I can beat anyone!

[Airdrawndagger]

...was the way I thought when i was training for some time, now since I have experienced a real street fight in which I lost, I now have a more realistic handhold on my own ability. Let me elaborate:
Have you ever been so mad you see red? Well I did when i found out that some punks were harrasing my mother and 3 month old daughter ON CHRISTMAS EVE. She was walking my daughter around the block when she passed by these punks that were playing football in the street, when there dog got in her way and was to close to my daughter she tried to get the dog out of the way buy nudging it with her leg. The punks said something to the effect of "Dont hurt my dog you *****" and various other things. My mother replied "Im trying to get your dog out of the way and dont talk to me like that!" Well words were exchanged and she went home very upset.
Well I found out and became inraged...
I went over there with an ass kicking in mind. There were 3 of them and they were built, a little shorter than me and knew i was ****ed.
"Whos talking **** to my mom" I demanded
I which the most muscular one replied "What are you going to do about it? Closing in on me, i knew what was going to happen, so I straight punched him in the face and he moved out of the way only being grazed by my punch, and tried to take me down by tackling me. We went backwards with his arms locked around me and me back peddleing, I was obviously in a bad position, but was preparing to bodyslam him when the others 2 jumped on me and we went to the ground.
I am not an expert grappler but I am not totally helpless either, i know how to get out of that position, however, dealing with 3 guys as apose to 1 is a different game. They held my arms down while the one on top was trying to hit my face. I got struck one time with a fist and was kicked several times, all to which did not hurt to much til one kick landed hard, striking me on the temple. That rattled me. Not much i could do, i was losing.
My brother over looking the incident from down the street, came rushing in knocking them off of me. He clocked the largest one square in the teeth knocking 2 teeth out and was jacking another one in the stomach. I was dased but comming around and got to my feet. The guy that lost his teeth was grabbing his face in pain, while my brother was handling the other guy. Just at that moment the third guy came running out with a bat and smacked my brother over the head with it, spliting his head open. With blood gushing freely from the wound, my brother bowed out of the fight.
I immediatly charged the attacker and was deffending my brother from this guy, he could not attack and my brother managed to leave.
I couldn't stay there and fight no matter how much i wanted to because my bro was badly hurt, so we fled together while being chased away.
The ambulance came along with the the police and reports were filed. Nothing of a legal matter came about.

What I did wrong...

1. I wasn't calm enough to handle myself, how can i "handle" dealing with 3 agressors?
2. I let the first guy grab me. I know, I know...There are many ways to deal with a grapple in this case before and after contact that i am very familiar with, but didnt execute.
3. After going to the ground and getting back on my feet I should have taken out anybody involved and went to my brothers side.
4. Before anything happend physically, I should have not been so careless with my attack.
5. Poor execution and footwork(period).

Looking back that day,I have picked apart the intire situation frame by frame and it could have been worse or better at any given moment. At the time I hadn't trained for around 3 months and i was out of shape due to the holidays( i know poor excuse) and that had alot to do with my performance because if you dont practice you take your mind and body out of focus.
Needless to say I feel very ashamed in how the situation went down. I mean I am very good at wing chun, am a senior student and I know how to fight, but "it" just didnt click that day. I wasn't prepared for that to happen, but you never are and thats why I think most of us train.
"You learn more when you lose than when you win" is the saying and it couldn't be more true to me. I think back to that day, my performance, and i become inraged. This memory is the "fuel of my fire within" and has pushed me to become better, stronger, and more prepared for the unexpected, because you never know when its going to go down. Oh by the way, I am a more humble person and I have erased the "I can beat anyone" attitude. We wing chun people train in our kwoons with people that train the same way so we get comfortable with our environment, unaware of how different a real fight is. That "anything goes" situation is often over looked, but needs to be the heart of our training because, thats why we train, right? To fight for REAL. NOT to dance, SPAR, look pretty, show off, or brag, so why do we kid ourselves?
This is a statement coming from me and is referring to me so I am not trying to offend anyone, so dont take it that way, but in my 5 years of training in this art, i have had many discoveries and realizations. Do I really train hard enough to appreciate the full benefits of this amazing art? Do I take it seriously enough? Why am I training?
Anybody every been there? Do you feel me?

Regards,

Airdrawn dagger

[mortal]

You should have let it go.

Or at least pick them off as you catch them alone or when you are with your friends.

Chose your battles wisely. Only fight battles you can win or if your cornered.

Think about it. Was all that blood worth it?

I still respect the fact that you stuck up for yourself on some level.

Is you teacher the right one for you?

[Airdrawndagger]

Yes
My teacher is great, and has more experience than most. I certainly dont blame him, only myself.
My mind wasn't right, i was seeing red and couldn't control my emotions. I think controling your emotions are very important to fighting especially, with kung fu where as it teaches you to be calm with each movement. Executing this in a real fight is very difficult though

[Ernie]

Airdrawndagger


man big up's
that is the best thing i might have ever read on this forum , pure honesty and accepting responsibility for your actions .

trust me when i say i have had my share of real eye opening experiences

and you really end up taking a good hard look at your training methods and your own conditioning
mental and physical

tan bong fook , how your toes point ,were your wieght is, how far back you can trace your roots
not really that important when the real world comes knocking

conditioning , the ability to adapt from any position and understand your own limitations
are much more important

your enemy was simply you ,
your anger , your conditioning , your assumption that you were ready for a street fight [ not being disrspectful ]

i thank you for sharing
but even more important how have you changed your training since then ?

for me conditioning became paramount , introducing weapons sparring and multiple attackers with and with out weapons

gloveing up and takeing abuse

training with people from other systems that were much better then me

p.s.
your mom is ok your daughter is ok your ok and hopefully your bro is fine
it was still a good day




:D

[sokuto]

The main thing is you have learnt from the experience of that situation. This is what MA is all about. We cant all expect to win every fight we get into. The best we can expect is to learn from our mistakes and move on.

It seems like that that is what you are doing. If there is ever a next time (and hopefully there wont be!!), you will handle the situtation differently.

[Phil Redmond]

Airdrawndagger,
You have nothing to be ashamed of. I could say that you could have let it go. If it had been my mom and daughter I might have done the same so I won't say that. :) You stood up for what you thought was right at the time.

[Ultimatewingchun]

Airdrawndagger:

You've pretty much covered all the bases with your remarks and introspection along with the others who've commented on this thread so far - except for one thing that was briefly alluded to - so I'd like to expand on it further...

When you saw that it was three of them - and that they were big guys...IT WAS TIME FOR HELP.

I once successfully fought two guys - who were my about my size...
but the odds when going up against multiple opponents are not good - so in truth, I was somewhat lucky to have gotten the first punch off (which dropped the first guy - though he wasn't finished quite just yet).

Sometimes there is no choice in these matters - but you had a choice...you could have returned to the scene (before the fight began) - with your brother...or with a weapon of some sort.

Instead - you chose to fight three guys.

Admirable courage, no doubt...but your first and biggest mistake.

[Airdrawndagger]

"thank you for sharing
but even more important how have you changed your training since then ?"

I am a realist so im not going to sit here and tell you I train 5 hours a day like a madman, but I do have a different training schedual, something to the effect of running, doing forms and application training, stretching, and kicking and punching the bag at least 3 times a week in the morning, along with going to class at least 3 times a week. I went out and bought full contact training gear which would include 2 sets of chuck norris gloves(very good gloves for wing chun!), and the full contact head gear, the ones with the clear blast sheild. I do try to throw down when ever i can along with increased sparring.
I dont like to over work myself because if I do then I will get burned out and we all know what happens then...we miss even more training time so i keep it steady until im comfortable with the routine, then ad an exesise.
The chinese have a saying that im not sure how to say in cantonese but translated to something to the effect of:
"Fight like the tiger chasing the rabbit." Even though the tiger is obvioulsy the greater opponent, he never underestimates the rabbit and goes after the rabbit as if his life depended on it, chasing, fighting, and ripping apart the advisary with no remorse. And the same could be true with any other aggressor the tiger faces, he never changes his fighting style or holds back because of a smaller opponent. You never know who your opponent is no matter how big, small, skilled, or unskilled they appear to be so you treat them all the same, no mercy.
I have adopted this philosophy or mind set as well.

As for everyone else who wrote me back i appreciate your responses, but what happened is in the past and i have learned and grown from the experience.
I am wise to what happens in the street in regards to whether or not a fight might occur, so I dont try to rush into any situation to try to beat anyone up, however, dont mess with my family!
I will not back down from anyone that indangers my loved ones and will attack you with no remorse, no mercy...like i was a tiger chasing a rabbit.

Airdrawndagger

[Martin Foot]

"what happened is in the past and i have learned and grown from the experience"
That's all you can hope for Airdrawndagger, well done mate

[anerlich]

You did the best you could and stood up for your family. Yeah, well done.

Only other observation I have to add to the good ones made above is: "Revenge is a dish best served cold."

[sticky fingers]

'Hit first, talk later'

First strike by a surprise attack.
You and your bro could probably have taken them down easily in an ambush.

Then talk to them about your mom while they're lying on their backs looking up at you. You'll be amazed at how attentive and apologetic they become:)

[foolinthedeck]

no disrespect to you at all.
but how was it that you threw the first punch and the first guy managed to evade it?
obviously its easy for me to pass judgement but just theoretically- were you too slow? did you telegraph it? were you wearing an 'i do wing chun t shirt'?

i guess it was the rage...
again no disrespect, i suppose if i had a question here it would be:

how would things have been different if that first punch had been perfect?

[Airdrawndagger]

Good question

I did hit him but not square in the face, the range was a little out of wing chun range. Either way, it was not followed up with further punishment like it was suppose to be.

[Ng Mui]

Training hard makes you the best you can be.
Having said that, even at your best there are those who will be better. Three against one are near impossible odds for anyone.

If you practiced twice as hard as anyone on this forum, the same thing could have happened.

Many variables in combat. The good guys don't always win. Just look at the steady stream of body bags coming back from Iraq.

That doesn't mean you should not stand up for yourself.
You lived and learned from the encounter.
Everyone does not get that luxury.

[KenWingJitsu]

We wing chun people train in our kwoons with people that train the same way so we get comfortable with our environment, unaware of how different a real fight is. That "anything goes" situation is often over looked, but needs to be the heart of our training

That sounds like a little lightbulb went off and is my favorite part of a great post.

Then what Ernie said is golden.

What I will add is as you take the fight "frame by frame" etc, make sure to train what you should do in those "frames". In thiose frames you dont see anyone doing ton, fook, bong,.....there is distance, there is clinch (the tackle), there is the ground....what can you do to counter that? Take that answer and drill it LIVE with the equipment you bought (make sure your partners have the same equipment), and let them try to clinch, take you down,. ALso, start form the ground and let them try to keep you down while you try to get back up. Do 3-5 minute rounds and watch the lightbulbs go off. This is where you should spend most of your training.

[Airdrawndagger]

Great idea I will try that. Not to many people think about starting a "spar" from the ground and working yourself back up to stand up position. Good stuff!