Alcohol causes longevity?????

[blooming lotus]

ok, so I know we've had some debate about this several times here...but I was talking to an extremely conservative colleage of mine who of her own volition brought up this same fact...trying to tell me that this was a contributor and maybe even a neccessary factor of living long!!!????

I believe she's right,. as do so many people with enough information...my question though is why??? My educated guess is because of digestive assistance and hence a lighter load for our bodies...( although more than 300ml ish and you can probably book into AA any time now ;) ).

any thoughts??? not on validity..because I'm not so interested in uneducated thought today...seriously...why do you think most people who have seen 100+ yrs all drink a little alcohol daily?? is it 'cause they're half p*ssed and not stressed or is it genuinely physiological???

and ....what alcohols are we speaking of???

[Spark]

Honestly, I don't know if alcohol has anything to do with longevity, rather than just genetics.

Look at people who live 90 years and have smoked their whole lives, and those who die at 40 from lung cancer.

I would say that alcohol is more of a coincidence than a contributing factor to living a longer life.

We'll know for sure once Jack Lelane dies

[Ford Prefect]

Any alchohol on moderation will thin your blood much to the same effect as taking an aspirin daily. This lowers blood pressure and is easier on your heart. There are other anti-oxidant properties in red wine which give more benefits as well. Several studies have been done on this. The most recent by harvard university.

[dwid]

Ford is right on.

Further, some evidence suggests that:

1) Small amounts of alcohol lower fibrinogen levels in the blood, lessening the risk of clot formation on atherosclerotic plaques, a causative factor in coronary heart disease.

2) Alcohol may exert other anti-clotting properties. Evidence is inconclusive.

3)Alcohol may lessen insulin resistance, reducing likelihood of adult-onset diabetes and atherosclerosis.

4)Alcohol may improve the conditioning of the heart muscle, making it more resistant to damage from oxygen deprivation.

5) Strong evidence suggests that alcohol raises blood HDL cholesterol, helping to remove harmful LDL from the vessel walls.

So, in moderation (1-2 servings per day) alcohol is pretty good for you.

[FooFighter]

Listen:

I think a drunken fist master named "Sam Si" who was teaching Jackie Chan in those old Kung Fu movies believed getting drunk improved your kung fu. However, putting aside kung fu movie wisdom and knowledge, I personally wouldnt study with a red nose drunken gung fu master and secondly I dont drink until I gte red nose like Sam Si.

However, I do drink in moderation, especially red wine, and I have heard drinking wine in moderation is good for your health; not too sure about if it improves your gung fu? I hope Sam Si's pearl of wisdom is right. Well if you live longer and have better health, then it would be logically that your kung fu skills would gets better with age?

[Vash]

Think I'll stick with my aspirin and grape juice.

[IronFist]

Too bad red wine is nasty. :D

Wouldn't the anti-clotting properties make it bad if you got cut or something? Or like a big wound. It would take longer to stop bleeding, right?

[rubthebuddha]

IF -- it just means you'll have to pinch your nose an extra 2 minutes when that 15-year-old bloodies you up. no worries, really. :D

[Toby]

Originally posted by blooming lotus
...( although more than 300ml ish and you can probably book into AA any time now ;) ).
300ml of what? Vodka? Phew, I'm just under the limit :D.

Originally posted by blooming lotus
...why do you think most people who have seen 100+ yrs all drink a little alcohol daily??
Like the other guys said in the other thread, do you have any evidence of this? Genuinely curious as I've never heard anything to support this.


Iron, don't make me come over there and bloody your nose :mad: :D.

[CaptinPickAxe]

Where I'm from alcohol causes nothing but bad. It being the main cause of:

1. Car Accidents. I lost 3 friends in High School to this devil.

2. Liver Cancer

3. Stupid Choices

But then again Texas is the land w/o moderation. You drink untill the doubles have doubles.:D

[FatherDog]

Keith Richards is thus explained.

[Ford Prefect]

Toby,

There are tons of studies that have been released the past couple years about alchohol and health. They all tested something along the lines of 1-2 drinks per day. The latest I've heard about was by harvard and released last year.

IF,

The anti-clotting properties are just because your blood is thinner. The same thing can be said about asprirn for the same reason.

[Ironwind]

Originally posted by rubthebuddha
IF -- it just means you'll have to pinch your nose an extra 2 minutes when that 15-year-old bloodies you up. no worries, really. :D

But really would alcohol make it harder to heal with all it's good side-effects.

[dwid]

But really would alcohol make it harder to heal with all it's good side-effects.

It depends on what you're healing from. If you're on antibiotics and some other medications, alcohol may diminish the effects of those drugs, thus it is best to avoid.

Otherwise, one to two servings of alcohol per day is probably not going to thin the blood substantially enough to have a noticeable negative effect on healing from cuts, bruises, etc...

[Spark]

wouldnt' it make more sense to just live a healthier lifestyle instead of relying on alchohol to repair your body?

ie exercise and eat better?

[dwid]

I understand that, being straight edge, you probably want to believe that alcohol is all bad.

Nobody, least of all me, is saying alcohol is some kind of magic elixir for health. However, as part of a healthy lifestyle, it can, in moderation, contribute to good health. And, truthfully, in at least one study, older non-drinkers who started drinking one to two drinks per day showed lower rates of heart disease and some cancers than those that did not drink.

We're not talking about getting loaded here. 1 to 2 drinks daily is not going to get you drunk. Furthermore, drinking heavily will not only offset the positive effects of drinking, but can cause all kinds of health problems (obviously).

[Ford Prefect]

Dwid is 100% correct. We aren't talking about getting loaded and every study disclaims itself by saying that a healthy lifestyle is the most important factor in longevity. It's just that 1-2 drinks a day especially of red wine, have effects on the body which could even help somebody who's living a healthy lifestyle.

[Spark]

haha although it says i'm a sXe warrior - I'm by no means hardline.

I'm just trying to make the point that, especially in NA, we look to a solution before we look at the causes of our problems. Cure for this cure for that - well maybe if you didn't act reckless/senseless/selfish, etc ... then you wouldn't need some sort of remedy to come in and save the day.
And i'm not just referring to alchohol.

Like you mentioned how it helps reduce clot formation. Well what is that person doing that is causing these clots?

[Spark]

Ford - i didn't read your post and that makes perfect sense.

[Ironwind]

So a serving of alcohol is to unclear because of the liquor proofs and percentages. What would be recomended for a serving of alcohol that would help you on regular basis. Because their are strong things like 99banana's and weak things like beer. Then you have your inbetweener's like vodka and gin. So around what proof would a practice like that be placed on.

Also wouldn't this also help the liver by not over using it but giving it purpose as an organ. Gradually increasing it's strength.

[Ford Prefect]

Generally a shot = glass of wine = beer.

A shot has the most alcohol but is the smallest in volume.

A glass of wine as the second most alchohol but it has less volume than beer.

A beer is the weakest, but is served in the greatest volume.

It all equals out in the end.

Pick your poison. Again, a glass of red wine is probably best.

BTW, if you're having 12 ounze servings of whiskey, you have problems.

[rubthebuddha]

"hi, my name is ford, and i'm a whisk-a-holic." :D

[blooming lotus]

lol...don't knock the wiskey...in these patrs it comes highly recommended...

sparks...I don't think we're saying alcohol is "cure" for anything, somuch as it is a part of a heathly dietary regime....I think personally that the higher proof or % alcohol you have the better effectiveness in cutting your sugars and fats, breaking down your protiens etc...

as far as not improving your gongfu..you may be wrong...maybe as soon as 15 mins after my daily shot, I feel much more aligned and "get my bounce on" (??) much easier...so if I go straight into a workout...which I often do..I seem to be more able to deal with the load???

what about psychologically, obviously alcohol has a relaxing effect on our nervous system etc...and we are all aware that stress can contribute to early death...surely this is also a benifit... right??? does anyone have any science on that?

[Toby]

Originally posted by Ford Prefect
Toby,

There are tons of studies that have been released the past couple years about alchohol and health. They all tested something along the lines of 1-2 drinks per day. The latest I've heard about was by harvard and released last year.

Ford, I know that it's good for you. The statistic I'm questioning (and other people did in another thread) is BL's assertion that "most people who have seen 100+ yrs all drink a little alcohol daily".

BTW, for those that haven't tried it yet, spirits are excellent for a cold. On 2 occasions I've had the onset of a cold (sore throat variety) and relaxed with a bottle of spirits over an afternoon. Next day? All better. It's my unsubstantiated belief that the alcohol kills any poor germs that get in the way. You've gotta pour strong mixes, though. My current poison is vodka and orange on the rocks - at least 1/2 vodka. I also love bourbon and dry on the rocks - again at least 1/2 bourbon. I'm off it a bit since we stopped getting 101 proof Wild Turkey in Oz :mad:. It's all 86.8 proof now. So now it's Maker's Mark. If you can drink your spirits neat or straight on the rocks it's probably even better for killing colds.

[FatherDog]

Any ailment can be treated with liberal applications of vodka, chicken soup, and duct tape.

[dwid]

BL:


what about psychologically, obviously alcohol has a relaxing effect on our nervous system etc...and we are all aware that stress can contribute to early death...surely this is also a benifit... right??? does anyone have any science on that?

Actually, strangely enough, research has found no data to support this assertion.