept.

[PaulH]

You know I never quite figure out the secret of how crane or stork deliver the cute little babies in our popular folklore. But I'm all ear if you have an earful of this "secret"? Ha! Ha!

[Phil Redmond]

Siu (small)
Nihm (idea/thought)
Tau (head)
Small details in head.

[Gangsterfist]

Siu also means effecient, compact, economical

[yylee]

"Tau" literally means the head, it also has the connotation of being the leading party as in "Dai(lead) Tau" or a beginning as in "Hou(open) Tau".

I think Buddhist have spent volumes and volumes of literatures or sutras that talk about "Nim" and different kinds of "Nim". Even the word "Chum" as in Chum Kiu is a specific Buddhist term.

[Phenix]

YY,

Ya to be right is to be in the TOMB. :D

To be qouting DAO is to be rigid like TOMB STONE. :D

[yylee]

Originally posted by Phenix
To be qouting DAO is to be rigid like TOMB STONE. :D

DAO? Direct Access to Oracle? :D We shall pay her (Oracle) a visit to consult about this year's fortune :D

[Keng Geng]

1, Why SLT uses a"STILL" Platform instead of a moving platform?
First understand structure, then move structure.

2, What is the key purpose of STILL PLatform for SLT?
Understand most basic and important concept of all martial art.

3, What is the different between a Still platform based art compare with a move platform based art?
Still platform based art - no such thing.
Move platform based art - all martial arts.


4, What is the different between the SLT and Hung Gar's Iron Wire Set?
Beginner Siu Lim Tao (most common) is more comparable to Hung Gar's Kil Sau form. Advanced Siu Lim Tao (not seen) is comparable to Iron Thread form.


5, Will a look a like in "shape" technic function the same in a still and moving platform art?
The basic structure of technique, yes.

6, How is a Still platform art Issue energy?
By moving and breathing.

7, Is the concept of Zee Mo Kiu Zhong or center line return to center is the most critical key of SLT or how many kiu sau one knows?
Most important - clear the centre.


8, where Is the term and concept of Zee Moo Kiu Zhong of SLT from?
Shaolin.

[redtornado]

To fing the center, and Gates, It's the fondation!!! Wing Chun !! There is alot of books out now! I have been to my public libray and foung alot of great books!!!! :D :D ;) :) :cool: :p

[Phenix]

Keng Geng

Great , thanks

[joy chaudhuri]

Phoenix sez:
Keng Geng

Great , thanks
----------------------------
Ditto

Joy

[Phenix]

Where is our HFY team and JeeSim WengChun friends?

Please dont be shy to contribute your view.

[Gangsterfist]

HFY does not train the yeejeekujeema (clamping horse goat stance) do they? They keep their feet pointed straight out correct? They also have different foot work than most other lineages?

I could be wrong but that is what I read I believe.

[Phenix]

Originally posted by Gangsterfist
HFY does not train the yeejeekujeema (clamping horse goat stance) do they? They keep their feet pointed straight out correct? They also have different foot work than most other lineages?

I could be wrong but that is what I read I believe.


I like to invite the HFY and JeeSim friends here to give thier view in these technical issues. So, they can speak freely on what is thier technical answers for the above questions.