Forms Training Methodology

[Vash]

First, if someone says "forms are for martial artists, not fighters," I'm going to set you dog on fire and beat your grandparents with their own severed feet.

[/GDA moment]

Here's a genuine question: For those of us who train in forms, what method do you use to train with them? Please, separate your examples into in-class exercises and independent research.

For me:

I've got 8 Empty Hand forms in Isshinryu. Plus, both sides of our Two Man drill, the "bunkai" side to our Seisan form, our staff form, both sides of a Two Man staff form (Bo/Bo Kumite), and a Gojuryu weapon form called Chizi kun Bo. All in all, that's 15 forms. Yowza. No, I'm sure all of these are rather important. However, i haven't the time (or the inclination, really), to study all of these forms indepth. So, what do I do? I keep up with all my forms, and train two or three of them.

Okay, the three I train would be Sunsu (the most advanced of our form/kata/whatever), Naihanchi, and then I have a rotating third. Usually is the Chizi kun Bo (http://www.wonder-okinawa.jp/023/eng/013/005/index.html)[The weapons are the same size as the Tecchu, but look a lot different]. Also substituted is Chinto.

So, on a day that I do my form training, I take one form. I work through it slowly, a la one move, back to the start, two moves, back, etc. I'll reverse it. Work through it backwards. Do it stances/kicks/body shifts only. Then, upper body techniques only. Then, I'll take a section, and use it as a drill. I'll do all the above to that section. Then, if I can get a partner, I'll go over application during light (but full-contact) sparring. Since I can't realistically do all of this in a given workout, I tend to take each training session and work on one or two of the above methods. And I space the workouts so that I'm really in-depth in the form for about two months before I go on to training the next.

Not the best, I'm sure, but it definetly helped my understanding.
I just wish I had learned my forms a bit more slowly. Even keeping up with all of those is hard work. And I didn't sign on to martial arts for hard work. :mad: :eek:

[Water Dragon]

I prefer the traditional way. Setting the timer to 2 minutes and doing one move repetetively at full speed and power will do wonders for your Kung Fu.

[SevenStar]

This raises a question - what is traditional?

[Water Dragon]

It's traditional if I say it is; and if you disagree your Kung Fu is not real.

[SevenStar]

What? I have THE kung fu. There is nothing better/more real than my kung fu, except maybe flan.

[Water Dragon]

But I got the glow baby.

Who da mastaaa? H2O 'Nuff!

[SevenStar]

Who needs the glow, when you can turn super saiyan? you catch bullets in your teeth - I merely project my chi and destroy them before they touch me.

[red5angel]

I use them in several different ways. To work towards the idea of muscle memory, I do repetitions. I also do some "shadow" boxing of sorts using forms. I use it to stay conditioned, doing several forms in a row quickly with no breaks really gets the heart pumping as well.

[norther practitioner]

If I have a tournie coming up (yes I do forms comps), I'll work a form segment several times, go to the next section, etc, then do the whole thing once or twice. I'll do all that at varying speeds, trying to find where my form starts to get sloppy, take it down a notch, and do it there. When I'm learning a form, I walk through it a lot, not really going into the stances, but learning each move and the flow. Then I'll do it in segments, with the stance work etc. When I'm working it to get techs, etc. out of it then I take small segments, work it a bunch, then turn it into a two man thing.

[rubthebuddha]

i don't compete (wing chun forms competitions would be as exciting as C-SPAN), but i train my stuff in the same way np does.

[rogue]

So, on a day that I do my form training, I take one form. I work through it slowly, a la one move, back to the start, two moves, back, etc. I'll reverse it. Work through it backwards. Do it stances/kicks/body shifts only. Then, upper body techniques only. Is it good to be so anal about kata? By trying to make the kata perfect can make the techniques it represent hard to figure out.


Then, I'll take a section, and use it as a drill. I'll do all the above to that section. Then, if I can get a partner, I'll go over application during light (but full-contact) sparring. I used to do that too and for me the results were less than satisfactory as I was trying to make the move look like the kata. What my sensei has me do now is learn a move outside of the kata and use it in directed sparring. When I get it down then it's on to the kata. It may not make for pretty kata but it really gives the sequence meaning.

[Vash]

Originally posted by rogue
Is it good to be so anal about kata? By trying to make the kata perfect can make the techniques it represent hard to figure out.

I'm not really looking for improvement on the visual side. It just helps me get a good idea of how I'm moving, and a good bit of visualization for applications. That way, I can have a decent idea of how I'm gonna be moving when I spar.


I used to do that too and for me the results were less than satisfactory as I was trying to make the move look like the kata. What my sensei has me do now is learn a move outside of the kata and use it in directed sparring. When I get it down then it's on to the kata. It may not make for pretty kata but it really gives the sequence meaning.

That's true. It's just that outside of class, I rarely have the opportunity to work with anyone on the forms I'm studying. Seems like me and the rest of the dojo work on different schedules. In class, though, that's pretty much how we do it.

[norther practitioner]

It also depends on how/what your trying to garner out of a form at a given time. If you want to make a certain move yours, then you have to work it, and work it some more, take the concept of the move, don't take it too literal.

[Vash]

Originally posted by norther practitioner
It also depends on how/what your trying to garner out of a form at a given time. If you want to make a certain move yours, then you have to work it, and work it some more, take the concept of the move, don't take it too literal.

Indeed.

[rogue]

It's just that outside of class, I rarely.... Ah, I get it now.:)

[Vash]

Yay!