OT: who here downloads music?

[stubbs]

do you pay for it or just nab it? what are cheapest paid for sites/programs? is it worth paying for them or do you just go for the 'free' ones?
________
Shemale young (http://www.****tube.com/categories/978/young/videos/1)

[Shaolinlueb]

i hear win mx is good for free stuff, but i wouldnt know.. but ipod and napster are legal.
this will rpobably get deleted though.

[Chang Style Novice]

I've had the best luck with soulseek, but it's a pc only client.

[Volcano Admim]

Course i download, all the cool kids download
besides, when does a brazilian ever gets punished for pirating? never hahahahaha
thats the beauty of it
Besides that, RECOGNIZE i am fighting against the big record companies
AND also downloading stuff i never find for sale here (Like for example, its not easy to find Tools stuff, i only have Lateralus original)

Well theres Soulseek, theres Kazaa (most best are the "lite" versions), WinMX
Theres Imesh
Theres Emule/Edonkey
Theres Shareaza (or is it Shareazza) that works with Gnutella servers and Emule type thang too

Mostly i been using LSD (Emule based) to download full albums on perfect quality (APE) or lower quality (MPC or MP3)
Its also great to get movies and all types of things
Though the downloads are quite slow with this, but its great still

[Tak]

The RIAA is watching this thread...

Actually there's a cross-platform implementation of a soulseek client as well. And E[choose your favorite beast of burden]. But bittorrent is the way of the future, imo.

Links:
http://azureus.sf.net/
http://nicotine.thegraveyard.org/
http://www.sensi.org/~ak/pyslsk/
http://www.edonkey2000.com/


Edit: BTW many Kazaa and Shareaza clients contain spyware. Or used to, I dunno if they still do. Good rule of thumb that applies to software: "Never trust anything that can think for itself if you can't see where it keeps its brain." --Arthur Weasley.

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

i was gonna say that if the discussion was kept to pay per download sites it would be fine, but its too late for that now.

that said i don't download much music anymore, but i do use botler pretty frequently.

[omarthefish]

Originally posted by Chang Style Novice
I've had the best luck with soulseek, but it's a pc only client.

Soulseek rocks.

It has been my musical savior in red China.

The internet radio built into itunes is pretty good too. They have itunes for windows too!!!

[Vash]

I used to download music, but right now Soundclick is trying to bend my pretty ass over the barrel.

Can't hear NONE of CPAs stuff now, and I can't get the rest of ST107s.

But no to the whole illegal download thingie.

[IronFist]

Kazaalite K++ - Blocks RIAA and is anonymous, and has all the spyware removed. You can get it at oldverion.com.

If you want to be legal about it, you can go to www.allofmp3.com. Click on "english" in the upper left corner. This is a Russian site that sells .mp3s for really cheap, like $0.03 per song, and they have a lot of stuff. I haven't used it, but I've heard from some people who have and they said it's good. I think this site is still up.

[omarthefish]

They can pass a law to make it illegal but they can't make it wrong. :D

Is it illegal to bring my CD's over to your place so you can rip them into your hard drive?

But it's illegal to do it over the net.

Does ANYONE support banning nabster etc. who isn't a big music studio or producer? I haven't even met a musician yet who was opposed to free music. The only artists supporting the legislation seem to be the ones with their own labels. :rolleyes:

Maybe I better watch out since there could be 'net police' out here profiling me and getting ready to turn me in to the mpaa or some similar organization.

Amazing....sharing has been outlawed.

Next legislative venture.....?

[Tak]

I agree totally.
What's the difference between downloading a song or recording it from the radio? What about recording from netradio? What's the difference between recording a movie from tv or downloading it? Hell, for that matter, what's the difference between giving a friend a copy of a movie and verbally describing it to him? (Thank you professional sports.)

[stubbs]

i think musicians should make their money just from tours and live events and the music should be freely available as a kinda advert/promotion.

"What's the difference between downloading a song or recording it from the radio? "

It's illegal to record off the radio too.

The record companies just need to lower the prices of CD's. They're too money hungry and they shouldn't complain about people downloading music when its their fault. When demand is high but supply is low or too costly then a black market emerges - in this case people downloading music.

I'd be willing to pay to download music if its cheap enough and I think it's something worth supporting.
________
MARIJUANA SEEDS (http://marijuanaseeds.org/)

[Tak]

Can you cite me a law for that? Not being contentious, I really want to read it.

I agree that lowering music prices would solve a lot of the "piracy" problems for them. Even the legal download things where you pay $1 or $2 a song are too much - that comes out to like $50/cd!

The real problem, though, is the attempt to enforce rights on intellectual property when there's no such thing. That's why there are so many contradictions and gray areas - because everyone's trying to control and legislate the transfer of something that doesn't really exist.
Did Mozart or Beethoven ***** about copyrights? Hell no, anyone who wanted to play their music could do so. They didn't live off sales of sheet music - they lived on commissions for new work.

For a laugh:
http://radio.about.com/library/weekly/aa082603a.htm

[stubbs]

Mozart or Beethoven didn't have to worry about CD burners or the internet ;)

I'm trying to find info about copying from the radio. From what I can find so far its ok in the US but you can only record off the radio when in the UK if you have a license or an agreement (eg universities have an agreement where students can record for educational purposes). I can't find a clear cut description about the law though. Maybe I was wrong and it was just a mythical fact - I'll keep looking though. The only thing I've found at the moment is this site which calls it 'bootleg'

http://www.ritchie-hardin.com/soul/bootlegs.html
________
DAIHATSU NAKED SPECIFICATIONS (http://www.toyota-wiki.com/wiki/Daihatsu_Naked)

[Chang Style Novice]

My favorite part of this whole debate is that the music companies are owned by the same corporations that sell the burners and blank discs. They want to sell you the equipment to burn discs, but they don't want you to use 'em!

Hilarious.

The key to the question being debated here is what comprises "fair-use." When that gets definitively answered (hint - it never will) the question will resolve itself.

[IronFist]

Lots of musicians don't want to do tours or live shows. So should they be denied profit for their work?

CD prices need to be lowered. Paying $18 for 10 songs is rediculous. If cds were $5 each I would buy a lot more.

[MasterKiller]

The average musician gets 1 or 2 points out of a 10 point scale for each CD sold. So, if something costs $20, the musician gets $2, max. The record companies get the rest. On top of that, the musician is charged for all expenses related to recording/producing the album, and for promotional expenditures. They even have to pay for their own tours.

Music companies just need to quit being so god**** greedy.

[Tak]

Originally posted by IronFist
Lots of musicians don't want to do tours or live shows. So should they be denied profit for their work?
If they don't do tours or live shows, wtf is this work they're doing?

[SanSoo Student]

Getting high, pimping their hoes, and getting new rims. O wait...thats only what rappers do.

[Kristoffer]

Do a search for DC (Direct Connect) .. this is hooked on all europe, all asia and all US. You can get anything, anythime

[MasterKiller]

Originally posted by Tak
If they don't do tours or live shows, wtf is this work they're doing? Besides writing the music and spending months in a studio recording it? You mean other than that?

Sorry, I just know what it feels like to get paid in royalties, so I can sympathize with real musicians who write and produce their own stuff.

[omarthefish]

EVEN IF you exclude musicians with their own labels....

The only musicians who stand to lose from the .mp3 revolution are the ones who have 'made it' well enough that they aren't really effected anyways. . . not personally.

Who in the world makes a living off of royalties? Does ANYONE out here do it or even know someone who does? The musicians at the bottom (economically) play gigs, burn their own CD's and sell them personally or pass them around and what they need and usually WANT more than anything else is to get more people to hear their music.

I'm still waiting to meet the musician who is opposed to free music.

The VAST majority of the many GIGs of ripped CD's I have enjoyed have been contributed by musicians. Their usually the ones so addicited to new music that they used to spend 75% of their discposable income on CD's/vinyl untill hard drives got big enough and compression software good enough that it was no longer necessary to have an upper middle class income to support their habit.

"Suppor the artists! Pay for CD's!"

What a load of ****.

[Volcano Admim]

MK, in here its even less
for every cd, the avereage artist gets R$0.36
Big artists may get R$1
Now... of course those 36 cent are to be split... between the 3, 4, 5... or whatever number of dudes in the band
So you peeps do the math

As a fact, they do survive on making cocerts and touring

I agree that the prices of cds need to drop, it too way expensive

[Volcano Admim]

Let me add

as for the royalties
the artists here rarely recive it like they should
the radios rarely pay, for example...
cos there is just no control of how many times thing
get played and where and by who
song writers will make very few unless they are write for really really huge bands/groups/singers
and i mean huge huge huge hugefied

[omarthefish]

THAT was my point.

And the musicians know it too.

More people get to hear them though nabster and that sort of thing = more people get into their music = more gigs.

[Kristoffer]

http://dcplusplus.sourceforge.net/

[IronFist]

Originally posted by Tak
If they don't do tours or live shows, wtf is this work they're doing?

What about people who compose music for movies? Should they not get paid? Not many people would go to a concert of soundtrack music. What about people who do techno? They don't have techno concerts, do they?

[Kristoffer]

sure they do, but they just suck really really hard

[Volcano Admim]

Originally posted by IronFist
What about people who compose music for movies? Should they not get paid? Not many people would go to a concert of soundtrack music. What about people who do techno? They don't have techno concerts, do they?

i dunno about the movie guys...

lets fight the film industry!!! YEAHHHH!!!
YEAAAAH!

the eletronic guys
they do have concerts, though not most of em
and the djs do get some good money playing in
several houses and stuff
the most famous brazilian djs get good money
playing in europe for example
i dont think they do any worse than the "organic" music people

[omarthefish]

Originally posted by IronFist
What about people who compose music for movies? Should they not get paid? Not many people would go to a concert of soundtrack music. What about people who do techno? They don't have techno concerts, do they?

People who compose music for movies get paid well for their work by the production company. They are commisioned to compose the music. And VERY few people are trading the latest mp3 from the Spiderman soundtrack. Is John Williams hurting for cash?

DJ's are the BIGGEST SUPPORTERS OF ALL of free music. It was an LA DJ who turned me on to my current peer to peer software. The best **** sources of free music are DJ's. They need the raw materials to create their stuff.

And no silly, they don't do concerts, they play clubs. DJ's make their very nominal income from doing gigs. Most have day jobs. They don't cut albums. They MIX other peoples stuff. Turn your brain on for a minute.

[MasterKiller]

Originally posted by omarthefish
"Suppor the artists! Pay for CD's!"

What a load of ****. Artists have a right to make money off of material they produce, whether it's music, books, movies, or quilts.

If someone wants to read my books, I should get paid for it, either by the library who lends them to the general public, or by the consumer. If people were passing out millions of illegal copies of my books for free, I would be in court pretty fast to protect my copyrights.

Record companies gouge consumers, but artists themselves are not responsible for that. Like I said, most musicians get only 1 or 2 points of off any record deal.

I get sick of people whining about Metallica trying to protect their copyrights. It's their material. They own it. They spent years practicing, touring, and playing to put it together. If you want to listen to it, pay for it.

Whether or not you have a love for the "purity" of the medium, as an artist, you own the intellectual property you produce and deserve compensation for your efforts.

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

Originally posted by IronFist
What about people who do techno? They don't have techno concerts, do they?

i thought those were called raves.

they're filled with ***gots dropping e.

[stubbs]

even though they're getting a small slice, most of them are still earning more in a year than what i'll probably earn in the next 15 years. then they go and rub it in our faces by showing it off on MTV Cribs!! :p

can these paid download sites undercut the record industry? i mean, can the artists just stick their material straight on the site for everyone to pay to download? how do the record labels get involved when it comes to legal download sites?
________
Vaporizer store (http://www.vaporshop.com/)

[rubthebuddha]

can the artists just stick their material straight on the site for everyone to pay to download?yes, but that would put many of the fine executives at virgin records, sony, etc. out of jobs, and that would simply be horrible.

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

cribs. that's all that really needs said.

[Kristoffer]

cribs is bull****
most of that is just the record company who rent that place, stick alotta fancy **** innit n the artists pretends he owns it just so it goes well with the illusion that they is rich, like they videos want us to beleive. of corse some are real, an really filthy rich

[Volcano Admim]

"Kinda like the way you're breathing
I kinda like the way you keep looking away
Would you like to glide on
Slide a mile six inches at a time on
Maynard's diiick
Maynard's diiiiiiiiiick
Maynard's diiiiiiiiiiiiiick"

[Tak]

Intellectual property is a myth.

[MasterKiller]

Originally posted by Tak
Intellectual property is a myth. But copyrights aren't.;)

[AmanuJRY]

Originally posted by MasterKiller
The average musician gets 1 or 2 points out of a 10 point scale for each CD sold. So, if something costs $20, the musician gets $2, max. The record companies get the rest. On top of that, the musician is charged for all expenses related to recording/producing the album, and for promotional expenditures. They even have to pay for their own tours.

Music companies just need to quit being so god**** greedy.

Agreed. But still it doesn't make me feel any better, think how much the company is making if the star is rollin' in $80k+ cars, bling bling, and a healthy drug habit. They may have to pay their way, but if they are spending like that, they are still making plenty, even on $1/cd.

Don't believe it??? Just watch MTV's 'Cribs'.

[Volcano Admim]

You guys when you say the Download VS Buy
You is forgetting

Downloads are not the main issue

I mean
The issue is PIRATED COPY OF CDS
Dudes makes copys and sell them on public markets for like $5 the cd (affordable price), so lots of people buy - a lot of people who otherwise no way could pay $25 or $30 for the original copy.
And they say this pirate copys market is 2/3 of all total sales while original copys sales is 1/3 of all the market or cds
And that is the big bussiness issue
That what pizzes the record industry lots
The downloads dont not even half the bussness damage that of the pirate copys do
I mean, a very small part of the population (in here at least) have access to computers and internet - so the downloads dont represent much at all
You see what im saying
Well, maybe in USA the downloads matter, since yall all of u have puters and net, but on the rest of da big world, its a low percent of people who have the technology avalible