What is "real" Choy Lee Fut???

[SifuX-HSK]

the recent discussions have led me to this question for you guys.

"What is real Choy Lee Fut?"

how would you describe real choy lee fut. what makes it "real" choy lee fut?

think about this one.......what is a choy lee fut fighter? think deep now!

frank

[travelsbyknight]

Choy li fut is...

The mastery of the high and the low, the long and the short, internal and external. And on top of all that you have to three million forms.



What I just described COULD be real choy li fut....and it could also be every other friggin kung fu style on the planet.

cheerio.

[extrajoseph]

Originally posted by SifuX-HSK
the recent discussions have led me to this question for you guys.

"What is real Choy Lee Fut?"

how would you describe real choy lee fut. what makes it "real" choy lee fut?

think about this one.......what is a choy lee fut fighter? think deep now!

frank


Hi Frank,

If by "real" you mean authentic or genuine, then Chan Heung's CLF would came from Chan Heung's lineage, Cheung Ah Yim's CLF would came from Cheung Ah Yim's lineage and Bak Sing CLF would came form Tam Sarm's lineage. If you can trace your lineage then it is "real".

If by "real" you mean a good CLF fighter, then not every student of these different branches can make a good fighter, or one lineage is inherently better than another, it all depends on the individual and not the branch.

If by "real" you mean the essential characteristics of CLF, then you should know by now, you have been at it long enough. If you cannot tell the different between say, CLF and Wing Chun, or CLF and Hung Ga, or CLF and Bak Mei and so forth, then I suggest you should find another teacher or even another lineage to get real.

JX

[anton]

Originally posted by extrajoseph


If by "real" you mean the essential characteristics of CLF, then you should know by now, you have been at it long enough. If you cannot tell the different between say, CLF and Wing Chun, or CLF and Hung Ga, or CLF and Bak Mei and so forth, then I suggest you should find another teacher or even another lineage to get real.

JX

I think this is what he means, and I think its a legitimate question. Of course people can tell the difference... but can you express it in words? What is it that makes CLF unique?

[extrajoseph]

Anton,

If you can see the difference, then you should be able to express it in words, you don't need me to tell you. Mind you, what you can see (or what you considered to be unique) depends on your level of understanding of what is real CLF.

JX

[HungMoJue]

I suppose that if Chan Heung is considered the founder then ANY lineage connected to him is real. The fact that some lineages might be carried down by great grandsons, or whatever bearing Chan's surname doesn't really mean it's any more legit. Yang Cheng-Fu's Tai Chi is not the same as Yang Lu-Chuan's Tai Chi, and some claim that Yang Ban-Hou's Tai Chi is closer,it seems that everyone with the surname Yang has a different version.. Then again, what of Chen family Tai-Chi? Wu style is legit. Sun style is legit. What does it all mean? The same goes for Wing Chun, Wing Tsun, Weng Chun, etc,This guy's Bak Mei, that guy's Bak mei, this guy's Southern Mantis, that guys' Southern mantis, and Lam Sai-Wing/Tang Fung, and all the branches derived from such.
If you are doing the main components/characteristics/techniques,forms,sum fat of the style then it's real. If you want to bicker and talk bull**** to and about each other, stay in your respective playpens-ya babies!
If I ****ed any of you off, tough sh**. Deal with it. Why don't you spend your time more constructively and share your arts, and put it out there, so it doesn't fall by the wayside. That is what's important, the rest is just Like men with breasts-useless.
-The Last Emperor

[HungMoJue]

Hey, I also realized.. there's another school of thought...there are some CLF guys that are real nasty fighters talkin smack aboiut everyone else's CLF yadda-yadda. I also recall from my childhood that there was this guy who insisted that Batman could beat up Spiderman. I dissagreed with him and as a result, got my arse kicked. From then on, Batman could definately beat up Spiderman! Might is right. Fact is, if he said, Archie could beat up Spiderman, he would also be right. It's all crap.

[Arhat of Fury]

I think what makes CLF real is understanding and apllying the core principals.
Power generation, attacking angles and using the proper fist for the proper strike.

Sure anyone can do forms, but a real CLF fighter(after all CLF was invented to train fighters for a cause) can employ CLF techniques. A real CLF fighter can draw an opponent into their CLF technique. I know alot of CMA uses the same principals on a general level, but using that general knowledge to employ CLF specific techniques is where it will differ.

Oh, and to go a bit deeper, using all that and implementing your schools/ lineage specific ethics, morals and audacity comes into play.
Just my 2 cents

[nospam]

"how would you describe real choy lee fut. what makes it "real" choy lee fut? .....what is a choy lee fut fighter?"

As with any martial art, the 'what' is more of a 'who' makes it real. I speak not of independent associations nor historical family trees. I speak of the person who has trained CLF (no matter their affiliation), holds true to their teachings and philosophies and can demonstrate understanding of same.

I do not speak of fist patterns nor how many I know or how many you know. I speak of the person who can demonstrate CLF in the one true ..or as you want to call..'real' manner; the person who can actually use what has been taught.

In combination of the above - real is Today's practitioner no matter the level who steps into the gwoon and cinches their sash, not their ego; who is willing to learn and improve; who in the beginning is willing to exercise discipline so they can gwa-sau-chop vs kick box; who is willing to ask more questions to learn more to teach; who is able to say, 'Yes Sifu..I think I understand now' no matter the level, then ensure he/she uses that understanding to better him/herself thus embettering their gwoon, to embetter their style, to embetter their family, and their lineage. This is real Gung Fu. If I am not all of the above, then my gung fu was never real, CLF or otherwise.


CLF is lived not just spoken about.

nospam.
:cool:

[yutyeesam]

By answering this question Frank has posed, I wonder if the aim is also to understand what is "FAKE" CLF?


123

[Fu-Pow]

Originally posted by yutyeesam
By answering this question Frank has posed, I wonder if the aim is also to understand what is "FAKE" CLF?


123

Nooooooooooo......really?;)

[SifuX-HSK]

simply,

i have not asked this question with intentions of explaining my point of view. i wanted to see the responses of my fellow choy lee fut practitioners about what the feel real choy lee fut is. no answer is wrong. i just want to see what you have to say.

thanks for all your input. i hope it helps the others in understanding my question.

thanks joe

frank

[SifuX-HSK]

nice job anton:D

ok, try this. what is a choy lee fut fighter? and it is not as simple as saying a fighter who uses the choy lee fut style. because all systems have kwa's, pow's, and such. so what makes him a clf fighter then?


thanks anton

frank

[SifuX-HSK]

ok,

what is real choy lee fut? is it clf from a specific branch? is it techniques? is it the concepts? is it the essence of clf that makes it real clf?


come on, guys give it another try.
but nice work, anyways.

frank

[SifuX-HSK]

hey its good to hear from someone new, at least to me.

but i don't really think you know what everyone is doing with their choy lee fut. as for my self, it will all come soon, and you will see what i have been doing with my choy lee fut.

so that statement was a little empty minded, but hey i won't hold it against you.

remember, to practice in the presence of your own presence is to be one with yourself, right?


frank

[SifuX-HSK]

to answer your question to what is fake choy lee fut can go in two directions.

1- fake choy lee fut is something in name only, and resembles not the style that has become the most popular around the world.
....isn't that cool guys, we are all around the world now. but you know the san francisco bay area is the only place that hoasts all three clf families.

2- fake clf "can" mean useless. by that i mean what is the purpose of becoming a paper sifu? it is the same as a studio gangster. someone who is only a gangster in the studio.
fake clf can mean you are teaching clf and don't understand the system as it was meant to be.

i'm sorry, scholars have no place in a fighting mans world. and choy lee fut was created-by whoever created it- for real life combat that was proven thru decades, **** a century now.

if it weren't for the hard core clf fighters, clf would only be something to talk about around the kitchen table or in a bar. just ment for conversation.

i personally pick the fighting aspect of clf over the intellectual side of it. but thats just me.

frank

[SifuX-HSK]

fu pow, you really do got me all wrong.

you have no idea what i am doing. never try to understand me, i purposely change my ways so people will not find me predictable.

try again fu pow

frank

[Jamesbond_007]

I think fake CLF is a school claiming to teach CLF, claiming to have true lineage, claiming to have the oldest CLF authority in their lineage. But not letting you see a group class, saying they teach the traditionalway and only students can observe classes.
Then when you do sign up, teaching you two made up forms, teaching you kempo techniques with names like striking asp, right hand block. Teaching you karate blocks and kicks, and claiming them to be CLF. After you learn a bunch of kempo techniques, and 2 made up forms, you learn ng lu ma and ng lu choi as intermediate/advance forms, but you only learn how to do the forms, not the applications behind the forms.
In my opinion this is fake CLF.