Question from my friend

[IronFist]

Since there's no grappling or mma school around here I have to work out on my own with my friend who has no MA experience, but I'm showing him the basics of what I learned (basic punching, Thai roundhouses, basic grappling, actually all I know are basics) but it's better than nothing, right?

Ok, so here's my friend's problem. He's right handed, but he's left footed. So like he writes with his right hand but he kicks a soccer ball with his left foot. He jabs with his left hand and crosses with his right when he's in a left foot forward boxing/muay thai stance (or crazy monkey, cuz that's what I learned), but then that puts his power leg (left) in front, which doesn't lend itself well to throwing hard rear leg Thai round kicks.

So which way would be better for him? He asked me if I thought he should fight southpaw and I said no, because I assume that in a fight you'll probably be doing more with punching than with kicking so it's probably best to keep your power hand in the back.

Since you guys have way more experience with this stuff, what do you think?

[rubthebuddha]

have him try both -- whichever one feels best and most natural, have him do that.

then be a bastage and make him try the other, just so he can work from all angles. :)

[Banjos_dad]

Goofy-footed?

[Ray Pina]

My right hand is my power hand but my left foot is loser, more flexible and thus more powerful. When I did karate it was great, I just used the left side kick to keep everyone out and score points. Now I know better.

So I take a right lead. I now have my strongest and most versatile hand weapon closest to the enemy. I keep my left hand back to block but aim to intercept anything -- kick or punch -- by striking it with my lead right.

Once I make the connection I come follow through with the left hand either to keep shielding or strike again and once we're all tied up or the other guy is hirting up top THEN I step through and give him the ol' left shin/knee to the thigh.

Of course, it doesn't always go like that, it's situational, but that's my base model. It works well. I have no jab. All the lead strikes are heavy.

[Akhilleus]

That's a tough call, since either way he is going to have his weak and strong side in the front and back...I remember reading in Tao of JKD that one should fight with their strong side forward, but then when I started doing san shou they had my fight with my strong side (right) back...but that doesn't really help your friend much, does it...aha, there is something I learned in san shou that will help you...

My coach told me that since most people kick with the back leg you can surprise them by kicking with the front leg...this can be any type of kick, we even practice high roundhouse kicks w/ the front leg...but the ones that I throw most often are sidekicks and leg kicks...usually I skip forward on these to close the gap...so that would make it sound like I am suggesting your friend fight with his strong leg forward...but aha...

One time I was helping a friend train for Golden Gloves and my coach had me fight southpaw, since his next opponent was indeed a southpaw...I found that with my strong hand forward it was much easier to sneak my jab in there, but at the same time I landed virtually no left hands the whole time...of course, I had been practicing fighting with only my right side back for over a year at that point...

So I have no suggestions, only things I thought it would help you guys to think about, and here's two more, not suggestions, just food for thought:

Why not try mixing it up? Don't really favor one side or the other but use both...

At my kung fu school we are suppose to have the same side back as our opponent...so if he switches we are suppose to switch too...

I guess in the end you have to decide which one works best...

[Water Dragon]

I'm right handed but fight Southpaw. It's pretty standard in the CMA I've done to fight strong side forward. He may give up a little power in his cross, but what he'll gain in his lead hook and body shot will be worth it. He can also develop a jab that is capable of doing some real damage.

I think if he fights right forward he can be dangerous. He can throw jab hook combos all day and mix those up with roundhouse kicks to the inside of the high.

Also, if he is already strong side forward, wrestling becomes much more natural when you clinch.

[No_Know]

upper strong back?..Lower strong back?..

Have himstand with his left leg back in thestance style you have, but use his waist or abdominals to put the left fis/shoulder forward.

This way his strong leg is in the back for Muay Thai type kick. And he can jab with his weaker left hand side and has his stronger right, back to launch~.

Not so tough. :-)
...

[Ray Pina]

Yes, but when you have your left leg back and then shift that way to lead with your left hand, you are very open to be trapped and collapsed and very hard to recover.

Once in a while you can get away with it. But to make it your standard ... you're setting the odds against you before you even begin...... not to mention you lose the reach of leading with the "T".

[yenhoi]

As far as thai kicks go, you both shuld eventually have strong lead and rear kicks.

Its harder to learn the basics of mobility and power generation in odd stances. People CAN stand left foot lead, right hand lead but thats just making it hard on yourself to learn the fundamentals at first.

Make the learning part easy.

:eek:

[Meat Shake]

When you lead with your strong side you can do body contact throws with your strong side.
For some reason my left hook is significantly more powerful than my right, but all other right hand punches are much stronger.
I fight with both sides leading equally, it all depends on what technique I am wanting to use, and which side I prefer to use it on. I dont adjust to my opponent. If I dont like the side he has forward, I kick his knee until he moves it.

[IronFist]

Originally posted by Meat Shake
I dont adjust to my opponent. If I dont like the side he has forward, I kick his knee until he moves it.

hehe :D :)

[DragonzRage]

I had the same issue as Water Dragon. I came up in traditional MA when I was younger, and then did JKD for awhile. So by the time I settled into Muay Thai, I was so accustomed to fighting southpaw that it was best for me to do Muay Thai southpaw, rather than force myself to fight in the traditional stance. So when I first started muay thai, I had the tendency to be overly dependent on my lead (right) leg roundhouse, since my left leg roundhouse was weaker and slower. Not having a strong rear thai kick is very detrimental to muay thai. But I still didn't want to switch my stance because it felt so much more natural for me to move quickly with good footwork while in southpaw. Moving around in the traditional stance just felt awkward and slower.

So I just ended up spending a lot of training time developing my rear side attacks. I spent endless rounds on the heavy bag and thai pads focusing on my rear (left) leg roundhouse and left cross. After all that practice I became a very comfortable southpaw thai boxer. Nowadays i have a left kick to rival Crocop's. Ok, well maybe thats an exaggeration, but you get the point.

Anyway, my opinion is that you should pick the stance that feels most comfortable for you to use good footwork, defend, and punch in. Sounds like your friend is most comfortable in a left lead stance, so I think he should focus on that. He just has to make a conscious effort to practice his right leg kicks until they feel comfortable and powerful.

All that being said, I'd encourage you guys to find some level of serious muay thai instruction, if you're really interested in developing this stuff and training on thai pads. Doing $hitty muay thai will only breed $hitty fighters. And bad habits can be hard to break by the time you find the opportunity to get real training. At the very least, you should order some good instructional videos.

[unkokusai]

Originally posted by Water Dragon

Also, if he is already strong side forward, wrestling becomes much more natural when you clinch.


??????????????

[Water Dragon]

The grappling arts teach you to fight power side forward.

[unkokusai]

Originally posted by Water Dragon
The grappling arts teach you to fight power side forward.

Never really discussed it in that way (like traditional vs southpaw in boxing). Strange to think of it.

[Merryprankster]

strange, but accurate.

You know, the guy COULD just fight left side forward and develop a wicked front leg roundkick. It's a great weapon and a lot of guys don't expect it to be any good.

[SevenStar]

merry beat me to it. Have him fight with his power hand back. That gives him the power of his cross. Also, his front leg is his power leg, which can give him the potential for some wicked front leg kicks, which are a beautiful thing. his weak leg will have increased power from being placed in the rear.

[unkokusai]

Originally posted by Merryprankster
strange, but accurate.


The subject never came up for me before. Interesting. Although, I have always led like a southpaw in wrestling as well as standing (right side [weaker side] forward). Interesting

[No_Know]

EvolutionFist
Senior Member

Registered: Jan 2002
Location: Long Beach, NY
Posts: 1696
"Yes, but when you have your left leg back and then shift that way to lead with your left hand, you are very open to be trapped and collapsed and very hard to recover."

No_Know

"Have himstand with his left leg back in thestance style you have, but use his waist or abdominals to put the left fis/shoulder forward."

What I posed, there is no switching to a left hand lead, as they start that way.

If you tell trapped in which way(s) and collapsed how, I could appreciate that. With that I might be able to theorize the not-as-bad-as-you-think possibility or so.

Please note that the stance and posturing you talk about being open when shifting to a left-hand lead is Other than the stance/posturing I brought. If you think similarly for the stance I presented, then please say, and how.

If "T" type stance is their stance it can be kept with the weaker right leg forward while the stronger left arm leads. It's tighter than a same-sides lead. But functional and appropriate for the strength limbs of the friend in this situation, my say. I theorize some might say. If you or any note flaw in useability related to making the most of this persons strengths as listed, then please display. It builds or allows me to cross index my conceptualization database .

"Once in a while you can get away with it. But to make it your standard ... you're setting the odds against you before you even begin...... not to mention you lose the reach of leading with the "T"."

The tightness of the alter-stance I posed~Still leaves the user reach and "T" formation capable. Your jab reach seems hardly if at all altered. If you take your arm back ****er to power punch, that becomes more limited, but Power and launch Speed might Increase. Snakes coil to strike also.

The twistedness along the left side also acts as shielding. Something about a hit is reduced when it is received on a torqued flank.~ My think-ish.

[Pork Chop]

This issue came up for me as well.
I'm more natural in a southie stance.
I don't have any problems of not being able to throw with my left.
My left rear-leg kicks are my most powerful.
My left rear-arm punches are more balanced and at least as powerful as with my right.
As an orthodox I had a nice lead upper, which I may need to develop for the right, but my hook's better now.
My orthodox jab might've actually been better (fast, accurate, throw it for days); but as a southie, the jab becomes a lot more about the angle than being a jabbing machine crankin 'em out.
My right lead leg has a sweet leg kick, a nice side kick, and a passable head kick.

Buuuuuuuuut seein as how I may now be out of the game, all of this may mean jack anyway.
Leaving work in 3 hours to go get xrays.

[SevenStar]

what happened?

[Water Dragon]

Originally posted by SevenStar
what happened?

I haven't heard the whole story, but my understanding is that whatever happened, it involved Shaolin Tiger, a pink ballerina dress, roller baldes, and a bathtub full of lime jello.

[Pork Chop]

Originally posted by SevenStar
what happened?

I mighta broke something.
That's about as deep as I wanna go into it, sorry.

Not really a good time for me right now; to put it mildly.
Gotta go to court July 21- might lose my license.
Car broke down last week and ran about 300 (was almost going to be 500).
Just bought a ton of gear that now I can't really use.
Cranky cuz I can't sleep, which is really doing wonders for my budding relationship with the new gf. *sarcasm*
My folks ain't moving back to Texas afterall.
Work is overwhelming and entering the cr@ppy stage.
On top of it all I'm starting to get dangerously in debt.

However, there are a couple shiny lil glimmers of hope:
promotions come out in a week, next week I'm going to Denver for work, and the week after I'm going to Coacoa beach, florida also for work.

[Pork Chop]

Originally posted by Water Dragon


I haven't heard the whole story, but my understanding is that whatever happened, it involved Shaolin Tiger, a pink ballerina dress, roller baldes, and a bathtub full of lime jello.

You forgot the goat and the handfull of cheque drops...

[Water Dragon]

Speaking of strange, ****-erotic, East Coast fetishes, where the hell has Apowyn been lately anyway?

[Pork Chop]

Originally posted by Water Dragon
Speaking of strange, ****-erotic, East Coast fetishes, where the hell has Apowyn been lately anyway?

that question's addressed in his birthday thread.
frankly those southern MD/VA/DC folks have been very snobbish and I have not seen them since the first time we hung out. :p
*hoping they realize he's kidding, doesn't want to get KOed, tied up into a pretzle, AND beaten down with fillipino sticks*

[IronFist]

Originally posted by BMore Banga
cheque drops...

!!! :eek:

[Pork Chop]

Originally posted by IronFist
"cheque drops"

!!! :eek:

yah the goat took the cheque drops and f*cked my sh*t all up...

anyway, just got done having one of those confusing "managment talks" with one of my bosses; and eventho the list don't come out for a week, I'm pretty sure I just got passed over for the promotion...

and the hits just keep on comin

yesterday my new ringside heavy hitter gloves finally came in
i tried them on and they felt nice

the moment became bittersweet knowing that i can't use them

my ability to make sense of this world was taken from me

a good bag workout is one of the best forms of therapy bar-none

and now i can't

i'll be suprised if i survive this summer

[Akhilleus]

merry beat me to it. Have him fight with his power hand back. That gives him the power of his cross. Also, his front leg is his power leg, which can give him the potential for some wicked front leg kicks, which are a beautiful thing. his weak leg will have increased power from being placed in the rear.

No, no, no, no, no, NO! Where do I start? I disagree 100%...here's what he should do:


Have him fight with his weak hand back. That gives him the weakness of his cross. Also, his front leg is his weak leg, which can give him the potential for some harmless front leg kicks, which are a repulsive thing. his strong leg will have decreased power from being placed in the front.

OK what's my point:

there are no right or wrong answers here

or at least I don't know what they are...

[SevenStar]

you should take a class on learning how to illustrate a point.

anyway, commenting on what you said, by having his stronger leg in front, yes it will be weaker, but stronger than his weak leg. having his weak leg in the rear will add to it's power. he's balancing himself.

[Akhilleus]

OK <signs up for making a point 101>

Not aimed at you 7*, but everyone on here, I think the guy needs to find what works best for him, b/c whatever he does is going to have its pluses and minuses....personally, I fight with my strong leg (right) back, and would even if my left hand were my strong hand...I want to try to knock guys out with my right leg roundhouse...so there are tradeoffs...and I was kidding about all that other junk, I just thought it sounded kinda funny to tell him what to do for all the wrong reasons hahhahahahahahhahahahahaahaha :p

[Pork Chop]

Originally posted by Akhilleus
OK <signs up for making a point 101>

and I was kidding about all that other junk, I just thought it sounded kinda funny to tell him what to do for all the wrong reasons hahhahahahahahhahahahahaahaha :p

dude, you're a nut
lemme know if u wanna use my gear for however many weeks

x rays came back inconclusive.
but i'm still gonna be out a while

[Water Dragon]

Originally posted by Akhilleus
OK <signs up for making a point 101>

...and I was kidding about all that other junk, I just thought it sounded kinda funny to tell him what to do for all the wrong reasons hahhahahahahahhahahahahaahaha :p

hmmmm. the OG is strong with this one.

[fa_jing]

Teach him the step-up front kick from Wing Chun with the front leg, as well as a side kick while backing up. Then have him practice the rear roundhouse kick with his right leg. Always do some drills on both sides, and he should be able to decide.