Got Qi?

[red5angel]

So I was weight lifting last night and it was a heavy night. About half way through I noticed there was a lot of heat coming frommy hands, my wife was even surprised when I touched her. Of course this got me thinking about Qi, cause one of the most popular claims is that you can sort of cause heat to eminate from your hands, and that was certainly happening. However, I ran into a problem. From all I"ve ever been told, muscle development slows or blocks the Qi from circulating effectively through the body. So what's the deal? Am I getting closer to shooting Qi balls from my hands like some bad azz Ryu from Street Fighter and this whole weight lifting bad for qi thing is just a myth? Or is it something biological going on there? ;)

[Judge Pen]

Too much blood in the hands.

[MasterKiller]

3.9

[red5angel]

I'm not trolling here MK, I'd like to hear some good explanations.

JP - what's the difference between that and Qi?

[Shaolinlueb]

i got the t-shirt if thats what you mean.

[GeneChing]

Get the hoody (http://store.martialartsmart.net/99mals36.html) too. Or the mug (http://store.martialartsmart.net/99mamug36.html) ;) .

I don't know if those it's those qi balls making your hands hot. But here's a thought for you. Did you know that there's no word for muscle in ancient Chinese? Some theorize that this is part of the emphasis on qi over muscle.

[red5angel]

Did you know that there's no word for muscle in ancient Chinese?

So they didn't have a word for the tissue we know as muscle? Wouldn't this sort of support my point that Qi is just a word created to describe things the chinese didn't understand at the time?

[EarthDragon]

red5angel,
What you are experiencing is what judge pen said, blood circulation increased by physical excersize.

The feeling of warmth in the center of the palms that you are reffering to is the most basic feeing of chi emination. However this is only felt naturally and sublty. Not when you are involved with lifting weights or any type of vigorous excersize.

The reason for this is the center of the palm called the Luo Gung, (bubbling wells) as well as the center of the feet are the most sensitive to epidermic changes. Some even feel a thickening of the hands and feet or tingling, but again this is THE most basic understanding of the energy which circulates throughout our bodies.

This is like first experiencing taste buds by licking sugar and realizing its sweet.

For alot of people putting thier hands close together and feeling magnetics or heat is like standing in horse stance and saying you know kung fu.


WHAT???????????????????????????????????
You said that thier is no word in the chinese language for muscle?
What are you talking about?
I suggest you should try to read just a little about TCM or even DaMo classics Yi Gin Ching & Shii Soei Ching before you make a a$$ out of yourself when you make claims simply out of lack of knowledge.

KungChung (bicep)
Hsiaolo (tricep)
Chienliao (deltoid)
Hsishang (brachialis)

Shall I go on???????????????????

[Becca]

Originally posted by EarthDragon

WHAT???????????????????????????????????
You said that thier is no word in the chinese language for muscle?
What are you talking about?
I suggest you should try to read just a little about TCM or even DaMo classics Yi Gin Ching & Shii Soei Ching before you make a a$$ out of yourself when you make claims simply out of lack of knowledge.

KungChung (bicep)
Hsiaolo (tricep)
Chienliao (deltoid)
Hsishang (brachialis)

Shall I go on???????????????????

Those are body parts. Very spacific ones, yes, but still parts and the words are modern. There is no word in ancient Chinese for "muscle". The concept of all those "body parts" being the "same" and needing a non-descript name for the group just wasn't there.

[Royal Dragon]

Yi Jin Jing - 495 AD?

[Becca]

Yi Jin Jing - 495 AD, yes. But the word "muscle" wasn't nessisarilly around then just because the modern version uses that word. The idea of bathroom or restroom isn't new, but the term is. Back in 495 AD they called it a guardroabe.


And yes, that metiphor does too work- it clearly shows how langueges are constanly growing.

[Gangsterfist]

Isn't Qi (chi) translated as air power? Doesn't air flow through our body via bloodstream?

Not trolling, seriously asking...

[blooming lotus]

no...qi is translated as intrinsic energy or life force and flows superimposed to blood and and body matter etc...

yes ..air flows through our body via blood.....qi is and isn't related to this

[Serpent]

No, oxygen and carbon dioxide use blood as a transport system. Not air. If you're going to try to sound like you know something, try a little harder than that.

Also, chi might tramslate in your mind as life force, but that doesn't make it right either.

[Face2Fist]

Originally posted by red5angel
So I was weight lifting last night and it was a heavy night. About half way through I noticed there was a lot of heat coming frommy hands, my wife was even surprised when I touched her. Of course this got me thinking about Qi, cause one of the most popular claims is that you can sort of cause heat to eminate from your hands, and that was certainly happening. However, I ran into a problem. From all I"ve ever been told, muscle development slows or blocks the Qi from circulating effectively through the body. So what's the deal? Am I getting closer to shooting Qi balls from my hands like some bad azz Ryu from Street Fighter and this whole weight lifting bad for qi thing is just a myth? Or is it something biological going on there? ;)

its called a heart attack

[blooming lotus]

Originally posted by Serpent
No, oxygen and carbon dioxide use blood as a transport system. Not air. If you're going to try to sound like you know something, try a little harder than that.

Also, chi might tramslate in your mind as life force, but that doesn't make it right either.

keeping it simple stoopid....


qi might transmate in my mind as life force..it might also equate to life force...

Pretty sure it's direct (or as close as poss ) translation is " intrinsic energy"

[Serpent]

Pretty sure? Aren't you supposed to be the genius?

Do a little research on that one, why don't you. Learn something instead of claiming to know everything.

[blooming lotus]

well...in all the books I've read that's what they call it...If I'm wrong I guess I'll just have to cry



Not!!!!

but if you wanna tell me what you know it to mean, I'd be happy for the tip

[Shaolinlueb]

Originally posted by GeneChing
Get the hoody (http://store.martialartsmart.net/99mals36.html) too. Or the mug (http://store.martialartsmart.net/99mamug36.html) ;) .

I don't know if those it's those qi balls making your hands hot. But here's a thought for you. Did you know that there's no word for muscle in ancient Chinese? Some theorize that this is part of the emphasis on qi over muscle.

Gene I got the Extra Large, of the Mabu Year 2000 Hoody, and it is small on me. are the Got Qi ones that small too?

Adam

[EarthDragon]

As I said before there IS a chinese word for muscle, becuse the actual word muscle is from latin, like pectoralis, deltiod, abdominus etc. does that mean that because in english we use the latin terms to describe them there is NO word for muscle in the "english" language either?

let not play symantics here.

There's no word for dumb a$$ ba$tard in chinese but dont you think they know what one is?

[red5angel]

there IS a chinese word for muscle

what is it? Anyone?

So what I was feeling was a basic effect of chi flow through my body? which also correlates to blood flow? There is that strange correlation between biomechanics and biology and Qi.
How is it that if weight lifting is bad for you as far as Qi goes, why is it I can feel the Qi basics while doing it?

[MasterKiller]

Originally posted by EarthDragon
As I said before there IS a chinese word for muscle Gene's point was there was no ancient word. I'm sure they have one now.

[Becca]

That is the point EarthDragon seems to be missing. Yi Jin Jing is 1500 yeasr old. That doesn't meen they had a word for muscle 1500 years ago.

[backbreaker]

Yes, yi chin ching is not chinese. Actually it is a slightly modified form of Tibetan Yoga with martial purposes

[GeneChing]

Actually I'm talking more like 2000 years ago. Look at old Chinese art - there's no emphasis on muscle. Not like the anatomical versions you see in roman art.
Also traditionally, we've beleived that Yijinjing goes back to Tamo's day, but the earliest extant version of Tamo Yijinjing is only as old as the 16th century. And check your wording - yi is change, jing is sutra, but what is jin? jin is tendon. If you really want to bat this around, we've been chipping at it in on our Shaolin forum (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?threadid=28397).

Shaolinlueb - I believe the got qi hoody is printed on the same hoody as the mabu one was. Sorry. :(

[David Jamieson]

tendon is the end point of muscle. it is essentially where the muscle attaches to the bone.

yi jin jing is known as "muscle/tendon change classic"

notice that muscle and tendon are denoted as the same vis a vis the slash mark. this is a translation thingy that has occured but G is correct in regards to the correct term being "tendon"

ED- your points about the lao gong areas are what made the grade in red5's question.

the blood pressure was indeed forcing increased flow to these turn around points in the arterial system.

so, by forcing more blood to the limbs, the bubbling wells were working overtime taking the blood in and sending it back to the heart.

in regards to qi. qi is life essence, but it is literally "breath" blood is the vehicle of bringing "breath" to the body and thereby giving it life.

breath is not just oxygen and nitrogen though, it is also inclusive of the particulate matter within air and the other gasses we breath in and out.

It is believed that by the act of breathing, we sustain, but that we also in line with yin/yang theory have a finite amount of qi to begin with at our point of birth. as we use it up, we grow old and eventually we die.

now here's where it starts to bend the noodle:

if we can turn off certain genes in our systems and we can stop the ravages of oxygenated free radicals, it is likely we could extend the human lifespan well beyond the conventionally held age of 120 to 130 at the top end.

It will be possible to live up to 200 years old at some point in the forseeable future.

It is also just as likely that this will only occur in a controlled and manufactured environment...such as a space station, or something akin to it.

Freaky eh?

lol

cheers

[blooming lotus]

Originally posted by red5angel


what is it? Anyone?

How is it that if weight lifting is bad for you as far as Qi goes, why is it I can feel the Qi basics while doing it?

maybe it's got to do with the tensing and potential for qi to become blocked????

[backbreaker]

Someone said on another forum that smoking can temporarily increase qi flow, but long term it is bad

[EarthDragon]

As far as ancient chinese (old mandarin or cantonese) goes I will accept that 2000 years ago their was no actual word translated (muscle) but I was taught by a chinese person every muscle in the body for my OMD training.

backbreaker, niccotine temporarly expands blood cappilairies alowing more O2 to flow.

[red5angel]

that 2000 years ago their was no actual word translated (muscle)

and so, Qi comes into being. You gotta have something to explain what your seeing.

[GeneChing]

Yes, today we have a word for muscle - in mandarin it's ji rou - ji means "flesh"; rou means "meat". Of course, there are anatomical names for individual muscles too now, same as in western medicine oviously, since they have western medicine doctors in China. But in ancient times, there was no specific word for muscle. If you really want to research this seriously, I suggest you examine The Expressiveness of the Body, and the Divergence of Greek and Chinese Medicine by Shigehisa Kuriyama, but I warn you that this is a fairly scholarly work, not an easy read at all. I've only looked at it in a most cursory manner.

[Former castleva]

So what I was feeling was a basic effect of chi flow through my body? which also correlates to blood flow? There is that strange correlation between biomechanics and biology and Qi.

Great observation,within that debate.Assuming we have one.
This is a relevant concern in case someone is still calling out for some additional "magic" beyond conventional physiology,which seems to go a long way in describing the sensation.
Common knowledge;
exercise->increased blood circulation->warmth.
Qi kicks in somewhere in there? What does it serve to explain?


How is it that if weight lifting is bad for you as far as Qi goes, why is it I can feel the Qi basics while doing it?
First you need to have an exact definition of qi (if this is not come down to semantical baloney).
Call it a "qi-hypothesis".It´s completely wet,as far as contribution goes,if it can´t be defined and cannot form any predictions about what one should expect to experience.
Of course anything,including the feeling/observation you attributed to "biomechanics and biology",can be integrated to "qi-hypothesis" and considered an amusing "correlation" as long as the requirements (defined above) are not met.

[backbreaker]

Qi means rice, water, heat, steam. So is it fair to say "qi" has to do with the process of solid, liquid, gas ?

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

At every level, including individual blood cells and molecules of "air", there is an electrical charge.. there is an enormous anount of energy (atom binding), and various chemical processes.. it might be wise to view Qi as a result of these energies, forces and processes rather than a separate entity.. Qi may simply be the intangible result of interactive tangible processes.. the parts of an engine don't power the auto, the constructed engine parts acting in unison produce the power.. the power itself can't be seen or measured, but its effects can.. in fact, the measurement is an "effect" of the power on a particular device.. and, someday, maybe we will build a device that can measure the effect of "Qi"..

Be well...

[Becca]

I like the way you explaimed that, Bob! :)

[Starchaser107]

thats kinda deep tcbob.